ornate_wrasse
Moderator
Raid,
I sure hope the replacement sensor is more resistant to corrosion!
It would be a pain to have to deal with the sensor issue again in the future.
Ellen
If corroded sensor never changed?
- Thread starter Ko.Fe.
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Raid,
I sure hope the replacement sensor is more resistant to corrosion!
It would be a pain to have to deal with the sensor issue again in the future.
Ellen
music_healing
Well-known
receive mine (for the 3rd replacement) in Oct 2017, Leica store said.. this one is warrantied not to be corroded again since this one is different ...
the store people said this newest ccd sensor wont be corroded again like previous one... so next sensor replacement is not free ..since the new type wont be corroded
well.. it sure are different.. the color and ir leak different
Sincerely
William
jarski
Veteran
M8 has its own selection of issues, but luckily this corrosion thing isn't one of them 🙄
willie_901
Veteran
These days my memory is often wrong. But, I thought you took advantage of the M9 sensor assembly replacement program.
At any rate, only the M9 first-generation sensor has an IR filter film that reacts with water vapor. All other Leica digital camera sensor assemblies either don't have an IR filter or their IR filter film is chemically inert to water vapor.
TR3B
Established
M9 Sensor
M9 Sensor
Can someone direct me to a link showing that the most recent sensor replacement is a CCD sensor. I am under the impression that it is Cmos and as close as they could come to the CCD rendering.
The M8 CCD sensor has never been included in the recall and I've never heard of a M8 with sensor corrosion.
I need to pay closer attention to the issue as I own an M8 and wouldn't want to be caught off guard to facts I'm unaware of.
M9 Sensor
Can someone direct me to a link showing that the most recent sensor replacement is a CCD sensor. I am under the impression that it is Cmos and as close as they could come to the CCD rendering.
The M8 CCD sensor has never been included in the recall and I've never heard of a M8 with sensor corrosion.
I need to pay closer attention to the issue as I own an M8 and wouldn't want to be caught off guard to facts I'm unaware of.
No corrosion problem with the M8 models, as Jarski said. 🙂 The M9-family replacement sensors are CCD as the original, but with a different IR reflective cover glass. Some claim to see a slight difference in color rendition though. Not CMOS, as that would require different electronics, as I understand it.
Ickx
Newbie
If you see problems with it I would try to change it.
I have a M9 with original sensor and have not seen any problems (yet). If it will come it will come, I don't worry about it. It problems develope I'll look in to having it changed but I might also look for a camera upgrade. New sensors will probably not be around forever but I see no point to worry about it.
I have a M9 with original sensor and have not seen any problems (yet). If it will come it will come, I don't worry about it. It problems develope I'll look in to having it changed but I might also look for a camera upgrade. New sensors will probably not be around forever but I see no point to worry about it.
jarski
Veteran
wonder what is price of otherwise decent M9/ME, with original sensor? (assuming both buyer and seller are aware of the corrosion issue). risky purchase so should reflect in the price.
Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
Used is around 2.5K$, new or old in order sensor. NiB M-E were still popping out in 2017 for 3K$.
willie_901
Veteran
The replacement M9 sensor uses an IR filter film material that does not react with water vapor.
willie_901
Veteran
Well, the M8 doesn't have an IR filter film layer in the sensor assembly cover glass(or anywhere at all actually).
willie_901
Veteran
CCD vs. CMOS has nothing too do with rendering. Creating electrical charge from photoelectrons and and converting that charge into DC voltage is not going to affect rendering.[1]
However, the sensor color-filter array and IR filter bandwidth characteristics, the sensor micro-lens optics and the camera read noise statistics (not noise levels) could impact rendering perception. That is, the information content for spatial array of DC voltage levels covered to binary values can be quite different.
Consider, with CCD or CMOS, all you have to do is use lenses with radically different optical designs to affect rendering aesthetics.
Anyway, the new M9 sensor assembly uses an old-fashioned CCD photo-diode array sensor bed. Obviously the new IR filter layer material is different. I don't think there's any data on it's bandwidth characteristics. One could speculate modification to the color-filter array materials could compensate for any rendering differences in the IR filter characteristics.
I think it's clear Leica spent significant resources trying to minimize rendering differences been the new and original M9 sensor assemblies.
1/ CCD and CMOS photos-diodes have frequency response differences. These differences occur just outside both ends (red and blue) of the the visible spectrum. These differences are typically much smaller than differences in CFA and IR filter charcateristics.
ChrisLivsey
Veteran
I'm sorry to be a pedant but that is not true:
The M8’s very high image quality was achieved by – among other things - employing an especially thin IR blocking filter on the CCD sensor.
Increasing the filter thickness would have led to a deterioration of the image quality, especially in the frame corners.
http://en.leica-camera.com/layout/s...eica-M/Frequently-asked-questions/(offset)/30
sepiareverb
genius and moron
If the sensor isn’t changed does it become the M9 Lomo edition?
willie_901
Veteran
I sincerely appreciate your correction.
We are left to speculate the M8's ineffective IR filter film is similar to other brands in terms of its chemical properties... namely it does not react with water vapor.
Rob-F
Likes Leicas
I think it was the adhesive used to cement the cover glass (or filter) that went bad on the M9, and not the glass itself.
Out to Lunch
Veteran
It is not clear whether or not all M-E's are affected. Mine, which I bought in 2015, does not show corrosion. I currently live in Asia which is super humid and very dusty and the sensor is a dust magnet. I can't have the camera checked and so I'll just keep on using the rocket blower and the visible dust swabs and hope for the best.
ChrisLivsey
Veteran
Thank you for the understanding response, it is not with pleasure I correct but for those coming later that may be led astray. As an M8 owner I agree it may as well not have any IR filter over the sensor 😉
Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
If corrosion is here all you need is one clear sky shot with f16.
ChrisLivsey
Veteran
Leica said: The sensors are equipped with a specially coated IR filter cover glass to ensure optimum imaging performance. Should this coating layer be damaged, corrosion effects that alter the filter surface may begin to appear after several years.
It was not the adhesive, it was the coating layer.
The filter in question is:
http://www.schott.com/d/advanced_op...hott-opticalglassfilter-s8612-may-2016-en.pdf
This now shows "long term changes of the polished surface are possible"
I say now because this data sheet was revised post the issues discovered in the M9 series.
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