koven
Well-known
Haha, the good old specious thing... you could have avoided this.
I may, or may not, take "street" photos. Some of mine may, or may not, be "good". What's the point ?
Music isn't only for people playing the piano.
You're right your voice deserves to be heard.
Coopersounds
Well-known
i like the shots, and enjoyed the little explanation on your blog
edge100
Well-known
I'm just glad to see more Toronto-based street photographers.
froyd
Veteran
James-
I like the majority of your pictures. Of course, everybody is a critic, and you invited feedback, so you got it. Seems to me you are handling it better than most people! Like Boris, I dislike the cliche' of the homeless on a bench or the stooping old lady walking by a fashion poster, but I see very little evidence of that in your work, which certainly display a sharp eye for interesting scenes. Personally, I much prefer those to staged street portraits.
I have not had the chance to read the post because I'm darting out the door, but I wanted to add some positive feedback before dashing out.
I like the majority of your pictures. Of course, everybody is a critic, and you invited feedback, so you got it. Seems to me you are handling it better than most people! Like Boris, I dislike the cliche' of the homeless on a bench or the stooping old lady walking by a fashion poster, but I see very little evidence of that in your work, which certainly display a sharp eye for interesting scenes. Personally, I much prefer those to staged street portraits.
I have not had the chance to read the post because I'm darting out the door, but I wanted to add some positive feedback before dashing out.
Highway 61
Revisited
Although I'm living overseas at 6500km from Toronto I have to admit that it's a nice place for "street photo". I enjoyed the city much for that reason during my three trips there, three and two years ago. I even met some RFFers by chance in the streets - funny.
rondo
Established
I think some of these shots are very good. I enjoyed the ones where you were engaging your subjects and also the ones where all pieces fall into place. Common for all shots: one can feel your energy and enthusiasm.
I prefer to say nice things or shut up when people decide to share their work online. I don't understand the point of negative criticism unless it comes with constructive observation about the work.
In general street photography that we see here and elsewhere is about photographer walking in streets and taking pictures of others who are doing the same...more about "surface of life" than life...I don't know how one passes the threshold ( facade to substance) but I don't think it can happen without taking risks.
The street is just a vehicle that connects us. A point of entrance to other lives.
I prefer to say nice things or shut up when people decide to share their work online. I don't understand the point of negative criticism unless it comes with constructive observation about the work.
In general street photography that we see here and elsewhere is about photographer walking in streets and taking pictures of others who are doing the same...more about "surface of life" than life...I don't know how one passes the threshold ( facade to substance) but I don't think it can happen without taking risks.
The street is just a vehicle that connects us. A point of entrance to other lives.
koven
Well-known
Thank you! Be sure to read my post when you get the chance.
I am definitely learning how to be more fluid and less cliche. Trying to figure out the essence of making a good photo. This post was just me getting some ideas out of my head. I'm open to any criticism that's thrown at me, it will only help me and anyone else who reads it.
Major Tom
Established
Probably my favorite.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mrelllis/8733502013/sizes/l/in/photostream/
I saw plenty of homeless my first time out and I decided not to do it either. If I ever do, it will only be if I can also help them out. Besides the fact it's so overplayed anyway.
A city is a mixture of structure and people, it seems like many ignore one for the other to an extent, which is fine, but it's good to get a sense of both.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/mrelllis/8733502013/sizes/l/in/photostream/
I saw plenty of homeless my first time out and I decided not to do it either. If I ever do, it will only be if I can also help them out. Besides the fact it's so overplayed anyway.
A city is a mixture of structure and people, it seems like many ignore one for the other to an extent, which is fine, but it's good to get a sense of both.
Highway 61
Revisited
My feeling is that it was quite unclear whether the OP was asking for comments on his written thoughts about street photography or for some comments about his photographs, either those displayed on the blog alongside with the written piece, or those on his flickr (which are quite different from those he chose to illustrate his write-up, which I found quite surprising).
Hence some ironic (yet not offensive at all IMO) posts he gathered in this thread.
As he himself wrote, that's quite hard to get involved into street photography without slipping into some clichés, were it with your own photos, or what you say about'em.
Hence some ironic (yet not offensive at all IMO) posts he gathered in this thread.
As he himself wrote, that's quite hard to get involved into street photography without slipping into some clichés, were it with your own photos, or what you say about'em.
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
I don't quite get some of the opinions being expressed about the homeless in this thread. Photographing them is no more exploitative than photographing other people in the street ... who may or may not be homeless.
The genuinely homeless are the 'real street people.' This is their lives, it's where they live due to whatever circumstances have befallen them. They can be the ultimate street subjects IMO provided you respect them and appreciate their circumstances.
The genuinely homeless are the 'real street people.' This is their lives, it's where they live due to whatever circumstances have befallen them. They can be the ultimate street subjects IMO provided you respect them and appreciate their circumstances.
airfrogusmc
Veteran
Good street work has all the elements that any good two dimensional work has. Repeating shapes, leading lines, tone, implied movement, a sense of geometric rhythm and other visual devises that make good images. Good street work is more than just random shots of people on the street.
I think the way one approaches the homeless less fortunate is the key. All you have to do is look at the work of Davidson (East 100th Street) Walker Evans, Dorothea Lange and any of the other FSA photographers for the right approach. It's not taking photographs from a half block away with a 400mm lens of a less fortunate person digging through a garbage can.
Theres going to be a great movie on street work and some of the truly great photographers that work in that arena coming out soon. Heres a couple of trailers.
Some of my favorite photographers are feature. Davidson, Meyerowitz, Erwitt, Mark, Freedman, and a few others. I had a chance to meet and see Davidson and Weyerowitz speak in the 1980s. I think Meyeowitz had just finished the book Red Heads and Davidson was just finishing Subway.
Heres a couple of trailers. Give them a moment to load.
In the first one Meyerowitz gets to the reason why some do it.
http://www.traileraddict.com/trailer/everybody-street/trailer
http://vimeo.com/70639661
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vqCd2K1-KY
To the OP. Don't worry about classifications and what people say. Either you believe in what you are doing or you don't. I hate the term street or really most classifications.
Heres some really great words by Ansel Adams on the subject. Unfortunately we have become more label oriented instead of less as he had hoped.
"Lets hope that categories will be less rigid in the future; there has been too much of placing photography in little niches-commercial. pictorial, documentary, and creative( a dismal term). Definitions of this kind are inessential and stupid; good photography remains good photography no matter what we name it. I would like to think of it as just “photography” ; of each and every photograph containing the best qualities in proper degree to achieve its purpose. We have been slaves to categories, and each has served as a kind of concentration camp for the spirit.”-Ansel Adams
I think the way one approaches the homeless less fortunate is the key. All you have to do is look at the work of Davidson (East 100th Street) Walker Evans, Dorothea Lange and any of the other FSA photographers for the right approach. It's not taking photographs from a half block away with a 400mm lens of a less fortunate person digging through a garbage can.
Theres going to be a great movie on street work and some of the truly great photographers that work in that arena coming out soon. Heres a couple of trailers.
Some of my favorite photographers are feature. Davidson, Meyerowitz, Erwitt, Mark, Freedman, and a few others. I had a chance to meet and see Davidson and Weyerowitz speak in the 1980s. I think Meyeowitz had just finished the book Red Heads and Davidson was just finishing Subway.
Heres a couple of trailers. Give them a moment to load.
In the first one Meyerowitz gets to the reason why some do it.
http://www.traileraddict.com/trailer/everybody-street/trailer
http://vimeo.com/70639661
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vqCd2K1-KY
To the OP. Don't worry about classifications and what people say. Either you believe in what you are doing or you don't. I hate the term street or really most classifications.
Heres some really great words by Ansel Adams on the subject. Unfortunately we have become more label oriented instead of less as he had hoped.
"Lets hope that categories will be less rigid in the future; there has been too much of placing photography in little niches-commercial. pictorial, documentary, and creative( a dismal term). Definitions of this kind are inessential and stupid; good photography remains good photography no matter what we name it. I would like to think of it as just “photography” ; of each and every photograph containing the best qualities in proper degree to achieve its purpose. We have been slaves to categories, and each has served as a kind of concentration camp for the spirit.”-Ansel Adams
Highway 61
Revisited
He might not have predicted the arrival of the Internet, the smartphones, and the dozens of thousands pictures uploaded each day on flickr or similar "photo sharing" sites.
Harder not to get more label oriented when you are overwhelmed with pictures each time you visit such media.
This summer in Arles I visited an interesting exhibition of Erik Kessels' work, at which one could see the tangible aspect of what's uploaded daily on flickr :
Yes, those are postcards size printed photos of what's uploaded per day
Otherwise, Jean-Loup Sieff also told that the photographs could be divided into two categories : the good, and the bad.
What Duke Ellington told about music, too.
How true.
airfrogusmc
Veteran
But a great photograph is still a great photograph and those are truly rare and that is really all should matter. An interesting piece by Ralph Gibson that at one point talks all the work being created but so little of it is good.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzMQcE2E-1o
I still think that the best way to see quality is in the traditional place. Museums, galleries, exhibits, books, etc....Even then its far from all good.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzMQcE2E-1o
I still think that the best way to see quality is in the traditional place. Museums, galleries, exhibits, books, etc....Even then its far from all good.
Highway 61
Revisited
What's stunning is that there might be some true masterpieces within that mountain of paper. I'm sure there are some.
Saul Leiter once told that according to him, the worldwide production of very good photographs taken by anonymists and on par with those taken by famous photographers, quality wise, was like an iceberg : nobody will see the sunk part of it.
I stopped updating my flickr quite long ago but I haven't received any "How sad it is" complaint so far...
Saul Leiter once told that according to him, the worldwide production of very good photographs taken by anonymists and on par with those taken by famous photographers, quality wise, was like an iceberg : nobody will see the sunk part of it.
I stopped updating my flickr quite long ago but I haven't received any "How sad it is" complaint so far...
airfrogusmc
Veteran
We might never know but the chances of the cream rising to the top are still there. You just have to figure out away to separate yourself from the herd. That could be said for professional work to. The thing that many miss is that one single photograph no more makes a great photographer as one great at bat makes an MVP. Its bodies of work that make the greats. I have no web presence other than here an a couple of other photography sites.
My professional work is all advertising/commercial and I have a very strong stable of repeat clients (a couple dozen) that keep me busy and I had a large one man exhibit of my personal work back in April. In my opinion, you have to get away from the way everyone else is doing things to get the right kind of recognition.
My professional work is all advertising/commercial and I have a very strong stable of repeat clients (a couple dozen) that keep me busy and I had a large one man exhibit of my personal work back in April. In my opinion, you have to get away from the way everyone else is doing things to get the right kind of recognition.
Highway 61
Revisited
True.
Over the past decades I have had some of my photographs published in books and literature reviews papers and although this wasn't much and didn't earn me any real money, this was a reward much more interesting than any kind of intense web presence anyone shooting extensively with a smartphone can now perform.
Internet is quite nice to discuss photography with passionate people worldwide, but this might be the worst "place" to display your photographs.
Yet nowadays if you don't have at least a website frontpage, you kinda shoot yourself in the foot, don't you ?
airfrogusmc
Veteran
Not having a web page hasn't hurt me one bit. I had an image in Betty Whites book . If You Ask Me; and of course you wont I have work in the book Legendary Route 66 I have had dozens of exhibits over the years. Some one man shows and some group shows. I shoot ads that are in the Chicago Tribune, Sun Times, Newsweek, Ladies Home Journal, West Suburban Living, photos from events in Todays Chicago Woman, Michigan Avenue Magazine, and many more local and national publications. I have had work on billboards and bus ads and all of this without web presence. My clients include some of the major players in this area in healthcare and some fortune 500 corporations. Now if you are wedding photographer thats a different story.
Getting back to the point is that worry little about categories and worry more about if you are creating good work and if your work looks like everyone else's work in the herd then you are part of the herd. Not a good place to be.
