Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
NeeZee
Well-known
I've got a perfectly clean 1936 Summar whose front element looks to have been coated post war and it's a MUCH better lens than a collapsible Summicron with slight "cleaning marks" I used to own. Of course it's not great wide open, but which vintage lens really is? Just use a hood and shoot it wide open only if you have to (again, that's true for all vintage lenses...).
Here are two examples: first one on Agfa APX100, second one Agfa Precisa Slide film, both with the Leica IIIf. A perfectly fine lens, just saying
Untitled by Thomas Niesenhaus, on Flickr
Untitled by Thomas Niesenhaus, on Flickr
Erik van Straten
Veteran
Hmmm, postwar Leitz restored and coated Summars are great, but indeed you are not longer prewar there. They are very rare too.
The Summitar isn't my cup of tea: too much pincushion distortion.
The Collapsible Summicron is very nice, but finding one free of scratches can be a lifetime job.
Leica IIIc, Summar 50mm f/2 postwar coated, Tmax400.
Erik.
Interesting to read your comment about the Summitar's pincushion distortion, Erik. I've noticed it myself, but never thought it was overly obvious, and even KR rates it as "very minor pincushion distortion". Seems quite similar to the amount that the Skopar 50/2.5 exhibits, actually.
Erik van Straten
Veteran
Hmm, See for yourself. Compared to this, the Color-Skopar is free from distortion.
My Summitar is like new, prewar, uncoated with a diaphragm of 10 blades, no. 508151.
I am very unhappy with my lens.
Jon, who is "KR"?
Erik.
Summitar:
Summitar:
David Hughes
David Hughes
Hi,
Judging by the advert's for the Summitar in the 1930's magazines I have, I don't think the Summar ever had a lot of enthusiastic users. I regard it as a display item although I have used if now and again. As for cleaning and so on I think it possible to get it cleaned and coated but for a price and little real gain.
Strangely enough the USSR clones (50mm f/2 FED) of it I've seen and used and owned were in far better condition than my Summars. I guess buying an old lens is always a gamble, you never know what the previous owners have done with them.
Regards, David
Judging by the advert's for the Summitar in the 1930's magazines I have, I don't think the Summar ever had a lot of enthusiastic users. I regard it as a display item although I have used if now and again. As for cleaning and so on I think it possible to get it cleaned and coated but for a price and little real gain.
Strangely enough the USSR clones (50mm f/2 FED) of it I've seen and used and owned were in far better condition than my Summars. I guess buying an old lens is always a gamble, you never know what the previous owners have done with them.
Regards, David
Erik van Straten
Veteran
Erik van Straten
Veteran
In this shot the pincushion distortion of the Color-Skopar is visible.
Leica IIIc, Color-Skopar 50mm f/2.5, Tmax400.
Erik.
Leica IIIc, Color-Skopar 50mm f/2.5, Tmax400.
Erik.
traveler_101
American abroad
Interesting! How can you tell, though?
I read somewhere here that there is an artisan in Japan who will actually RESURFACE old lenses. I might have bookmarked a link if anyone is interested. It wasn't that outrageous price wise and then, if the lens is mechanically good, you have a decent period lens if you need Leica.
"Gamble" - you said it. I am out two hundred bucks with my little gamble on a Summar. You know the song - "you've got to know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em, know when to walk away and know when to run." After doing a lot of losing I finally scored a sweet Jupiter 12 for $55. You have to read the 'faces' of the other players.
David Hughes
David Hughes
Hi,
Mostly by reading the prices for the Summitar and Summar as trade-ins and when sold privately and the rave adverts for the Summitar that seemed to me to knock the Summar a bit.
But my heap of 1930's magazines and brochures is about 3 ft high and finding, scanning and so on would take just too long. Sorry.
Regards, David
traveler_101
American abroad
Hey guy,
I believe you! Interesting research you are doing. Do you have a Summitar then? I always wondered whether to buy one.
Whateverist
Well-known
Feel free to share that link
Dralowid
Michael
I don't know anything about optical tolerances but if an element needs fairly aggressive polishing to remove scratches or the effects of fungus etc, surely it will no longer do what is was originally intended to do? Multiply this by the six elements ie 12 surfaces in a Summar and what would you end up with?
I guess you mean Yamazaki-san. Polishing and coating the front element of a Summar is one of his specialties. He says in the article linked below that there is some tolerance built into optical designs so it's possible to remove a thin layer (up to 5/100 mm) and still retain the same optical properties.
http://camerafan.jp/cc_sp.php?i=152
All of the information I've read on this suggests that with a Summar it's usually only the front element that needs repolishing. I'm not sure how many surfaces Yamazaki-san coats but it could only be a max of eight as it wouldn't make sense to split elements that are cemented together to coat those surfaces.
David Hughes
David Hughes
Hi,
If you get a good one then you should be pleased and delighted. I use mine on the IIIc as they are the same year and have no complaints. Here's a couple of samples;
Regards, David
Vince Lupo
Whatever
If you are willing to try something a bit 'out of the ordinary', this might just fix the front element of that lens. Get yourself some chrome polish (either SimiChrome, Blue Magic etc). The key with these polishes is that they are non-abrasive. Take a microfiber cleaning cloth, put a little dab of this polish on the cloth, then slowly (and without applying too much pressure) work it around that front element. Then take a clean microfiber cloth and remove the polish. Do this a few times and you will likely notice that fingerprint residue will disappear.
I have tried this with a few lenses as you describe, and have gotten fantastic results.
Here is what I used:
Tried this most recently with a Xenon lens -- before:
After:
Worth a try!
02Pilot
Malcontent
Yep, metal polishes can work remarkably well with uncoated lenses. Nothing to lose by trying.
raid
Dad Photographer
Does the cream remove coating if the lens is coated? I bet, it does.
Vince Lupo
Whatever
The Xenon lens above was a coated lens (I no longer have the lens), and it didn't seem to affect the coating. As well, I just tried it with a 50/2 Sonnar lens that is also coated, and didn't affect it.