Hexar RF or M7

[amateriat]

After eight years and a few hundred rolls of film, I like my Hexars a whole lot. On the practical side, I was able to assemble a two-body, three-lens system (all bought brand-new, for the record), for roughly the price of a single M7 and one lens (no ASPH glass, either). On the more esoteric side, one can nit-pick and tick off the list of pros and cons regarding each (and I happen to like the M7), but the Hex got me where I wanted to go sooner, and I'm still going places with it. Barring irreparable malfunction/damage, I'll probably give them up when I feel compelled to give up film altogether.


- Barrett

 

[Doug]

I should emphasize that my HRF problems are not the fault of the camera, but rather the repair shop. I dropped the camera taking it out of the safe, and a bottom corner picked up a dent from the safe's steel door opening, knocking the RF out of whack. The shop fixed that problem very nicely, even doing some body work on the dent, but introduced a new problem with film handling that sent it back 7 more times. No fault of the camera, that seems finally to have been fixed now and I'm delighted to have a favored camera in use again.

Indeed, during the black Hexar's one-year medical leave, I felt lonely and picked up a titanium finish RF Limited body from Matsuiya to fill the absence. 🙂

The repair issue may be the HRF's nemesis... Otherwise I like its design features, and it is a fast-operating superior rig.

 

[ReneSpudvilas]

I am trying to decide whether to try a Hexar right now, too.
I have plenty of bodies available to me at the local shops here in Osaka,
just concerned about using 50 1.1/2/4/5 with that .6x mag.
I cannot extend to a M7.... I think the ZI is the only body suited to me.
I just cannot get that 1/4000 shutter out of my mind.... dof in daylight 🙂

 

[Krosya]

I use Hexanon 50/1.2, Nokton 50/1.5, Nikkor 50/1.4, CV 35/1.2 with my Hexars without any problems.

 

[ReneSpudvilas]

Krosya, thanks for that comment...I think it is just something I will have to try.... I cannot imagine getting predictable results from my r4m with very thin dof, being .52.......

 

[Ernst Leitz]

The Hexar is very pleasant to use (rubber, motor). However, the RF is not on par with Leica's (shutter speed readout is weak). Hence my preference for the M7.

 

[ernstk]

I can't believe that people keep blathering Ikon or MP etc ... the OP made his question perfectly clear ... it's a poll for gawd's sake not a discussion on what may be the best rangefinder for you.

If you don't want to vote for either option just go away! 😀 😀 😀...

Couldn't agree more. It was a simple question.
Ernst

 

[regular]

3 points which were not discussed yet :

- weight : the M7 is much (MUCH) heavier than an HRF.

- TTL : the M7 supports TTL flash. The HRF does not.

- leatherette : the M7's leather goes off easely, especially on the backdoor and on the battery cover. the HRF's leather is more robust.

edit : 4/ on the HRF, there is a little transparent frame that shows the film roll you are using. Neat.

 

[cookedart]

On the other hand, that motor and its accurate registering made it possible to do a mid-roll swap and advance to anywhere on another film.. This is so mind boggling convenient that I'll still give the vote to the HRF..

Am I right to understand that you can shoot half a roll, rewind the film, swap with another roll, and go back to that roll later on?

How is this possible?

 

[Arjay]

Am I right to understand that you can shoot half a roll, rewind the film, swap with another roll, and go back to that roll later on?

How is this possible?

The HRF as a film autoloading function that is very precise. When doing a mid-roll change, you place the film leader in a defined location with an accuracy of +/- 1mm. Then you release the shutter (with lens cap on) to the counter number where you last unloaded the film. The camera's very precise film advance mechanism does the rest. Works like a charm.

 

[mfunnell]

My favourite cameras (plural) are my Hexar RFs. I have two because I can't stand the thought of being without one. Should one break my "maintenance" plan is to buy a replacement. While continuing to use the one that isn't broken.

I like the VF magnification, and the framelines. I can (and frequently have) focussed a Summilux 75/1.4 dead accurately with both mine. While that takes a little more care than my M3, it is certainly possible. I've never had an M7 (and possibly never will) but my M3 is my comparison point between my Hexar RFs and Leica RFs. Sure the Hexar RF's viewfinder is a little dimmer, and has a slightly different (and perhaps not as "good") RF patch - but not enough to even slightly bother me.

I personally find that the conveniences of the film handling with my Hexar RFs (and my autofocus Hexar, for that matter) are very helpful when doing any kind of high(ish) volume photography. I like how solid and reliable my Hexars have been. (I also fear breakage, because of the stories I've heard, but I think I'm covered for that.) I like the metering pattern of the aperture priority mode on the Hexar RF, but I'm sure the M7 would be just fine too. I suspect I'd be as annoyed about the "wrong way" shutter speed dial on the M7 as I was by the "thumb not forefinger" dial on the Hexar RF - but I got used to one so I doubt I'd have trouble with the other. I like that the fastest shutter speed on the Hexar RF is 1/4000th of a second. Nonetheless, that's what ND filters and careful choice of film speed are for, so I don't rate it that highly.

Which leaves the main difference (for me) between the M7 and Hexar RF (absent repairability as a decision criterion) as film handling. I rest my case right there. The Hexar RF is brilliant and the M7 is, well, Leica. Some say the M7 (and many others) "improved" film handling over the M3. I think that if I have to go through the rigmarole at all, the original M3 way might even be better. I've used others' cameras, and I don't find it so - but familiarity might change my mind there. But still: get real! The Hexar RF handles film as well as any other of the very best film cameras of the late 1990s - which is to say better than all (film) cameras that went before them. They just work. Easily. Swiftly. Without need for much thought.

And the price. Did anyone mention the price? I have two, and if I need to buy another then I just will - all for less than an M7.

...Mike

 

[aizan]

now that i have an mp, i appreciate the hexar rf more than ever. the viewfinder has a blue color cast, while the mp has a yellow color cast, and is only 1/3 stop dimmer. the main difference is magnification (.6 vs. .72). since i wear glasses and don't shoot a 75 or 90, i prefer a lower magnification. $700 hexar rf vs. $3200-3600 .58 leica mp. hmm....

the latest internet demerit about the hexar rf is that the rangefinder patch's double image shifts when your eye is off axis. that's true, but they don't bother mentioning that the rangefinder patch also blanks out at the same time. you can't "misfocus" accidentally if you can't see the rangefinder patch to begin with. not that the leica mp doesn't shift or blank out, either. the hexar rf's viewfinder magnification just gives you more wiggle room. i'll have to check this out on a .58 leica when i get the chance.

 

[b&w]

glancing at the subject, the first thought was Hexar Rf or Mamiya7!! that one is a little more academic.

for Ms, if money was not an issue, i would go for the M7. next up would be the ZI...

 

[viramati]

I bought my RF last week as I felt like doing a bit of film work and for just over £400 from a dealer with warranty I thought what the heck it's the cheapest way to try out my leica glass with film. It seems to be great little camera and purchase really was a no briner. If I ever really get back into film (M9 is main workhorse) I might consider a M7.Time will tell

 

[Ron (Netherlands)]

I had both for a while. M7 was clearly better in some ways:
- lightmeter diodes of the Hexar were for me hard to be seen: they are small and there are a lot of these diodes. I like the bigger but fewer diodes of the M7.
- M7 lays better in the hand (M7 roundings).
- quieter shutter of M7.
- Most importantly: almost all my Leitz lenses + ZM biogon didn't focus tack sharp on the Hexar (thats why I sold the Hexar)

 

[regular]

- Most importantly: almost all my Leitz lenses + ZM biogon didn't focus tack sharp on the Hexar (thats why I sold the Hexar)

There is no magic. The bayonet is exactly the same, but your Hexar's rangefinder certainly needed an adjustment.

 

[Ron (Netherlands)]

There is no magic. The bayonet is exactly the same, but your Hexar's rangefinder certainly needed an adjustment.

No I checked that all, it is surely not the mount as such. If you followed discussions short after introduction of the Hexar, then you will notice that the Hexar is supposed to have a slightly different lensflange to film distance compared to the Leica standard. So in order to have your Leitz and other lenses (apart from the Hexanons) focusing tack sharp, you will have to get the Hexar adjusted. I read that many Hexars have been adjusted (in Germany), but apparantly not the one that I had.

cheers
Ron

 

[Doug]

This is an old controversy, with some users experiencing focus errors, sometimes will ALL lenses, Konica or otherwise, and some having no trouble at all, and even doubting the truth of the others' statements. It can get vigorous!

I think the most likely explanation offered is that Konica used wider +/- tolerances for the lens flange parts and fitting, and that in some cases the errors were mostly stacked to one side of the allowed range, adding up to a problem with that particular camera body. (As I heard it, any competent repairman could bring it into spec) Some bodies were perfectly fine, as any dimensional errors were either minimal and/or canceled each other out. Konica took a lot of heat on this, and it may be that tolerances were tightened up at some point in production.

I have two Hexar RFs, both of which accurately focus Leica, Zeiss, and Voigtlander lenses. (Well, that was before one of them was "fixed" by Precision Camera, and now focuses ok with one CV lens and back-focuses with another) I don't have any Konica lenses...

 

[reala_fan]

What?

You mean there are OTHER M-mount cameras besides the Hexar RF?

🙄

...

 

[stupid leica]

out of the two, i would choose the Hexar for two main reasons:

1) it is more affordable
2) it is just as good, and better in some areas (shutter speeds esp) than the M7.

Honestly though, i would prefer an Ikon to either. I found my Hexar to be a wonderful camera, but it lacked personality.