How long do negatives/slides/prints last?

msbarnes

msbarnes

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If well kept?

It might vary but what are there some rough approximations? 10 years, 100 years, 1000 years, and etc.

I'm specifically interested in B&W film and untoned fiber darkroom prints but info on C41 and E6 emulsions and similarly selenium toned fiber darkroom prints wouldn't hurt. Info on digital prints would be useful too as I am completely unaware of the process.
 
Hi,

One or two of my slides from the mid fifties have a weird crystal growth on them. But only 1 or 2 from perhaps hundreds.

Everything else seems OK. Mostly I've lost negatives, rather than have them decay or fade etc.

Regards, David
 
I have about 25 4X5 B&W glass plate negatives that are about 100 years old. All were taken by some distant relative that has long-since passed. I have no idea how they were stored prior to about 1980 when I found his box stored in my parent's basement. Outside of dirt and scratches, most are in pretty good shape, though the emulsion has peeled off one of the glass plates.

I know that B&W emulsions are no longer put on glass plates, but this does give you an idea how long a B&W negative can last.

Jim B.
 
Archival B+W, well stored: until the base perishes or insects eat the gelatine: 50-500+ years.

Colour slide and neg: depends on process, process quality and storage (most last much better if dark stored). 20-100+ years. If badly processed, a decade or less.

Archival FB halide prints: 100+ years (maybe 1000+) depending on processing and storage conditions.

These figures are all best guesses based on extensive reading. You may deduce from the ranges given that your question is akin to "how long is a piece of string".

Cheers,

R.
 
The cumulative projection life for color slides is about 4 hours. My Kodak slide projection book says (surprisingly) Ektachrome lasts a bit longer than Kodachrome for projection. It doesn't matter whether it's all at once, or 15 seconds at a time; the total time in the projector's gate with the light on will still add up to around 4 hours.
 
I have some colour transparencies from the 1910-20 period all look fine, if given basic care should last many more years.
This is over 100 years old.
131601666.jpg


I have no idea how it compares to when it was taken in 1909...
131966912.jpg
 
A rule of thumb for b/w from the museal practice is: after 100 years active conservation measures become necessary.
If you ask because your own b/w stuff, with the standardized processes, chemicals and materials nowadays you can count with 200-250 years - if proper processed and stored.
 
Roger Hicks said:
Archival B+W, well stored: until the base perishes or insects eat the gelatine: 50-500+ years.

Colour slide and neg: depends on process, process quality and storage (most last much better if dark stored). 20-100+ years. If badly processed, a decade or less.

Archival FB halide prints: 100+ years (maybe 1000+) depending on processing and storage conditions.

These figures are all best guesses based on extensive reading. You may deduce from the ranges given that your question is akin to "how long is a piece of string".

Cheers,

R.
Click to expand...

Roger, I had bad luck with some Agfachrome from the 80's, obviously processed by Agfa in NJ? (was included). I was traveling west, and remembered the vivid reds from old Agfachrome, so I gave 30 rolls a try. I showed them to classes once a year at most, box stored rest of the year.
They really showed obvious fading in about ten years, however when I scanned them (I still use them when I teach), was happy to see Nikon ROC really brought them back, so I have the use of the images.

Was disappointed with Agfa from that time though.

All travels west since were shot on Kodachrome, with the exception of higher speed Ektachrome E6 for 500mm shots. Processing by Kodak.

I have had several prints from color negatives from the 70's on wall display at home, the paper was paper (pre RC) and they have held up, though I can see some fading-- They are dry mounted on 100% rag in same windows, but I may eventually scan them. The fading is not obviously in one color, judged from my eyes.

I believe RA4 prints should do well. The ones from my darkroom did get a water wash not simply stabilization treatment.

Some BW test rolls left hanging about the darkroom have gathered mold, but all other cut and dark stored (for the most part in museum boxes) negatives from the last 50 years look good, a few I have printed and they made prints at good as the first ones.

My C41 negatives look good as well, but, as corrections are made in printing, it is a tough call.

I have color prints from the 50's, from Kodak, and there is often a lot of shift, the white borders are yellow. My oldest Kodachrome did not last, they were drugstore processed, and served to remind me to send my film to the Great Yellow Father. They used to pick them up daily in large yellow bags to be returned the next day, in my case from Findlay, Ohio.

No framed and displayed BW prints up for twenty years seem to show obvious fading.

Regards, John
 
Kodachrome lasted a long time if properly stored in the dark. Say 75 years and counting. E6 holds up to projection much better, but is less good for dark storage. E3 was junk. My honeymoon pics are faded.

Freeze hermitically sealed C41 forever

Monochrome film in archival sleeves and envelopes, say 100 years.

Untoned prints 50 years Toned 100 + if properly stored.

Recommend Wilhelm Research for professionally data.
 
PhotoSmith, that's a wonderful thing to have!

Any idea of the process? I'd say it looked rather dark for an autochrome, but I've only ever seen cleaned-up ones.

Adrian
 
Wilhelm's book has some interesting data, but it's quite outdated for Colour materials.

I suppose Chromogenic materials have come a long way. Kodak rated their late E6 surpassing Kodachrome in dark storage. C41 negs seemingly aren't as good, but have improved a lot (think Ektar/Portra last generation)
RA4 prints, at the time of the book Kodak seems horrible, nowadays the manufacturers (both) give about 50-75 years on display for it. In dark storage about 200.
And of course, environment is everything.

I will be able to report in 60-70 years, if nothing happens, I could still be around...
 
msbarnes said:
If well kept?

It might vary but what are there some rough approximations? 10 years, 100 years, 1000 years, and etc.

I'm specifically interested in B&W film and untoned fiber darkroom prints but info on C41 and E6 emulsions and similarly selenium toned fiber darkroom prints wouldn't hurt. Info on digital prints would be useful too as I am completely unaware of the process.
Click to expand...

I have tons of old negs and slides, dating back as far as the 1930s and maybe even prior, from family members. I can still scan them so they're still "lasting", but at what level of quality and deterioration it's very hard to assess until I look at them in detail. I wouldn't call any of them perfect or as new, by any means, although I can scan and restore most of them.

IN perfect archival storage conditions, perfectly processed, on archival papers, etc, B&W prints can probably last longer than anyone is interested in them. The same goes for modern pigment inkjet prints on the best papers too. Film, any kind of film, is much more fragile.

G
 
As for b/w prints, well, I have literally hundreds of CDVs made between 1860-1880 that range from faded and barely viewable to looking like brand new. And I guarantee that most of them were not processed or handled with any degree of "archivalness" for the first 130-140 years of their lives. With many print media, the paper beneath the image will fail before the image does. We do have thousand-year-old books now (and other texts on fiber substrates much older than that), so there's no reason to think that photographs on paper can't last as long.
 
Muggins said:
PhotoSmith, that's a wonderful thing to have!

Any idea of the process? I'd say it looked rather dark for an autochrome, but I've only ever seen cleaned-up ones.

Adrian
Click to expand...

It's an Autochrome. They all look a little dark I think it's the lamp black used in the process, they were slow (single digit ISO by todays standards) but wonderful.
I have some images from World war I here:
http://photo-utopia.blogspot.co.uk/2008/11/great-war-in-colour.html

Also I'm not sure about the Wilhelm Research data as in the early 1990's I read a report about their film testing 'accelerated ageing' where they tested many films.
One singled out for poor longevity was Kodak Vericolor with 20 years showing serious fading.
Using that very film for my wedding and portrait work made me worry, but 20-30 years later they performed much better than expected with very little or no fading leading me to take the accelerated ageing tests with a pinch of salt.
So from my own experiences film is very robust in the main especially B&W which should last over 100 years, most modern colour film similar-my prints, negs and slides will outlive my kids....
 
Well depends on the storage and more importantly how it was processed the quick lab was the best negative and print live reducer in the history of the medium. A well processed B/W can supposedly last over 500 years in the right conditions. A pigment print (carbon print), gumprint, platinumprint even longer it all depends on the storage conditions Also Wilhelm and also all other kind of accelerated testings rarely tell the truce as the are made under lab conditions and leave out a lot. Take for example a cyanotypie which is not the best medium to survive accelerated testing, why because it's continous exposure to UV-light etc.. but in reality Cyanotypies can regenerate in the dark so test indicates short live span while in reality long live span.
 
I have 1000's of my Dads slides from 1940s on... the Kodachrome's have better color stability than the Ecktachrome's. And the Exktachrome's has had a larger number of slides that developed fungus... still scannable, but too much to restore 100%

I have 100's of medium and large format negatives (many where developed by Dad) still are in great shape (Stored in Paper Sleeves of the day)... I have seen only less then 1% that have the emulsion is cracking away...

I have 1000's of prints, many from the 1930s to 1950's are mostly hand developed by by Dad, (On Very thick Paper). Other than the typical Sepia Aging...the emulsions are in great shape.. no cracking.

All of the above have been stored in boxes and in Air Conditioned rooms for most of their storage life.

I can't varify the process my Dad used.. But, he was a Wedding and Portrait Photographer in the 1940's. And used 4x5, 6x6, and 3.25x4.25 formats. mostly all those negatives are in close to 95% original form...very few have emulsion problems.

I would conclude that the
  • Processing is most important as the 1st major step for longevity,
  • And Proper Archive materials is the 2rd major step for longevity.
  • Then Proper Storage in a Air conditioned low humidity environment is the 3nd major step in longevity.
 
Roger Hicks said:
Archival B+W, well stored: until the base perishes or insects eat the gelatine: 50-500+ years.

Colour slide and neg: depends on process, process quality and storage (most last much better if dark stored). 20-100+ years. If badly processed, a decade or less.

Archival FB halide prints: 100+ years (maybe 1000+) depending on processing and storage conditions.

These figures are all best guesses based on extensive reading. You may deduce from the ranges given that your question is akin to "how long is a piece of string".

Cheers,

R.
Click to expand...

But sir, I learned in grade school that any string is twice 1/2 its length. :D :D

Of course there are sufficient variables we don't yet have a good half life of negatives or prints. :p

I do hope they are conservative. But there are so many variables.
 
The polyester base of most sheet films and some roll films (several of Rollei's offerings) will last far longer than the acetate base of most roll films (including Kodak and Ilford's.)

My hobby is taking photos of people and places to keep for future generations after I am gone so archival qualities are important to me.
 
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