Is Kiev the most complex rangefinder camera ever made?

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Brian Sweeney said:
I don't need the money. I do it more as a favor. Ask anyone who as asked me to adjust a lens.

If the Soviet lenses had been adjusted correctly in the first place, I would not have to spend my time working on them.

And I do not need a little ASSHOLE telling me this.
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i dont know why are you so upset about? i also know how to adjust lens and i dont need great brian sweeney to do that for me and especially i dont need him to bombard me with same info about adjusting.
i also adjusted i61 for contax and offered to do that for free long time ago. but i didnt start reply about converting whenever someone talked about i61.
also i dont want to listen some BIG ASSHOLE telling me im a little asshole.

edit: sorry zhang if i ruined your topic. i wasnt intended to do that. i just wanted to say few things about prejudices about russian optics and some members went crazy.
 
Of course you know you ruined this topic! Don't pretend, how could your comments have done otherwise?

There is an intriguing story behind the Kievs, and the insights it gives us into the Soviet industry of the time. It is far more complex than simplistic jibes about drunken workers, or ludicrous accusations against the Western powers. Unfortunately, you've ensured it's a story that won't be addressed on this thread!
 
nzeeman said:
...........- how then you started to make so many jokes in your countries. every movie , every historical tv show - you always make fun of east europe, russia, and even germany. if there is someone who is untolerant to other countries its britain and its people. if you think of us eastern people as equal to you -why do i have to be strapped to my underwear if i come to your countries. you people treat us like animals - i have to wait for visas for days just to get out of country. please dont sell me that sweet talk when you know the truth - 99% of people in your country will tell that russian cameras and cars are crap........
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Hi folks.
I must say that after spending several months both in London and Paris, I was personally subject of rascist attitudes, not for being Jewish but for being foreigner. This happened to me both at common daily life, and with the authorities at the Hitro airport, some 20 years ago. One day, in different circumstances, we may laugh all together upon the small stories I got there.

In order to maintain my own equilibrium towards life, in which optimism is a central element, I use to differentiate between The People and The Political Regime. According to formal democracy, one is the product of the other. According to my experience it is true, but in the opposite direction. Political regimes are the instigators of the worst instincts among the common people, instead of fighting those instincts. This is done more bluntly or more elegantly and subtle according to the Regime in question, but this is the source - not the other way around. Regimes play with people minds. All regimes. And for wealth, of course.

As a personal experience I would like to tell that since being a kid I always asked myself, how could it be possible for the systematic extermination of Jews to take place. Is the human being that bad ? Of course racist people are everywhere and many of my fellow Israelis are not a bad actual example. But from here to systematic extermination there is a long long way. So how was it possible ?

Now I could give an academic type answer but I will not. I will just mention that at the entrance to the new wing of the Jerusalem Holocaust Museum there is a kind of TV, replaying unusual documentaries filmed at the 30's, showing Hitler and Co. arousing the unprecedent wave of hate and fanatism, on which the rided to Power and WWII. The documentary film is very good in letting you feel it. Once you see it, you feel it, then it becomes very simple and frightening.

Ruling a country is an extremely complex game, of the worst moral level (I am using my best moderated language), light years far from the good sammaritan going to vote once each four or five years.

So I have had my share of seeing by myself racists of several nationalities and within my family too. But let us not confuse ourselves about who is the wagon and who is the horse.

Cheers,
Ruben

PS
I will leave to the German fellows of good will to criticize the past. I will leave to the English good fellows to criticize their less good folks with which they happen to have the bad luck to live with, etc, etc.

My problem is not having got a beat from a stupid officer at Hitro. twenty years ago, but the daily beating My country is inflicting around, and having to live with the blind folks here supporting it. Fortunately, humans are different one from the other.
 
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you people should be much more relaxed about this. its not end of the world. i dont want to stop talking about photography but i also want to wake people. to make them read something thats different than things they used to. tthats the point of growing up - capability to understand others point of view and not to get upset about it.
 
nzeeman said:
.....

edit: sorry zhang if i ruined your topic. i wasnt intended to do that. i just wanted to say few things about prejudices about russian optics and some members went crazy.
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nzeeman, It's O.K. Although I was not there when your people was hurt, I may understand your feeling. Once Japanese products were called craps, but now they gained respect. Chinese and Russian products may go the same way. It takes time.:)

Cheers,

Zhang
 
zhang xk said:
nzeeman, It's O.K. Although I was not there when your people was hurt, I may understand your feeling. Once Japanese products were called craps, but now they gained respect. Chinese and Russian products may go the same way. It takes time.:)

Cheers,

Zhang
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thank you zhang for your understanding. (and btw people who were hurt is smallest problem people get hurt and they either get well or die -and we will all die one day...- biggest problem is ignorance in the world :( - it will take time for people to understand i see now)
in future i will try to speak less but also i think that i was a nice member of rff until today - now everybody hates me (that was fast :D ) :(
 
nzeeman said:
....also i think that i was a nice member of rff until today - now everybody hates me (that was fast :D ) :(
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And I think from today I may be less welcomed at my regional group. :D

What a nice think is that RFF is mutlinational ! :)
 
greyhoundman said:
Actually if I thought you were worth it, I might work up a mad.
But little losers don't garner much of my energy these days.
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as i said - ignorance is worst thing...
 
zhang xk said:
Here are some images of Great Wall DF 120 SLRs.
Zhang
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The one I owned was the same as the one on the right. I repeat, if it had been better assembled, i.e. no glue on the mirror, and no loose elements in the lens, it might have been a good camera. Was there more than one standard lens available, on mine it was a three element front cell focussing Haiou, which even with the elements tightened up was easily outperformed by the Lubitel. As I said close but no cocoanut. The idea of a simple 120 SLR is attractive, perhaps an updated version by the factory could have proved a winner.:rolleyes:
 
my oh my, what a little discussion we have going here...

i thought i'd take this opportunity to remind all that this is a rf camera forum (mostly) and that sex and politics have no real place in our discussions, tho pics of one i enjoy much more than pics of the other...;)

and with that i will be closing this thread, thanks to those who brought this one to my attention.

joe
 
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