Incident Metering

[Bill Pierce]

Kurt Freund, the cameraman on Metropolis (and because he like to work even when very well off and past retirement age, the Lassie TV series) developed the incident meter, the hand held meter with the half a ping-pong ball over the meter cel. Close up, reflected light meterings of the movies' latin lover and fair princess rendered their skin tones the same shade of grey. Measuring the incident light falling on them rendered the latin lover dark and dangerous and the fair princess fair.

A bunch of us who made our money shooting exposure critical color transparency films for the mags found the handheld, incident meter to be the most effective way to determine correct exposure in a number of situations - portraits, people shots, interiors and shots where the important subject was in an environment that was brighter or darker than them. Digital isn't too far from color reversal. Overexposed areas are the digital equivalent of clear film base. And, unless you can control your lighting, you often just let the shadows fall where they may.

A bunch of us who shoot a lot of our digital with prime lenses (The actual T-stops of zooms with many elements and marked only with f/stops may demand TTL metering.) are still using our incident meters - with great success. Of course, when you have the time and light levels that let you check your histograms, you do it. And scenes like landscapes are going to be done best with the TTL meter and histogram check.

This system is so effective, and , yet, I only see it used by elderly journalists, studio photographers and cinematographers. Is there anybody else out there who isn't using TTL/automatic???

Bill

 

[Bob Michaels]

The only way I use a hand held meter is in the incident mode. That is the only way I meter when shooting chrome. Now sometimes I will tweak the incident reading for subject luminance. But incident reading matched with a bit of brain seem to be bulletproof. Sort of like using guide numbers with flash.

Oh course b&w metering is some combination of sunny 16, SWAG, TTL, or incident. But always matched with a bit of brain as well.

 

[charjohncarter]

Sorry, I don't use digital very much, but when I do, I find that if I check an exposure with my incident meter, when using my prime lenses, I only use primes anyway, my exposures are better (without bracketing). But I read that camera companies know that tradition film metering (by a meter) will cause DSLRs to overexpose (because of the slightly narrower latitude of digital vs slide film and blow highlights, in turn the camera companies adjust their TTL). Anyway, yes, I would meter any important shot with both a reflective and incident meter when using digital (and film), but only if it is important. I have yet to take an important image with digital though. Maybe this sounds stupid to you being someone that has made a life of photography, but to a retired geezer this is what I do.

 

[ItsReallyDarren]

Since I started shooting film Ive always been trying to improve my exposures through any means. At first I relied on my cameras meter but soon realized that different cameras have different meters and each read light slightly different from each other. I also got tired of buying different batteries for different cameras.

I picked up a Gossen Luna Pro and never looked back. The first few weeks were trying as I learned how to meter correctly using incident mode. This included changing development times as well as EI's of films. As I started improving using incident metering came second hand, I started noticing better and more consistent exposures for my negatives wheter it was an entire roll that was overexposed or correctly exposed. I knew I was doing something right when all the images came out consistent. I like incident metering so much I bought an extra Gossen for a backup.

I just started shooting a little more than a year ago so Ive still got a bit to learn, I will admit though, I dont purely use incident in tricky situations. I sometimes slide the dome off the Gossen to take a reflected reading when I just dont feel confident or I cant get the dome in the correct light source of what Im photographing.

The more I used incident the less I trusted TTL meters, with incident the same light source would give consistent readings. Even with TTL's I remember getting different exposure recommendations because of the scene, maybe I was just terrible at using TTL meters....

Ive also noticed that I now rate films at their box speed usually, before with TTL I would downrate a film a stop or two with the same development times.

So to answer your question; yes I use incident metering, and I like it.

 

[tedwin]

I use an incident meter often. With my M3 as it has no built in meter. And with portraits - I haven't yet met a subject that finds a photographer peering at the LCD on the back of the camera muttering 'don't worry this is just a test shot' confidence inspiring.

If I'm sensible with positioning and direction I nearly always get it right first time, very satisfying.

For the record, I'm 34.

Ted.

 

[literiter]

When I shot slides with my M4-P and Gossen Luna Pro in incident mode I had better and more consistent results than with my F3 and it's TTL meter.

I think the results from a friends Nikon F4 are very good with slides. Very consistent. In fact if I were going to shoot a lot of slides again I'd consider getting one.

 

[blackwave]

I don't fall into the elderly journalist, studio photog, or cine guy and I happily use my incident meter the vast majority of the time. I'm just some 27 year old punk hobbyist 🙂 If I'm not using the handheld incident, I'm using good ol' sunny 16.

For me it was sort of an awakening to the real foundation of exposure, and I realized just how simple it actually is. Learning on reflected TTL meters really complicated things in my mind and I never could quite get the grasp of the basic essence of exposure until I switched. I experimented with a grey card briefly, and something just clicked.. the transistion to incident meters was natural. Further, I really started being more sensitive to changes in light, I think because I had to watch it to know when I needed another reading.

Also, it's nice to browse used cameras knowing that it makes no difference if the meter is broken. Oh the deals to be had!

 

[ARCHIVIST]

I have been using incident readings from my Weston Euromaster since I bought it new in 1978!

I shoot only film, black & white, and now mainly urban landscape so reflected readings are used more than incident at this stage for me.

When shooting neo-anthropological studies ( wanky title for people insitu - in their normal environs ) I always took incident readings and obtained excellent results.

On one occasion I was a long way form the subject as the nature of the photo required so an incident reading was not possible - I noticed the light hitting me was the same as the person I wanted to photograph so I took the incident reading as if the back of my hand was the subject - worked well.

Regards
Peter

 

[Nh3]

I use a incident meter regularly and I cannot even imagine working without one.

But when I just want to get a proper exposure and nothing creative then I use the matrix metering and compensate.

 

[Al Kaplan]

I mostly use a Weston Master V with the Invercone incident afdapter, occasionaly my humongous Minolta Autometer. Incident is the only way I meter. At one point in the early days of through the lens metering Topcon made an incident dome to screw into your camera lens. For awhile Spiratone made them also.

 

[KenD]

The incident dome almost never gets moved on my Gossen. I find incident works best for me with both slide and neg film.

 

[Livesteamer]

I've been taking pictures for forty years now. A few years back I bought my first incident light meter, a Sekonic 398 and it's been one of my best investments ever. Nothing better than an M3 and a good incident meter. Joe

 

[MCTuomey]

If I'm not using a handheld meter, then I'm using TTL, reading off my hand (and opening 1 stop up from there) in the same light as my subject. My dumbed-down version of the zone method for people pix. Works well for me.

 

[RicardoD]

I bought a Gossen Luna Pro on ebay about 2 years ago, upgraded it to accept modern batteries and use it with my Rolleiflex. I am still learning how to expose properly and the Gossen incident meter goes a long way towards helpng me out. I wish it was smaller but it was cheap, I fixed it, it works great and so I am attached to it.

 

[payasam]

I use a hand-held meter with my M2, incident whenever possible. With my digital SLR I use the built-in meter, adjusting rarely because the raw files are pretty flexible. When I shot slides with a Canon SLR, I would take a reading off my palm with the camera's TTL meter and open up one stop.

 

[Roger Hicks]

For tranny and digi, exposure is keyed to the highlight: you are worried about the highlight 'blowing' to a featureless white. In this case the artificial highlight or artificial mid-tone method is quickest and easiest, whether you use an incident meter (far and away the easiest), the palm of your hand, a sheet of white paper or even a grey card. So: I use incident for tranny.

For neg, exposure is keyed to the shadows: you are worried about their 'blocking' to a featureless black (in the print -- clear film on the neg). The only way to be sure that you are giving adequate exposure to the shadows, and no more than you need, is to read the shadows directly, ideally with a spot meter. So: I use spot for neg.

Actually, I don't worry that much about either because pretty much ANY metering system will work well if you know how to interpret the meter reading and compensate accordingly, which I've pretty much learned to do in 40+ years -- or for that matter, I can usually guess with remarkable accuracy, again on the basis of 40+ years' taking pictures. Sure, there are difficult subjects where I use incident or spot, and there are times when I'm lazy and take readings rather than trying to think it through, but as Garry Coward-Williams, late of AP, says, "How is it that it's unusual for any two meters to agree exactly, but most people get correct exposures?"

Incidentally, my understanding of movies is that spot metering was always very popular, with the star's skin tone as the key tone. Certes, the SEI Photometer enjoyed and for all I know may still enjoy cult status in Hollywood.

Cheers,

R.

 

[literiter]

Imagine my chagrin when watching a younger friend of mine setting up his camera. He composes the image through the meterless finder and sets the speed and aperture. He sets f8 @ 1/60 with no meter.

When I do a incident reading this is what I get exactly, f8 @ 1/60. He is always spot on I have found. Always. His exposures are spot on as well.

I think this is a marvelous ability and perhaps one to learn.

 

[Bill Pierce]

For tranny and digi, exposure is keyed to the highlight: you are worried about the highlight 'blowing' to a featureless white. In this case the artificial highlight or artificial mid-tone method is quickest and easiest, whether you use an incident meter (far and away the easiest), the palm of your hand, a sheet of white paper or even a grey card. So: I use incident for tranny.

For neg, exposure is keyed to the shadows: you are worried about their 'blocking' to a featureless black (in the print -- clear film on the neg). The only way to be sure that you are giving adequate exposure to the shadows, and no more than you need, is to read the shadows directly, ideally with a spot meter. So: I use spot for neg.

Actually, I don't worry that much about either because pretty much ANY metering system will work well if you know how to interpret the meter reading and compensate accordingly, which I've pretty much learned to do in 40+ years -- or for that matter, I can usually guess with remarkable accuracy, again on the basis of 40+ years' taking pictures. Sure, there are difficult subjects where I use incident or spot, and there are times when I'm lazy and take readings rather than trying to think it through, but as Garry Coward-Williams, late of AP, says, "How is it that it's unusual for any two meters to agree exactly, but most people get correct exposures?"

Incidentally, my understanding of movies is that spot metering was always very popular, with the star's skin tone as the key tone. Certes, the SEI Photometer enjoyed and for all I know may still enjoy cult status in Hollywood.

Cheers,

R.

Roger -

Good system.

What I've always done with negative film and incident meters (beside the simple system of cutting the EI in half and praying) is take a regular reading, then take a second reading casting a shadow on the hemisphere with my hand - and using an exposure between the two. Overcast days, hardly any change in the two readings. Sunny days, big change between the two reading and significant increase in exposure over the "straight" incident reading.

As to the treasured SEI, whenever I've been working movie sets and the DP sees my spotmeter, it gets pulled into play or reminds the DP to get out their spot meter. Invariably, the exposure is determined with the incident meter and the spot meter is used to determine the relative brightness of specific objects/backgrounds/e.t.c. when that exposure is used. But it's getting harder and harder to find a really good spotmeter. With high end digital doing more and more features, maybe they'll just do a close up histogram.

Bill

 

[Roger Hicks]

Roger -

(1) ...negative film and incident meters (beside the simple system of cutting the EI in half and praying)

(2) . . . whenever I've been working movie sets and the DP sees my spotmeter, it gets pulled into play or reminds the DP to get out their spot meter. Invariably, the exposure is determined with the incident meter and the spot meter is used to determine the relative brightness of specific objects/backgrounds/e.t.c. . . .

(Abbreviated and numbered for ease of reply)

Dear Bill,

(1) Hey, you're giving away trade secrets.

(2) Sounds like what I would have expected. As I say, I was speaking only from what I'd heard; you're speaking from experience.

Kenko showed a prototype new spot meter at photokina; I have high hopes of it.

Cheers,

R.

 

[Nokton48]

I'm happy with my Minolta Autometer II, took it out this week with my M2. Or I use my new M5, love the spot metering system in that.