in this day of auto everything cameras...

[hteasley]

I doubt he means that. What he means is that what was added wasn't added because cameras of 30 years ago weren't cutting it. The features were added in order to keep selling cameras every couple of years. Many of us here don't like those features, so we are cynical.

I have come to not like them, too: I loved my D90, but as I turned more and more of the auto features off, I felt my photos got better and better.

But really, I think your take is too cynical. Pro photographers, it seems to me, have had their jobs get easier and easier as these cameras have improved and improved. And by "improved", I mean "added features that help them more easily and reliably get a good, reportorial photo, suitable for publication".

 

[Marc G.]

ive tried full automation. went to aperture priority quickly. but once i dumped the dslr and treated myself with my m6ttl i dont want to look back.

people forget that photography itself is a handcraft. if you know what ure doing its okay to use AE because you know whether the camera gets it right from the numbers.

automation without background knowledge and experience is something for people who dont care about how to shoot.

to me the journey to getting the shot is worth just as much as the final result

 

[pismo923]

I will chime in on this as at present I am down to two 35mm cameras - a Pentax H2 and Hexar AF. Considerably different tools but in many situations can achieve the exact same result. For me, using the Pentax usually means adding at least one or two additional steps. That is fine and can be very rewarding if I mange to nail a shot here and there. I do enjoy the whole "do everything yourself" approach required by the Pentax, but the Hexar's automation and to a lesser extent AF instills more confidence in me that I will get a usable shot in when conditions e.g. lighting or moving subjects are changing rapidly. If I could only take one camera with me on a once in a lifetime trip it would be the Hexar. For me the automation makes it more versatile. I can always use it in manual mode if I want/need. I can't add anything to the Pentax. With either camera one has to have an understanding of the fundamentals of exposure to get the most out of it - no getting around that.

 

[siracusa]

is it my laziness that makes auto everything so appealing?
i have shot the same forever...aperture priority or at least set the aperure i want with a manual camera.
i love auto focus...
what's the strong appeal of staying in manual mode?

Looking at your images it's obviously not down to laziness...but then again, taking your question as a prompt for discussion, a reason I use aperture priority (e.g. on X100) is down to convenience, although I'll very often also dial in some exposure compensation before taking the shot or even raising the camera to my eye. With the M2 there's obviously no auto, and I do find that slows me down and in turn I feel it is beneficial. I can be impulsive and impatient so with my personality, anything that slows me down helps, and I think it tends to improve my pictures.
Having said that, I dislike using autofocus. I'm not that bothered about sharpness, but I like the control I get over focus. Sometimes I might focus a shot and slightly defocus it - an example being here:

http://www.rangefinderforum.com/photopost/data/500/Street_music1.jpg

I find it far easier to control how I focus (and how I might unfocus slightly if I choose to) by doing it manually - having more control over it. But the technology these days is so fantastic I'm sure an autofocus camera would also allow me to do this and give me heaps of control if only I'd spend time getting used to it. Perhaps I should just learn. So maybe, going back to your point (and applying it only to myself), perhaps the reverse can be true and there are ways in which it is simply out of laziness that I sometimes refuse to go auto...and there's a further irony: I often get frustrated when the autofocus misfocuses or focuses on a slightly different point than intended, but truth be told, its misfocus rate will probably lower than my misfocus rate...
So manual, auto: I guess I'm just glad we have the choice.

 

[daveleo]

cynicism is the new enlightenment . . . .

I'm gonna have a sweatshirt silkscreened with that one !

 

[rhl-oregon]

Multi-point AF cameras often pick weird things to focus on, instead of what I want. Most often, some periphery foreground object gets the focus instead of my subject.

That too is why I cut back from what Panasonic likes to call Intelligent Auto on anything longer than 28mm. Or as Godfrey put it, I didn't like seeing shot after shot in 85% focus. I trust AF on the GRD (28 equivalent) and the 14 2.5 on the m43, and am working on more exact framing with the 50 2.5 on the GXR. But those are the only AF options I use (except the Hexar AF).

 

[tunalegs]

My favorite SLRs still have spinning shutter dials and preset aperture operation... My only want is to know how the camera works. I don't even know what half the settings on my Canon Rebel do, so I don't use them.

 

[jsrockit]

But really, I think your take is too cynical. Pro photographers, it seems to me, have had their jobs get easier and easier as these cameras have improved and improved. And by "improved", I mean "added features that help them more easily and reliably get a good, reportorial photo, suitable for publication".

No doubt about it...which is why I said "many of us here" 🙂

It's helped the home snapshot crowd too.

 

[jsrockit]

if you know what ure doing its okay to use AE because you know whether the camera gets it right from the numbers.

automation without background knowledge and experience is something for people who dont care about how to shoot.

This about sums it up.

 

[oftheherd]

Control. The desire that any mistakes should be down to ME, not to a programmer in Solms or Osaka. The belief that I'm likelier to get it right than they are. If you don't believe any of that, why not use as point-and-shoot, and stick with snapshots?

Cheers,

R.

Yes, I like to be in control as well. But years ago I did go for a Fuji ST 901 not only because of the screw mount lens, but the auto exposure. All my reading told me it worked, and when I got it, it in fact worked very well. Early auto focus didn't get good reviews, so I didn't jump into it. To say nothing of the fact that the lenses I had by the time auto focus started to look OK, wouldn't have fit any of the cameras I could afford.

And by that time I was very happy with what I had. My eyes were still very good, I had good depth of field checking capability, life was good. When I got auto focus and exposure with P&S, I found auto focus took to long to work. Turned off again.

So, I know what works for me with my film cameras that only have auto exposure. I am comfortable with it. I don't want to change. But there are times when my Sony 6mp P&S is all I want with me. I think P&S cameras have their place in the world as well. And I have been thinking of a DSLR lately, but not seriously. I am too invested in film.

YMMV. Everyone gets to choose what they prefer.

 

[Lss]

I trust AF on the GRD (28 equivalent) and the 14 2.5 on the m43

I have pretty bad experience with the Panasonic 14/2.5 AF performance on OM-D. Nothing worse than any competing AF I can think of, but not something that I can really trust.

 

[eliev]

You can use auto and still be aware of your cameras settings. I use some type of auto on my fujis always... generally shutter priority and auto ISO. I pop into manual mode when I feel the need is there (I need a specific aperture). On the M8, I only use manual because I cannot trust the high ISO on that camera.

I find that people put a lot more stock in technical aspects of photography than the image itself. Nobody (except maybe some photographers) cares:

- how many keepers you got per roll or if you took 100,000 images to get your shot
- what shutter speed or aperture you used
- how low you can handhold your camera's shutter speed
- how you achieved focus or exposure
- how much you were in control

The viewing public is concerned (if you are lucky) with your photograph. How you get there is your personal way of doing things and is no more valid than someone else's way of doing things.

Let's face it, once you have your head around exposure, focusing, etc. it pretty much becomes a given. It's not that hard of a concept.

Exactly! Couldn't have said it better myself!

 

[unixrevolution]

...why are so many still fixated on shooting in manual mode?

i think that me, an old fart, asking this question is kinda funny. it's usually us oldsters that are the dyed in the wool diehards.

but i wonder why, sincerely.

is it my laziness that makes auto everything so appealing?

i have shot the same forever...aperture priority or at least set the aperure i want with a manual camera.
i love auto focus...

what's the strong appeal of staying in manual mode?

I have several auto-everything cameras, including some AE-only point and shoots. There is something cathartic about just composing, but the manual controls on cameras that have them give you the ability to tell the camera what to do.

The truth is, as nice as some cameras are with AE and autofocus, sometimes cameras are just plain stupid. The essential difference, to me, between a good camera and a bad camera, is the ability to tell it what to do when it's too dumb to figure it out.

All-manual cameras, of course, do this by default. They just get out of your way and let you make all the decisions, and thereby make you a better photographer who internalizes all the decisions and doesn't have to think about it so hard anymore.

 

[Spanik]

Another point is that I use several cameras (more or less) at the same time. I always have film in at least 3 cameras and take out depending on what I want to do and the mood of the day. For a lot of those auto features you need to know the camera damn well and how it will react.

If you use manual this isn't an issue as you set everything yourself. No need to remember that camera A underexposes 1 stop with a white wall, but camera B's metering is narrower and doesn't have do that. Measure it with the handheld meter, set exposure and you're good to go whatever you have in your hand. No need to check which of the 30 autofocus points light because you performed the act of focussing yourself.

 

[zuiko85]

Well today I found the battery dead in my 35RC and the battery packet empty. Didn't want to drive to Walgreens to buy the #675 hearing aid zinc-air batteries I use (to replace the mercury PX 13). So I went manual with a little help from a Gossen Pilot.


Is that OK?

I normally use aperture preferred auto if the camera is so equipped.