LukeC
Newbie
First up just wanted to say hi everyone as I'm new here. I'm from Melbourne, Aus and have been doing photography as a hobby for about 4-5 years.
As I started out with digital, I decided that to truly get something out of photography I should try my hand at film - and since I found the old Leicas to be rather attractive old cameras I went hunting on ebay.
The camera I got is a 1953 IIf red dial with original 50 2.0 and an Arco Colinar 135 3.8 which is all in quite good condition it seems bar a small mark in the leather and a few minor dings. The interesting thing is that the camera came with all the original paperwork including certificate, original manual, import and customs certificates for the body and the tele lens, and a lot of other interesting paperwork in the original envelope and a leather pouch.
There were a couple of questions I was wanting to know which led me to these forums.
1. What film should I look at using in this camera, it appears that it only supports 100 film am I right? I'm going through a b&w phase at the moment so any suggestions?
and
2. I feel I got a reasonable bargain at AU$400 (~US$350), so was wondering roughly what you guys thought the value of this camera would be.
Anyway, that should be it for now - good to meet you all.
Luke
As I started out with digital, I decided that to truly get something out of photography I should try my hand at film - and since I found the old Leicas to be rather attractive old cameras I went hunting on ebay.
The camera I got is a 1953 IIf red dial with original 50 2.0 and an Arco Colinar 135 3.8 which is all in quite good condition it seems bar a small mark in the leather and a few minor dings. The interesting thing is that the camera came with all the original paperwork including certificate, original manual, import and customs certificates for the body and the tele lens, and a lot of other interesting paperwork in the original envelope and a leather pouch.
There were a couple of questions I was wanting to know which led me to these forums.
1. What film should I look at using in this camera, it appears that it only supports 100 film am I right? I'm going through a b&w phase at the moment so any suggestions?
and
2. I feel I got a reasonable bargain at AU$400 (~US$350), so was wondering roughly what you guys thought the value of this camera would be.
Anyway, that should be it for now - good to meet you all.
Luke
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tripod
Well-known
Use absolutely any 35mm film you want in this camera. It "supports" all types.
$350 was a good deal.
Enjoy!
$350 was a good deal.
Enjoy!
Luddite Frank
Well-known
Hello Luke,
If your II-f is in working order, then I would suggest that you got a decent deal.
The Leica willl handle just about any speed film you want to throw in it - the film "reminder" dial that is housed in the film-advance knob is limited, but it is only intended to be a "reminder"; it has no impact on camera function.
I usually shoot Fujicolor 400 in my 1934 Leica III / Summicron; I just picked-up prints from a roll of Fuji Superia 1600 that I was shooting at a banquet (used my 1933 black III w/ f 2 Summar) - some shots turned-out better than others, but that was not a function of the high-speed film.
Today I got some Ilford Delta 3200 B&W that I will be shooting indoors at a RR museum this coming Monday... will probably use the '34 III again.
Some of the older Leitz thread mount lenses ( un-coated ) may not be as "contrasty" with color film as you are used to; they are also prone to lens-flare from bright light sources.
The f 2 Summar 50 mm tended to get dark around the edges of color pictures... this issue was corrected with the f 2 Summitar and f 2 Summicron lenses (Larger front element).
If you are changing lenses with film in the camera, try to shade the camera while doing so... bright light can cause some fogging on the loaded /adajcent frame.
I 've shot over six dozen rolls of film in my screw-mount Leicas since getting hooked back in the fall, and find them to be great cameras and still quite capable, even at 50 to 75 years old.
If you are lens-shopping, consider Canon, Nikkor (Nikon), and Chiyoko-Rokkor lenses, as well as the new Cosina-Voigtlander lenses; all are available in Leica thread-mount, and give good results, often for a fraction of the cost of Leitz lens in good shape (Leitz lenses scratch easily).
Go shoot some film and have some fun !
Luddite Frank
If your II-f is in working order, then I would suggest that you got a decent deal.
The Leica willl handle just about any speed film you want to throw in it - the film "reminder" dial that is housed in the film-advance knob is limited, but it is only intended to be a "reminder"; it has no impact on camera function.
I usually shoot Fujicolor 400 in my 1934 Leica III / Summicron; I just picked-up prints from a roll of Fuji Superia 1600 that I was shooting at a banquet (used my 1933 black III w/ f 2 Summar) - some shots turned-out better than others, but that was not a function of the high-speed film.
Today I got some Ilford Delta 3200 B&W that I will be shooting indoors at a RR museum this coming Monday... will probably use the '34 III again.
Some of the older Leitz thread mount lenses ( un-coated ) may not be as "contrasty" with color film as you are used to; they are also prone to lens-flare from bright light sources.
The f 2 Summar 50 mm tended to get dark around the edges of color pictures... this issue was corrected with the f 2 Summitar and f 2 Summicron lenses (Larger front element).
If you are changing lenses with film in the camera, try to shade the camera while doing so... bright light can cause some fogging on the loaded /adajcent frame.
I 've shot over six dozen rolls of film in my screw-mount Leicas since getting hooked back in the fall, and find them to be great cameras and still quite capable, even at 50 to 75 years old.
If you are lens-shopping, consider Canon, Nikkor (Nikon), and Chiyoko-Rokkor lenses, as well as the new Cosina-Voigtlander lenses; all are available in Leica thread-mount, and give good results, often for a fraction of the cost of Leitz lens in good shape (Leitz lenses scratch easily).
Go shoot some film and have some fun !
Luddite Frank
LukeC
Newbie
Thanks - I'm planning on going out and grabbing some film today and will play over the next day or two. I have a lot to work out though, still have to learn how to use the camera (haven't worked out how to load the film yet - but will read the manual).
I'll also investigate different lenses. I'm pretty sure i'll have no luck, but do you know if there are any fisheye lenses available in the screw mounts?
I'll also investigate different lenses. I'm pretty sure i'll have no luck, but do you know if there are any fisheye lenses available in the screw mounts?
tripod
Well-known
Not fisheye, but some excellent really wide angle lenses by Cosina Voightlaender. 25, 21, 15, and 12mm lenses. See CameraQuest website for LOTS of info.
ray*j*gun
Veteran
Don't forget to trim the film leader per the manual. See the stickies for "how to" on film loading.
Ray
Ray
VictorM.
Well-known
Don't be fooled by the film speed selector on the wind knob. There's no built-in meter-the speed dial is there as a remider about the speed of the film you have loaded.
LukeC
Newbie
hey guys thanks for all the responses. I finally had a chance to duck out and grab some film today and im sitting here trying to load it but I'm having troubles. I went to check the sticky about loading the film but there are no pictures so im a little unsure whats going on.
I came across this - http://www.mediajoy.com/en/cla_came/leica2f/02.html - which explains loading the film, however the spool in my camera is a bit different and the film doesnt slide in.
I also have been reading about trimming the film. Some say to do it, other say its not necessary, and im confused why it needs to be done at allother then getting chips of film through the curtain, but why would it chip?
Sorry about all the beginner questions, but as it would be quite apparent, I am a beginner at this.
Cheers
Luke
I came across this - http://www.mediajoy.com/en/cla_came/leica2f/02.html - which explains loading the film, however the spool in my camera is a bit different and the film doesnt slide in.
I also have been reading about trimming the film. Some say to do it, other say its not necessary, and im confused why it needs to be done at allother then getting chips of film through the curtain, but why would it chip?
Sorry about all the beginner questions, but as it would be quite apparent, I am a beginner at this.
Cheers
Luke
laptoprob
back to basics
Your take up spool doesn't have anything to grab the film? That makes it difficult. You could try to tape to end of the film to the spool, but you don't want to loose the tape inside the camera.
Wether or not to clip the film depends on the specimen of the camera. Mine doesn't require clipped film. Don't know why. You can try. But first figure out how to get the film to the take-up spool.
Can you post a pic of the spool?
Wether or not to clip the film depends on the specimen of the camera. Mine doesn't require clipped film. Don't know why. You can try. But first figure out how to get the film to the take-up spool.
Can you post a pic of the spool?
Spyderman
Well-known
If it says so in the manual, and many Leica users do it that way - why doubt about it ? Cutting it is simple and makes loading easy.
VictorM.
Well-known
No question-cutting the leader makes loading easier.
LukeC
Newbie
Its not that I doubt about it - I just didn't understand where it was being cut and why - but I think I understand it now.
In all the images I've seen of the take up spool have shown a small notch to slide the film in to secure it, however mine looks a little different to the example and the film wont easily slide in. I can lift it a bit with my nail but still cant get the film in. I'm obviously doing something wrong as this is the spool that came with the camera, i just dont understand how to use it. The manual says to "push the trimmed film end under the spring" - it physically doesnt push in without breaking the film.
I've attached a (poor quality) i'm if you can see it.
In all the images I've seen of the take up spool have shown a small notch to slide the film in to secure it, however mine looks a little different to the example and the film wont easily slide in. I can lift it a bit with my nail but still cant get the film in. I'm obviously doing something wrong as this is the spool that came with the camera, i just dont understand how to use it. The manual says to "push the trimmed film end under the spring" - it physically doesnt push in without breaking the film.
I've attached a (poor quality) i'm if you can see it.
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laptoprob
back to basics
The film should fit under the lip with the arrow. Maybe bend it out a little? Not too much because the film has to grip in between!
mongo141
Established
Its not that I doubt about it - I just didn't understand where it was being cut and why - but I think I understand it now.
In all the images I've seen of the take up spool have shown a small notch to slide the film in to secure it, however mine looks a little different to the example and the film wont easily slide in. I can lift it a bit with my nail but still cant get the film in. I'm obviously doing something wrong as this is the spool that came with the camera, i just dont understand how to use it. The manual says to "push the trimmed film end under the spring" - it physically doesnt push in without breaking the film.
I've attached a (poor quality) i'm if you can see it.
Its identical to mine, (I also have a IIF). That spring is a little tight, I hook my finger nail under the end and pull up gently while pushing the end of the film in. Thats the only hard part, once you have sucessfully loaded a couple of rolls of film you will womder what all the fuss was about. Dave
Luddite Frank
Well-known
Hi Luke !
1) TRIM THE FILM ! If the concept were criticial enough for Leitz to print a diagram in the bottom of the camera, then the method must have merit !!!
I hold the new cassette in my right hand, grab the tab between my left thumb & forefinger, and slowly pull-out "three fingers' worth" of film across the palm of my left hand.
Then I take some small scissors (curved cuticle scissors are nice), and between the first and second sprocket-holes out of the cassette, cut in from the edge, curving towards the free end, then straight-on to meet the factory trim on the leader. This method has worked well for me; I usually buy my film in four or six-packs, and trim the whole lot at one sitting before dropping them into my kit bag.
Other guys have success with un-trimmed film in their Leicas, but I would consider that an advanced technique.
2) Film spool: The spool that came with my III-f was a real bugger to catch the film under that spring tab. I gave-up and swapped it with a more friendly spool from an earlier camera.
It looks like your spool has a little depression under the spring-tab: have you tried "pointing" the end of your leader slightly, to rest inside that depression ? That might help get things started...
I try to grip the film very close to the end, so there's as little flex as possible... it's a fiddly process, for sure.
The other day I was shooting at a local railroad museum, and had to change film... had the devil of a time getting the leader to stick in the take-up spool...
Take your time; it's a methodical process...
Leica was breaking new territory with the Barnack cameras - there was no pre-packaged 35mm film before the Leica: folks had to bulk-load 35mm cinema film.
You'll get the hang of it !
Regards,
Luddite Frank
1) TRIM THE FILM ! If the concept were criticial enough for Leitz to print a diagram in the bottom of the camera, then the method must have merit !!!
I hold the new cassette in my right hand, grab the tab between my left thumb & forefinger, and slowly pull-out "three fingers' worth" of film across the palm of my left hand.
Then I take some small scissors (curved cuticle scissors are nice), and between the first and second sprocket-holes out of the cassette, cut in from the edge, curving towards the free end, then straight-on to meet the factory trim on the leader. This method has worked well for me; I usually buy my film in four or six-packs, and trim the whole lot at one sitting before dropping them into my kit bag.
Other guys have success with un-trimmed film in their Leicas, but I would consider that an advanced technique.
2) Film spool: The spool that came with my III-f was a real bugger to catch the film under that spring tab. I gave-up and swapped it with a more friendly spool from an earlier camera.
It looks like your spool has a little depression under the spring-tab: have you tried "pointing" the end of your leader slightly, to rest inside that depression ? That might help get things started...
I try to grip the film very close to the end, so there's as little flex as possible... it's a fiddly process, for sure.
The other day I was shooting at a local railroad museum, and had to change film... had the devil of a time getting the leader to stick in the take-up spool...
Take your time; it's a methodical process...
Leica was breaking new territory with the Barnack cameras - there was no pre-packaged 35mm film before the Leica: folks had to bulk-load 35mm cinema film.
You'll get the hang of it !
Regards,
Luddite Frank
payasam
a.k.a. Mukul Dube
With a IIIc I had a spool like the one in your picture. The spring had to be raised with a fingernail before the tip of the leader would go under it.
LukeC
Newbie
Thanks a lot for all your responses, I'm hugely impressed with the helpfulness and responsiveness of these forums. Its a fantastic resource.
Anyway, I've managed to load my first roll of film which is actually quite exciting and satisfying. My problem was that the spool was so tight that it didn't seem like it was meant to be forced, but with a bit of fiddling I've managed to insert the end.
As for trimming the film, I've got my head around the how's and why's now and it all makes perfect sense. I just couldn't grasp what the trimming was for.
Now all I need to do is work on metering by eye and hoping I get the right exposures. I'm sure that'll take a bit of practice. I think shooting with a 135mm lens through a 50mm viewfinder will be interesting as well, especially with my average eyesight.
Anyway thanks again and I'll try to show the results as soon as possible.
Anyway, I've managed to load my first roll of film which is actually quite exciting and satisfying. My problem was that the spool was so tight that it didn't seem like it was meant to be forced, but with a bit of fiddling I've managed to insert the end.
As for trimming the film, I've got my head around the how's and why's now and it all makes perfect sense. I just couldn't grasp what the trimming was for.
Now all I need to do is work on metering by eye and hoping I get the right exposures. I'm sure that'll take a bit of practice. I think shooting with a 135mm lens through a 50mm viewfinder will be interesting as well, especially with my average eyesight.
Anyway thanks again and I'll try to show the results as soon as possible.
rtphotos
Established
Greetings Luke,
For ease in processing and getting back prints, you might find Kodak's CN400 Bl&Wh film convenient. Any lab that does C-41 processing can do it for you. 400 ISO film will offer you higher shutter speeds for your hand-held shots, esp. helpful when shooting with the 135mm lens.
I tried shooting a 90mm lens on my IIf. My first roll was all over the place, but it's possible, and with practice you can guesstimate the lens coverage in the camera's viewfinder. But I just didn't feel very comfortable with it, or perhaps the force wasn't with me.
Fortunately, I rarely shoot with lens longer than 50mm on my Leicas.
If you decide that you like shooting with your 135mm, you might consider eventually acquiring an external viewfinder. Others can suggest a decent one.
As for metering, use the "sunny 16 rule" for now, or take along a camera with a meter. Many of us Barnack users find a small hand-held meter indispensable, and not necessarily expensive. You can search the archives for many recent discussions on "favorite compact meters".
Looking forward to seeing your photos from down under.
Good luck!
rt
ps. Which 50mm f/2 lens do you have?
For ease in processing and getting back prints, you might find Kodak's CN400 Bl&Wh film convenient. Any lab that does C-41 processing can do it for you. 400 ISO film will offer you higher shutter speeds for your hand-held shots, esp. helpful when shooting with the 135mm lens.
I tried shooting a 90mm lens on my IIf. My first roll was all over the place, but it's possible, and with practice you can guesstimate the lens coverage in the camera's viewfinder. But I just didn't feel very comfortable with it, or perhaps the force wasn't with me.
Fortunately, I rarely shoot with lens longer than 50mm on my Leicas.If you decide that you like shooting with your 135mm, you might consider eventually acquiring an external viewfinder. Others can suggest a decent one.
As for metering, use the "sunny 16 rule" for now, or take along a camera with a meter. Many of us Barnack users find a small hand-held meter indispensable, and not necessarily expensive. You can search the archives for many recent discussions on "favorite compact meters".
Looking forward to seeing your photos from down under.
Good luck!
rt
ps. Which 50mm f/2 lens do you have?
LukeC
Newbie
Thanks - I've been making sure I've had one of my digital bodies with me to meter / use as a rule of thumb - though i have done a little bit of manual metering on an old film body before so hopefully my estimations are ok, though I'm going to have a look at light meters as well if this role of film shows the camera is in good working condition.
To be honest, the 135mm will probably get very minimal use, but I'll try it to test all the same. I'm currently running through some Ilford 400 c41 film (was going to use some b&w film but the processing seems quite expensive for now). I also want to get my hands on a roll of 1600 c41 but doesn't seem to be too popular (I have a thing for grainy b&w shots).
To be honest, the 135mm will probably get very minimal use, but I'll try it to test all the same. I'm currently running through some Ilford 400 c41 film (was going to use some b&w film but the processing seems quite expensive for now). I also want to get my hands on a roll of 1600 c41 but doesn't seem to be too popular (I have a thing for grainy b&w shots).
LukeC
Newbie
rtphotos - I only just read your question at the bottom that you posted earlier, must have missed it before. I have a Summitar. Not sure of the difference between them all but I believe its a coated lens?? maybe. I could have that wrong.