Harvey Defender 777

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I ordered a pack of this developer
from photoformulary.com,
a lot of history on this developer.

has anyone tried this version from Photorgapher's Formulary ?

thanks

raytoei
 
I was just looking around a few weeks ago to see if anywhere still sold this, and all I found instead were recipes. If anything, thanks for the link!
 
I am still using my last 1/2 gallon of the 777 from Bluegrass. At about 1 ounce of replenisher for each roll, I guess I can still get through quite a few rolls. But I have some of the Formulary 777 in my cabinet, will mix and try it as soon as the Bluegrass stuff is gone.

Let us know if you like the Formulary version, I'd be interested in your thoughts on it.

Are you going to replenish, or use it one shot?
 
Interested to see how well you like the Formulary version. I've been trying to get some from Bluegrass for over a year with no luck.
 
Apparently its not the same 777. APUG has a discussion that goes way back. Everyone is waiting for the next batch of 777.
 
I am still using my last 1/2 gallon of the 777 from Bluegrass. At about 1 ounce of replenisher for each roll, I guess I can still get through quite a few rolls. But I have some of the Formulary 777 in my cabinet, will mix and try it as soon as the Bluegrass stuff is gone.

Let us know if you like the Formulary version, I'd be interested in your thoughts on it.

Are you going to replenish, or use it one shot?

Do you have any frames developed recently in the 777 (Bluegrass)?

BTW, you have a most interesting website.. Amazing...
 
well my 2 boxes of harvey 777 arrived today.
i quickly mixed 700ml of water at the stated 125F (51C)
with the 4 chemicals, Metol, Sodium sulfite,
Paraphenylene Diamine and Glycin...

and then i added the the last 300ml of water and mixed it together.
At first there was a lot of residue and floating white bits, i stirred
until everything was dissolved (to my eye).

the liquid was a light brown color, a bit like very diluted apple juice.

at around 42C, i was contemplating whether to try my luck at
development or not...afterall 777 was labelled Panthermic,
ie, little or no effect of temp to the development.

i has a roll of Neopan 100SS and Fomapan 400 (exposed at 200).
I decided that i would try my luck at 7mins at 42C (!), since this was the
first roll, i expected the solution to be "unripen".

i did a one minute agitation, and 5 agitation every minute thereafter.
water bath, fix, wash.....

the negatives are drying in the open, subject to the dusty confines of my room.
from my eye, the negatives look very dense, ie. overdeveloped,
especially the neopan 100ss, the fomapan looked overdeveloped
but i could still see shadows.

will scan and post some pictures in a couple of hours.

raytoei

777-a.jpg
 
Apparently there are limits to "panthermic". ;)

As for one-shot, I thought one of 777's charms was how it ripened. I've often thought about setting up a 777 tank line for 4x5. Once the darkroom in my new house is constructed, I will again give that serious consideration.
 
Apparently there are limits to "panthermic". ;)

As for one-shot, I thought one of 777's charms was how it ripened. I've often thought about setting up a 777 tank line for 4x5. Once the darkroom in my new house is constructed, I will again give that serious consideration.

Let us know if you do it. The whole secret mystic around 777 makes it interesting. The make believes like Edwal 12 and Germain's formula are not the same from what I've read (only similar, maybe). Therefore, the mystery is even deeper.
 
okay....

a couple of observations first.

i had a hardtime scanning the negatives, as the v700 scanner
could not determine the framesize. i had to scan strips and
then use PS to cut and paste individual frames.
I am not sure if this is due to the developer as the film looked
like it was stained wth a brown tan OR it was because my
recently acquired Pentax MX with 50/f1.7 is acting up.

42C and 7 mins is way too long for the negatives. This resulted
in the fomapan 400 having grains which were, in my eyes, too
big. The Neopan 100ss, which is like Plus-x had slightly better
grains.

this experiment is too short to jump to any conclusions because
I shot using shallow dof so the resultant blur could be
exaggerated by grains. Nevertheless, I poured the solution back
into the 1lite container (with the 400ml remaining) and I will
continue to use the same solution to develop more and take
notes further. I will probably try 30c (the tap water temp)
and 10mins tomorrow when i try out a couple of film
to develop.

all images were adjusted for contrast, brightness, i also
used Exposure 4 to play with mid-tone, highlights
and shadows.

777-b.jpg

Fomapan 400

777-c.jpg

Neopan 100SS

777-d.jpg

Neopan 100SS

777-e.jpg

Neopan 100SS

A note about grains, my agitation is actually quite slow
so the grain size is probably due to high temp development.

raytoei
 
today i developed another 2 more rolls of fomapan 400
one at ei of 400 and the other at ei of 200.
i timed it at 10mins at my room temp which is 30c.

observation: negatives are over developed at ei 400
and very developed at ei 200 (could be very exposed as well
as i was shooting the summarit 1.5 wide open).

The negatives still looked stained but the issue of the scanner not able to recognize the frame spacing is gone, even though i am using the same
camera for one of the rolls as previously.

i prefer the grain structure here compared to fomapan with rodinal.
the grains are still huge as it is developed at higher temp (30c here).

here are some samples, taken in the past 24hours:

Pentax MX, ei 400

777-f.jpg



777-g.jpg


777-h.jpg


here is one which was exposed at ei of 200 or ei of 100,
Summarit 1.5 with the M4

777-i.jpg
 
after about 10 rolls,
i dumped my 2 litres of 777, and
i will be switching to another developer.

the negatives are gorgeous, i found the
chemical to be very incompatible in my
small confined bathroom. it stains, and it
is noxious.

so long 777, here are some pictures i
developed last week. all taken on the m4
with summarit 1.5.

all taken on fomapan 400, developed at 7mins
with ei of 200.

raytoei
 

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Edwal 10 you have to mix by yourself. Curiously I have different formula:
Water 700ml
Metol 5 grams
Sulfite 100 grams
Borax 10 grams
Glycin 5 grams
Water, to 1 liter
Ref: http://www.subclub.org/darkroom/develop2.htm
but I found that in more places.

Regarding your bout with 777, 1 liter of it is not enough to work with, at least a gallon. 10 rolls is just getting the formula ripe, 777 is not a D76, ready to use right after mixing. You will hit the same problem with Edwal 10. Mix two liters, one keep as replenisher, the other ripe with a few rolls without replenishing. I don't know, what will be the advice of others, but my time for DXN shot at ISO 250 was 8 min at 20 C with normal agitation so I would try TX (ISO 400) around 8,5-9 min. I was replenishing with 25 ml after each development, however I am using short film - 18 frames max.
What really bugs me with that formula is that borax is too weak to activate glycin, so, how this work ?
 
i'd like to bump this thread as i'm again becoming curious about this strange developer. earlier, i was looking for a one shot fine-grain developer, but i never considered the alternate option -- a developer that gets better the more you use and re-use it. i love d-76 but i prefer rodinal and i don't use the old d-76 enough. i also really like shooting with a point-and-shoot for fun/unimportant pictures that other people can take without having to know how to focus or expose correctly. i'm considering buying some 777 and "ripening" the working solution with these point-and-shoot images, and then use it for more "serious" work once it gets there.

i generally shoot tri-x and hp5, and the longer i shoot the more i want to have longer tonal range. i shoot portraits and have become interested in fashion as well, and i feel like this developer could make already pretty girls look pearly and amazing, and the people with character's character could stand out more. i dunno.

in the article from unblinking eye they suggest using a developer other than dektol to print with it -- i wonder what would be better? i'll be out of dektol soon and if there's a developer with longer tonality i'd like to get that next instead.
 
I seriously doubt that Formulary have the recipe Harveys Panthermic 777.
Bluegrass does have the old original recipe but i have heard that they don't mix it anymore which is a real shame as it is a great developer and it last almost forever.
I hope enough requests will make them rethink making it. Luckily i have several 1 gallon packages to last for many years to come.

I run a 1 gallon jug which is full to the brim and i top it off after every session to keep it full.
The replenisher is kept in a glass jar in which i pump argon (Wine saver) every time it is opened.

A good paper developer with almost identical long term storage capabilities is the Ansco 130, it also last for a very long time and it produce a very nice warm tone on all warm tone papers. A perfect fit for Ilfords WT paper.
 
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