Has Leica alienated photographers?

[CMur12]

Has Porsche alienated drivers? If you can't answer that question, "yes," then you really have no basis to say that Leica has alienated photographers.

Dante

Of course, the answer to that would be "yes and no." Porsche caused much wailing and gnashing of teeth when they went to water-cooled engines. They have also created a commotion with the adoption of electrical-assist power steering and turbo-charged engines for their mainstream models. I'm sure there is a bit of outrage over the demotion from six- to four-cylinder engines (the latter turbo-charged) for the Boxter and the Cayman, as well.

With each major change, there may be a slight shift in the demographic that will buy the product. Yet, they are still superb cars, new models carry meaningful refinements, and they will continue to sell. It is probably much the same for Leica.

- Murray

PS. I would dearly love to own a Porsche, but the purchase would be well beyond my means.

 

[rogue_designer]

The parallel doesn't quite work, at least not if we are talking about professionals. Professional photographers, with very few exceptions, no longer use Leica for their bread and butter - some of that is cost, some of that is features, some of that is lack of emphasis and engagement of pros by the company. In this respect, Porsche is different than Leica. They have multiple racing teams, they recruit drivers (not celebs) to be their spokes people, and to drive for them. Porsche is more like Canon/Nikon in this arena (how they treat their professional photographers).

The same demographic of people who buy a new Porsche, are those who buy a new Leica. People who drive (and photograph) for fun, and have lots of disposable income. Largely, that means not pros. But at least Porsche still makes the professional driver a part of their ongoing effort.

 

[fireblade]

Marketing luxury items, do not pander to your customers wishes.
Luxury brands is to create dreams, be it fashion, cars, electronics, etc, not to answer to problems and needs of the buyer. Dominate the client.
You like our Leica product, buy it.
You don't like our Leica product, go buy something else.

 

[giganova]

Has Porsche alienated drivers? If you can't answer that question, "yes," then you really have no basis to say that Leica has alienated photographers.

Dante

Well, Porsche has certainly alienated drivers when they switched from 6 cylinder to 4 cylinder engines for the Boxter/Cayman this year.

 

[Godfrey]

I don't agree with any of the poll choices so I won't vote.

But no, Leica has not alienated photographers. Their M line is excellent, as is the S line, the Q and X, and the SL. Their lenses remain the standard of the industry. The SL in particular is the best camera I've ever owned, and I've owned a lot of high end cameras. Photographers who want Leica quality lenses are pleased to buy them.

They're just expensive. So what? A lot of things are expensive. Buy something less expensive if you can't deal with the prices.

G

 

[jsrockit]

They're just expensive. So what? A lot of things are expensive. Buy something less expensive if you can't deal with the prices.

I agree with you somewhat but can't price be alienating? Alienating can mean that Leica's prices are not friendly to the average photographer. Now, I would argue that they always have been... but those who want one figure out how to own one.

 

[Emile de Leon]

Repair times ...too looooogggg...

 

[airfrogusmc]

I agree with you somewhat but can't price be alienating? Alienating can mean that Leica's prices are not friendly to the average photographer. Now, I would argue that they always have been... but those who want one figure out how to own one.

Leica has always been expensive.

 

[Godfrey]

I agree with you somewhat but can't price be alienating? Alienating can mean that Leica's prices are not friendly to the average photographer. Now, I would argue that they always have been... but those who want one figure out how to own one.

Leica has always been expensive.

+1, airfrogusmc. Exactly.

For example, I had wanted a Leica SLR for decades but couldn't afford one because of the lens prices. That didn't "alienate" me, it just meant I couldn't buy it until I could afford the prices.

To alienate means to cause someone to become estranged or unsympathetic, hostile. I had no hostility towards Leica and never felt estranged ... It was my income and priorities that determined why I couldn't buy that camera. That's no fault of Leica's: they just make what they make and price it so that they can make a profit. If that price is high, well, so it is. There's no intent to cause me pain in that.

As soon as I saw that R system lenses were available at prices I could afford, I bought the ones I wanted along with a body to use them with. They are as excellent as I always expected they were, so it was worth the wait and, ultimately, the money.

G

 

[Emile de Leon]

Leica...the millionaires camera..!
I mean...***!!...if you want a good compliment of their finest lenses brand spankin new....maybe 10 to 20 of them..and a few bodies as any pro would..well...
No need being alienated by that...
I guess..

 

[jsrockit]

Leica has always been expensive.

And I said that in the statement you quoted.

 

[sojournerphoto]

Leica...the millionaires camera..!
I mean...***!!...if you want a good compliment of their finest lenses brand spankin new....maybe 10 to 20 of them..and a few bodies as any pro would..well...
No need being alienated by that...
I guess..

It's just what it is. No need to worry about it or for anyone to get upset. None of us deserve a Leica (or substitute any other unnecessary good), it's just that some people that want one are fortunate enough to be able to afford them. Others aren't. Surely it's of more import that some people, even in the UK, don't have the ability to buy sufficient food for themselves and their children?

 

[thompsonks]

It's not the expense for me, it's the truly awful customer service from Leica NJ: 2 repairs in a row that took 4+ months. And three other lenses/bodies that needed warranty work for poor QC. :bang:

Kirk

 

[biginovero]

Well, my opinion is that german workers, when specialized, are costly. If you want their level of expertise and care you must take into account this fact.

Back in the eighties when I bought my first contax glass, all came with a nice zpruf ceriticate, a proof certificate with three or four signatures by german controllers.

I doubt Zeiss now would do the same, in effect totally made in germany zeiss lenses are still expensive today with regard to their japan made counterparts.

Leica produces in Germany, one of the richer countries in Eu.

German specialist must be paid according to German standards and social customs.

 

[Emile de Leon]

I think I'm going to try to get my hands on a fast asph WA..a 1.4 21mm or 24mm..
But even though the price is hideous..what can you do...
And no..I'm not alienated..I just don't buy Leica gear new anymore...let the other guy take the big hit..

 

[noisycheese]

It's just what it is. No need to worry about it or for anyone to get upset. None of us deserve a Leica (or substitute any other unnecessary good), it's just that some people that want one are fortunate enough to be able to afford them. Others aren't. Surely it's of more import that some people, even in the UK, don't have the ability to buy sufficient food for themselves and their children?

100% true. When it comes to material goods, a person deserves what he/she can pay for - nothing more.

The problem is that photographers are like any other demographic group in our current culture: A fairly sizable percentage of them are self-absorbed, spoiled, demanding, self-entitled spoiled brats who want what they want and they want it NOW with no effort or sacrifice on their part to get it - and there is where the problem lies.

 

[borge]

Well, my opinion is that german workers, when specialized, are costly. If you want their level of expertise and care you must take into account this fact.

Back in the eighties when I bought my first contax glass, all came with a nice zpruf ceriticate, a proof certificate with three or four signatures by german controllers.

I doubt Zeiss now would do the same, in effect totally made in germany zeiss lenses are still expensive today with regard to their japan made counterparts.

Leica produces in Germany, one of the richer countries in Eu.

German specialist must be paid according to German standards and social customs.

Leica's aren't MADE in Germany any longer. They're MADE in Portugal with parts sourced from all over the world. And the final assembly, QC and packaging are done in Germany.

 

[Godfrey]

Leica's aren't MADE in Germany any longer. They're MADE in Portugal with parts sourced from all over the world. And the final assembly, QC and packaging are done in Germany.

Some Leicas are made in Wetzlar today, in their brand new factory there ...
http://untappedcities.com/2014/06/0...he-new-leica-camera-factory-and-headquarters/

But it's certainly true, and has been for many years, that Leica sources parts and subassemblies from all over the world, like any other major manufacturer.

G

 

[pepeguitarra]

Not quite yet!

Not quite yet!

I do not mind the prices, but I do want good quality. For example, one of the best cameras I ever had is the M9, and the sensor problem came. Leica replaced the sensor already at no additional cost. However, I am always on the look to see if the sensor has gone bad (I got as replacement one of the old ones, so it is still subject to deterioration.) I hope if it does go bad in couple of years, they still change it. Again, I think the prices have been consistent throughout their history (expensive, but good quality).

 

[c.poulton]

I could not and still can't afford to buy any Leica camera or lens new, however I can just afford to buy 2nd hand. So far my available price range lies in the region of Leica rangefinders and lenses older than 1960. Ten years ago I could only afford anything older than 1950, so Using the same logic, I'll be 106 before I can purchase an M 240! 🙂