css9450
Veteran
For what its worth, the official policy of Simon-owned malls (there are a lot of them where I live) reads as follows:
"No photographs or video recordings of any kind for commercial use. Video is acceptable for non-commercial and non-disruptive purposes."
"No photographs or video recordings of any kind for commercial use. Video is acceptable for non-commercial and non-disruptive purposes."
olifaunt
Well-known
In all of these situations except the mall it sounds like you were doing something completely legal (in U.S. law) and their orders for you to leave were actually a violation of your civil rights.
willie_901
Veteran
This applies. Unless there is signage, photograph until a mall employee tells you to stop. By the way, they can not take your camera nor touch you. If you refuse to stop, they can – and will – call the police and have you arrested for trespassing. In rare cases they can permanently ban you. This also applies to outdoor areas that are technically private property.
I read a hearsay where a restaurant in mall permitted photography in their dining area. Supposedly this was after mall security told the photographer to stop outside of the restaurant.
Pherdinand
the snow must go on
what's a "mall"?
css9450
Veteran
Some malls don't really have any security at all...
View Range
Well-known
I was stopped taking pictures of the architecture inside the Getty museum in Los Angeles. The guard politely explained that they feared the visible security equipment would be compromised by details in the images. They had no problem with me taking as many pictures as I wanted outside or of the artwork inside.
olifaunt
Well-known
What? Did they really think infinite recursion of images within images would cause the security cameras to explode?
Huss
Veteran
he told me if i wanted to take pics to use my phone. did u miss that part?
markjwyatt
Well-known
Probably because people are doing things like this (Getty Village entrance). The funny thing is I did not intend to capture the camera. I just found the vine (color, layout) intriguing so made the shot. As I post-processed it I discovered the camera (which they tried to hide with the intriguing vine).
Vine On Wall by Mark Wyatt, on Flickr
robert blu
quiet photographer
It's a camera, not a gun!
But I cannot understand why very oft it is allowed to take pictures with a phone and not with a camera...which logic?
robert
But I cannot understand why very oft it is allowed to take pictures with a phone and not with a camera...which logic?
robert
markjwyatt
Well-known
Huss
Veteran
Of course many respondents here have missed the point that the security guard told me it was ok to take pics with my iphone...
css9450
Veteran
With a thread title "Harrassed by security guard...", I think most people are going to figure that's the main point, not the phone thing.
peterm1
Veteran
Although some other folks here got bent out of shape at the idea of being "pushed about" (and I have to admit that if the security guy was all officious and pompous that would be an issue for me too) I indicated that my preference is to do what you have said Kuuan - not be confrontational whenever possible.
I see this approach as not being one of weakly giving in to unreasonable officialdom. But rather I see it as using my Emotional Intelligence to try to manipulate the guy into doing what I want and getting what I want out of the encounter if possible.
In any event it is not a bad first approach to try remembering that most people in those jobs are more than likely just poorly trained, poorly paid working stiffs who are afraid of losing their jobs and are doing what they are doing because they think it is expected of them. If approached in the right way they may be willing to be more reasonable - but if approached confrontationally they are more likely to "dig their heels in". At least I find this approach works more often than not here in Australia where the culture is somewhat laid back. It might not work quite so well in USA where there seems to be a more confrontational culture between men, or in Europe where in some countries "rules MUST be followed" no matter how dumb those rules are in the specific circumstances. For example such rules may have been devised to following incidents where sleazy guys have tried to photograph up women's skirts on escalators etc and the mall owners find it easier to implement a blanket ban on photography. Though if this is so, I have to admit it boggles my mind that the same malls have exceptions for iphone photography.
KenR
Well-known
Know the rules
Know the rules
I once tried to use a tripod in Rockefeller Center in NYC and was told by the security guard who magically appeared that tripods are forbidden on their property. Knowing that they don't control the public sidewalk, I politely asked where their property ends and where the public sidewalk began. He pointed to a marker on the ground - I moved my setup a few feet over the imaginary line and took a few shots. He stood there watching me, so I smiled and thanked him as I left. So-so shot.
Know the rules
I once tried to use a tripod in Rockefeller Center in NYC and was told by the security guard who magically appeared that tripods are forbidden on their property. Knowing that they don't control the public sidewalk, I politely asked where their property ends and where the public sidewalk began. He pointed to a marker on the ground - I moved my setup a few feet over the imaginary line and took a few shots. He stood there watching me, so I smiled and thanked him as I left. So-so shot.
Richard G
Veteran
Exactly. Thanks.
Richard G
Veteran
There is an illogicality there but that is seldom the point in these situations. In a way the smartphone may end up being the get out of jail free card, hopefully not literally, for us more serious photographers.
But I once had the whole of the shaded wading pool at the municipal pool to myself and my two children. I had my Coolpix, and my Leicina Super 8 loaded with Kodachrome. A nice young man came over and told me that I could not film or take photographs unless every person in shot gave their written permission. I told him that's fair, but the only people in shot will be my two children, for whom I am the legal guardian, equal with my wife, not present. Still he insisted, the rules are the rules. So I signed the forms on behalf of my two children and made a very nice little movie.
PRJ
Another Day in Paradise
Me being the smartass that I am, I would have whipped out my IPhone and started taking pictures through the eyepiece of my camera. That probably would have annoyed him....
Brian Atherton
Well-known
I have experienced similar issues here, in my home, London. Sometimes the security staff are borderline psychopaths, aggressive and obnoxious, sometimes they are decent and friendly, and one can have a conversation with them.
The issue, increasingly in London (and other cities and towns in the UK), is the privatisation of previously public spaces, often without any consultation prior to the redevelopment. Many areas one would assume are still public, have been bought and extensively remodelled, becoming privately owned space while allowing the public access ‘at the owner’s discretion’ and under the owner's rules, which invariably don’t allow photography.
Also, often I am amazed that people object to the use of a ‘proper’ camera but take no notice of someone using a mobile phone; it’s almost as if the mobile phone has become invisible.
The issue, increasingly in London (and other cities and towns in the UK), is the privatisation of previously public spaces, often without any consultation prior to the redevelopment. Many areas one would assume are still public, have been bought and extensively remodelled, becoming privately owned space while allowing the public access ‘at the owner’s discretion’ and under the owner's rules, which invariably don’t allow photography.
Also, often I am amazed that people object to the use of a ‘proper’ camera but take no notice of someone using a mobile phone; it’s almost as if the mobile phone has become invisible.
Dan Daniel
Well-known
I've been finding that carrying acamera in hand, rather than on a strap around my neck, leads to much less attention. And if you can get over using a viewfinder, so much the better.
