--s
Well-known
asked by a rff-member about my drying method shown in the latest print thread, i decided to document the workflow and open a new thread here.
the problem is known. while fb prints have a more beautiful feel and look about them compared to rc papers, they are much more work, and especially getting them flat is challenging.
i´m using wet tape to fix them on a board while drying, and they come out as flat as they were when they were unused resting with their siblings in the package.
as you need a little space for the tape, the prints don´t use the full paper size, a margin of ca. 15 mm has to stay under the frame.
the board i use is of resopal, ideal for glueing the wet tape upon.
more things i need:
the tape is the type used by artists to hold the aquarelle paper, you can buy it at the artists supplies. i prefer a width of 40-50mm.
the sponge is for wetting the tape, just drag the tape over the sponge. the tape should not be soaking wet.
the use of the safety pin i´ll show soon.
after drip-drying the prints (they should be taken from the line before the curling begins), i lay them out on the board.
when they were on the line, i prepared the tape, tearing stripes from the roll long enough to overlap the board.
i fix the prints with the tape, carefully striking out air bubbles from under the tape.
as the whole matter is airtight, it is necessary to pin a few holes into the prints, otherwise they would come loose prematurely.
the prints now need three days of rest. dry them slowly, best is a room not too warm, as a cellar, too fast drying causes the tape to be torn apart, leaving the prints curling again. three days!!!
after the three days i cut along the paper edge to make the prints plopp out of the drying tension (the paper shrinks quite a lot).
and here i go, four more flat fb prints.
last words: that´s not my own method, i´ve learned it along the line of old traditions.
the problem is known. while fb prints have a more beautiful feel and look about them compared to rc papers, they are much more work, and especially getting them flat is challenging.
i´m using wet tape to fix them on a board while drying, and they come out as flat as they were when they were unused resting with their siblings in the package.
as you need a little space for the tape, the prints don´t use the full paper size, a margin of ca. 15 mm has to stay under the frame.
the board i use is of resopal, ideal for glueing the wet tape upon.
more things i need:
the tape is the type used by artists to hold the aquarelle paper, you can buy it at the artists supplies. i prefer a width of 40-50mm.
the sponge is for wetting the tape, just drag the tape over the sponge. the tape should not be soaking wet.
the use of the safety pin i´ll show soon.
after drip-drying the prints (they should be taken from the line before the curling begins), i lay them out on the board.
when they were on the line, i prepared the tape, tearing stripes from the roll long enough to overlap the board.
i fix the prints with the tape, carefully striking out air bubbles from under the tape.
as the whole matter is airtight, it is necessary to pin a few holes into the prints, otherwise they would come loose prematurely.
the prints now need three days of rest. dry them slowly, best is a room not too warm, as a cellar, too fast drying causes the tape to be torn apart, leaving the prints curling again. three days!!!
after the three days i cut along the paper edge to make the prints plopp out of the drying tension (the paper shrinks quite a lot).
and here i go, four more flat fb prints.
last words: that´s not my own method, i´ve learned it along the line of old traditions.
GaryLH
Veteran
Back in the days I did wet darkroom we after we put it thru the print dryer we put the prints separately under a set of big heavy books to get them flat.
Anyway an interesting way u have there.
Gary
Anyway an interesting way u have there.
Gary
tsiklonaut
Well-known
That's great info! Thanks a lot!
Never thought a tape could hold them well enough. For me it's been also love-hate (superior quality vs annoying to flatten) affair with baryta-based (FB) papers.
There's a Ecomat specialized FB paper press (with adjustable temperature and pressure) for sale that's quoted to bring out the best results in uniform flatness, but for 1000EURos it's not very attractive alternative. If I win a lottery, then for sure.
PS: I wonder if a painter's tape would do the trick? It's easy to remove later and leaves no traces.
Never thought a tape could hold them well enough. For me it's been also love-hate (superior quality vs annoying to flatten) affair with baryta-based (FB) papers.
There's a Ecomat specialized FB paper press (with adjustable temperature and pressure) for sale that's quoted to bring out the best results in uniform flatness, but for 1000EURos it's not very attractive alternative. If I win a lottery, then for sure.
PS: I wonder if a painter's tape would do the trick? It's easy to remove later and leaves no traces.
k__43
Registered Film User
I used tile floor (w/ floor heating) instead of resopal .. it worked awesome!
One thing has to be done very carefully tho: cleaning of all the tape and remaining glue otherwise the prints would stick to the floor next time around.
One thing has to be done very carefully tho: cleaning of all the tape and remaining glue otherwise the prints would stick to the floor next time around.
Ljós
Well-known
Thanks to the OP for taking the time to make such a nicely illustrated tutorial. Well done, and much appreciated.
This method is very popular in Germany, I can add. Many experienced darkroomworkers use it and recommend it.
Greetings, Ljós
This method is very popular in Germany, I can add. Many experienced darkroomworkers use it and recommend it.
Greetings, Ljós
Ronald M
Veteran
Wavy or elongated edge prints are the major problem with FB papers. In the 1960`s I perhaps invented the tape method after trying all the usual commercial dryers etc. The only commercial one that worked was a three foot diameter canvas belt one. All the school darkrooms at Purdue University had them, but it was beyond my finances. They were electric heated and some were gas heated. Buy one if you can find one.
Back to the problem. I used a basswood mechanical drawing board and plain old masking tape. Squeegee off, 5 minute dry and tape down just as above. Process was 24 hours, but the porous wood aided drying I am sure.
Since a basswood board probably is hard to find today, I recommend gatorboard. It is water proof on the sides and people use it to hold saturated wet watercolor paper. Sold by Dick Blick Art supplies.
Still kicking myself for not buying a Salthill Dryer in the 1980`s It used a blotter stack and corrigated cardboard. Two blotters with corrugated board , two more blotters, corrugated, and so on all stacked up. $1000 still beyond my means. Had I known how well this worked in principle, I would have sold a kidney.
Around 1995, a friend found an old Burke & James blotter stack dryer. It is a prized possession and cost all of $15.
The blotter stack works because air is blown thru the corrugations and the print dries evenly. There is no other method where I can get the center and edges to dry at the same rate . The edges dry and shrink too fast.
Since you will not find a B&J at a garage sale, do the gator board or plate glass with tape. It is clumsy and inefficient but it works better than anything else. Believe me I have tried everything else, screens, counter mounted prints and other methods I have long forgotten.
If the gator board warps, dry prints on both sides to equalize tension.
I had no luck with the press. Once you get wavy edges, you can not stretch them out. A press will remove a simple longitudinal curve, but that never was my problem.
Back to the problem. I used a basswood mechanical drawing board and plain old masking tape. Squeegee off, 5 minute dry and tape down just as above. Process was 24 hours, but the porous wood aided drying I am sure.
Since a basswood board probably is hard to find today, I recommend gatorboard. It is water proof on the sides and people use it to hold saturated wet watercolor paper. Sold by Dick Blick Art supplies.
Still kicking myself for not buying a Salthill Dryer in the 1980`s It used a blotter stack and corrigated cardboard. Two blotters with corrugated board , two more blotters, corrugated, and so on all stacked up. $1000 still beyond my means. Had I known how well this worked in principle, I would have sold a kidney.
Around 1995, a friend found an old Burke & James blotter stack dryer. It is a prized possession and cost all of $15.
The blotter stack works because air is blown thru the corrugations and the print dries evenly. There is no other method where I can get the center and edges to dry at the same rate . The edges dry and shrink too fast.
Since you will not find a B&J at a garage sale, do the gator board or plate glass with tape. It is clumsy and inefficient but it works better than anything else. Believe me I have tried everything else, screens, counter mounted prints and other methods I have long forgotten.
If the gator board warps, dry prints on both sides to equalize tension.
I had no luck with the press. Once you get wavy edges, you can not stretch them out. A press will remove a simple longitudinal curve, but that never was my problem.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Plain blotter drying -- no press, no corrugated cardboard -- works fine for me.
Cheers,
R.
Cheers,
R.
ibcrewin
Ah looky looky
screen to stack of books is my method.
Can you Iron FB paper?
Can you Iron FB paper?
D.O'K.
Darren O'Keeffe.
I used to iron Ilford Galerie on the hottest setting, following a tip from my grandfather, and it usually worked--but strangely not always. At least it didn't seem to do any damage. But I felt increasingly uneasy about doing something so radical to a photograph so gave the practice up. Nor did I ever try it on paper other than Galerie.
Regards,
D.
Regards,
D.
Highway 61
Revisited
I even do consider that all the stories about FB prints don't wanting to get flat belong to the same hoaxes family which spreads all over the Internet when it now comes to film photography home processing, as if only some happy few white beards knew the recipes and could transmit them to the young grasshoppers.
Developing films and FB wet enlarging aren't black magic techniques and you don't need to be a mad scientist to do it properly and easily.
Keep it simple and it will work.
Developing films and FB wet enlarging aren't black magic techniques and you don't need to be a mad scientist to do it properly and easily.
Keep it simple and it will work.
gns
Well-known
I never found curling to be much of a challenge either. DW paper dried face-down on screens has just a little edge curl when dry (at least in my climate). A couple of minutes between 2 matte boards in a dry mount press (or some time under a little weight) leaves them perfectly flat.
Drying screens are so easy to build, use and clean, that everyone I knew did it this way.
I never liked the idea of blotter paper, figuring it was too susceptible to contamination.
Drying screens are so easy to build, use and clean, that everyone I knew did it this way.
I never liked the idea of blotter paper, figuring it was too susceptible to contamination.
Clint Troy
Well-known
I dry all my fb prints on my table with a coton cloth underneath. Does a reasonable job.
Once I dried them withouth the cloth and they curled so much and so hard it's still
Hard to uncurl with my hands. I think it has something to do with the fact that the table didn't absorb humidity therefore helping the prints to curl and harden.
Once I dried them withouth the cloth and they curled so much and so hard it's still
Hard to uncurl with my hands. I think it has something to do with the fact that the table didn't absorb humidity therefore helping the prints to curl and harden.
shadowfox
Darkroom printing lives
Thank you for the thread! Good method, instructions, and illustrations.
Personally, for me, the obvious answer is using RC papers.
Some of you can argue with me all day long about which one is superior.
In the end we'll just shake hands and agree to disagree.
So let's not go there
Personally, for me, the obvious answer is using RC papers.
Some of you can argue with me all day long about which one is superior.
In the end we'll just shake hands and agree to disagree.
So let's not go there
KenR
Well-known
I use the screen method for about 48 hours and then the heavy weights come out to flatten the prints. They are generally not flat until I mount them onto a board with heat and mounting tissue. I have found that the season of the year matters - much curlier in the winter (when I do most of my printing) than in the summer. I assume this is due to the low relative humdity sucking the moisture out of the prints in the dry winter air. I have tried leaving a tray of water in the darkroom with the door closed while the prints are drying, but it doesn't seem to help.
pdexposures
Well-known
I'll be honest in that as much as I love the look and feel of fiber prints, the hassle to me just isn't worth it.
Ronald M
Veteran
Glad I helped someone. I have built 5 darkrooms in as many homes and wavy edges always happened. I could partially press them out if I dry mounted with my press, but it was never 100%. I have the temp strips and cooling weights.
I also used photoblotters, 10 minutes in a set under weight, transfer to new pair, 10 minutes more and repeat 5 to 8 times until dry, Then I had 10 or more wet blotters that are really large and they had to be dryed. Never worked 100% either.
The only things that worked 100% was blotter pack with corrugated paper or the tape print to my drawing board. Results were always the from Kodak Elite and Poly Contrast back to DuPont Varilure and Ilfords current products. They were all the same.
I also used photoblotters, 10 minutes in a set under weight, transfer to new pair, 10 minutes more and repeat 5 to 8 times until dry, Then I had 10 or more wet blotters that are really large and they had to be dryed. Never worked 100% either.
The only things that worked 100% was blotter pack with corrugated paper or the tape print to my drawing board. Results were always the from Kodak Elite and Poly Contrast back to DuPont Varilure and Ilfords current products. They were all the same.
MIkhail
-
This is how I do that.
It took me an hour to make thsi simple device.
Got the idea from here:
http://ru-darkroom.livejournal.com/147570.html
It took me an hour to make thsi simple device.
Got the idea from here:
http://ru-darkroom.livejournal.com/147570.html