M. Valdemar
Well-known
PS: It's supposed to have retro styling and the old-style "Nikon" logo, like they put on some of the F5 film cameras.
M. Valdemar
Well-known
All I have to say is "nice Bessa R you've got there."
EVERYONE in rangefinder manufacturing and marketing needs Leica to define the upper end and keep the RF excitement going. Nikon NOT wanting to push Leica under may be a real consideration in Nikon's decision making.
Leica may have its shortcomings, but it is a good company which wants the best for its customers and for photography in general. Everyone I know wants Leica to succeed long term -- and it's been like that for the last 30 years I have been watching the industry.
Stephen
RichardB
Well-known
The reason for the donation is for a tax break. Leitz/Leica products that were formerly owned by Leica have been coming on the market for some time now as I believe they are looking for any and all sources of revenue. It's like purchasing a corporation and selling off the pieces because you can make more than selling the whole. In this caase its to raise money. Believe me there is nothing altruistic about a businessman.
When Kaufmann says "
Basically we provide Leica M photographers with professional caliber low-light performance the traditional Leica way, with our outstanding line of f/2 Summicron and f/1.4 Summilux lenses and the f/1.0 Noctilux. And there will be more to come!"
He means that low-light performance will come from the film cameras and not from the digital rangefinder. The Summurits were an attempt to bring the price of lenses down for the M8 purchaser. Look for a less featured version of the M8 next fall at about 3K to accompany those lenses.
Kaufmann says "Incidentally we will show something else significant for the M system at Photokina, not just lenses." and I believe he means an M8 varient.
"but for the time being all I can tell you is what you already know -- high performance wide-angle and ultra speed lenses are a longstanding Leica tradition". Look for the new Noctilux with ASPH which will be much sharper than the older lens and it will THE Leica lens to have.
The rumor of the 24mm 1.4 will also come true. The 24mm is the most widely used WA in this range so it won't be 28mm or 21mm.
Nikon redeveloped the know how to produce rangefinder cameras with the remake of the 'S' cameras. I don't think they wiil waste that effort. The S existed side by side with the Nikon F, the best SLR EVER made and indeed used much of the same techknowledgy. The outstanding success of the Nikon F put the S rangefinder to bed. Look for a Nikon digital FF rangefinder with Nikon lenses. The Japanese are one of the most nationalistic people on this planet. They are not going to market a camera to help support Leica.
They will out 'Leica', Leica.
Well its time to put the crystal ball away.-Dick
When Kaufmann says "
Basically we provide Leica M photographers with professional caliber low-light performance the traditional Leica way, with our outstanding line of f/2 Summicron and f/1.4 Summilux lenses and the f/1.0 Noctilux. And there will be more to come!"
He means that low-light performance will come from the film cameras and not from the digital rangefinder. The Summurits were an attempt to bring the price of lenses down for the M8 purchaser. Look for a less featured version of the M8 next fall at about 3K to accompany those lenses.
Kaufmann says "Incidentally we will show something else significant for the M system at Photokina, not just lenses." and I believe he means an M8 varient.
"but for the time being all I can tell you is what you already know -- high performance wide-angle and ultra speed lenses are a longstanding Leica tradition". Look for the new Noctilux with ASPH which will be much sharper than the older lens and it will THE Leica lens to have.
The rumor of the 24mm 1.4 will also come true. The 24mm is the most widely used WA in this range so it won't be 28mm or 21mm.
Nikon redeveloped the know how to produce rangefinder cameras with the remake of the 'S' cameras. I don't think they wiil waste that effort. The S existed side by side with the Nikon F, the best SLR EVER made and indeed used much of the same techknowledgy. The outstanding success of the Nikon F put the S rangefinder to bed. Look for a Nikon digital FF rangefinder with Nikon lenses. The Japanese are one of the most nationalistic people on this planet. They are not going to market a camera to help support Leica.
They will out 'Leica', Leica.
Well its time to put the crystal ball away.-Dick
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
Ironically Leica would be doing Nikon a huge favour by staying viable for one obvious reason ... they (Leica) have almost managed to clear a path as to what's an acceptable price for a digital rangefinder. If Leica hadn't shot themselves in the foot with numerous gaffs following the release of the M8 (IR issues etc etc etc) they would be selling a hell of a lot more of them!
If Nikon did chose to release a DRF they could price it right up there with the M8 and sales wise the Leica wouldn't stand a chance against it. A lot of potential buyers don't trust Leica any more after the constant hedging and excuses that have been given every time the M8 has tripped over it's own feet ... Nikon have the runs on the board and Kauffman would be well aware of what a Nikon rangefinder would do to M8 sales!
[edit] ... even though I own and love an M8 I still can't accept that a reputable company released a camera with a known major issue (IR) and then tried to placate us by giving us all a couple of free IR filters ... that was the biggest piece of bullsh*t since the Edsel!
If Nikon did chose to release a DRF they could price it right up there with the M8 and sales wise the Leica wouldn't stand a chance against it. A lot of potential buyers don't trust Leica any more after the constant hedging and excuses that have been given every time the M8 has tripped over it's own feet ... Nikon have the runs on the board and Kauffman would be well aware of what a Nikon rangefinder would do to M8 sales!
[edit] ... even though I own and love an M8 I still can't accept that a reputable company released a camera with a known major issue (IR) and then tried to placate us by giving us all a couple of free IR filters ... that was the biggest piece of bullsh*t since the Edsel!
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kevin m
Veteran
I want Leica to succeed, too, but I'm not a fool with my money. When I shot weddings on film, I had two M6TTL bodies and a bag full of M lenses. I hoped and prayed that the M8 would be a digital replacement for my film M's, but it simply isn't, IMO. And since I was actually making money with my Leica bodies, and my opinion governs my spending, Leica should be interested in my opinion. I'm not spending $5k on a "pro" digital body that's as poorly executed as the M8.
I'm glad that some people are having success with them and that the files are to their liking, but if this Nikon rumor proves true, B&H will be selling M8's at close-out prices.
abenner
undecided
This thread has partially gone in a strange and interesting direction regarding an M-mount digital Nikon RF. Anyway, this seems to be a strange notion to me. Not that it may not make sense for a lot of reasons, but it seems to me it would be a slap in the face to all the Nikon RF collectors/users, snatching up $5000 SP reissue kits without question, to make a digital SP, all styled up with that retro logo and probably even a Nippon Kogaku stamp on it, that couldn't swap lenses with my old SP!
xayraa33
rangefinder user and fancier
that will be taken care of once the CV Orion copy adaptor hits the store shelves.
M. Valdemar
Well-known
About 4 years ago I sold this one on eBay for a ridiculously low price. I should have kept it.
The buyer was a certain lucky Nikon expert with the initials R.R.
The buyer was a certain lucky Nikon expert with the initials R.R.
kevin m
Veteran
The reissued Nikon RF's were all built from scratch?
Wow!
dcsang
Canadian & Not A Dentist
Some posts in this thread offer good speculation, so at times I think there may actually be fire where there is only smoke currently.
Then it goes into "let's blue sky" and "think outside the box" and I feel like I'm reading a DPReview thread
Dave
Then it goes into "let's blue sky" and "think outside the box" and I feel like I'm reading a DPReview thread
Dave
aizan
Veteran
i kinda doubt they made 20 m4-2s and m4-ps from scratch, or even modified m6s. that's just too much work. they probably had nos sitting in a warehouse or bought them from dealers like arsenal on ebay.
Berliner
Well-known
I'm with abbner...WHY on earth would Nikon make an 'M mount' rangefinder??? Rather defeatist, no? Will they produce M-mount Nikkors to accompany it? Who'll buy these Nikkors? Who'll make them...CV???
larmarv916
Well-known
Ok...I read the interview from Pop Photography, now Iam really dissapointed with both Leica and Kaufmann as a owner and industrialist. Iam sorry but this sounds like a "rookie" CEO who is reading his "teleprompter" of a sit-comedy skit at Saturday Night Live. I expect to hear.....Tonight Live from New York its......Leica's CEO and guest host "Andy Kaufmann"!!
This guy comes off as a "Bobble-Head" Pretending to say something and yet not actually saying anything of any importance on any level.......Iam waiting for someone to come up rip off the rubber mask and underneath is last CEO. That interview was such a SOFTBALL and stagged skit the people at POP should be ashamed......but hey when your in the boot licking business, anything goes.
Has this guy not read the auction resluts from Weslicht in austria,,, the guy who owns "The Leica Shop" in Vienna. I mean really there is no M4-2 or M4-P...NOS that would come anywhere close to even 20% of that phony claimed value.
I really depresses me to have to get so angry of this guy...but the people in Leica must think we are all just Sheep !!
Best Regards.....Laurance
This guy comes off as a "Bobble-Head" Pretending to say something and yet not actually saying anything of any importance on any level.......Iam waiting for someone to come up rip off the rubber mask and underneath is last CEO. That interview was such a SOFTBALL and stagged skit the people at POP should be ashamed......but hey when your in the boot licking business, anything goes.
Has this guy not read the auction resluts from Weslicht in austria,,, the guy who owns "The Leica Shop" in Vienna. I mean really there is no M4-2 or M4-P...NOS that would come anywhere close to even 20% of that phony claimed value.
I really depresses me to have to get so angry of this guy...but the people in Leica must think we are all just Sheep !!
Best Regards.....Laurance
xayraa33
rangefinder user and fancier
S
Socke
Guest
As I read it, it's 20 cameras, most probably in like new condititon, and lenses valued at $50,000. 50,000/20=2,500
$2,500 ~ 1500 Euro.
1500 Euro for a CLA'd M4-2 or M4-P with a new Summarit lens looks like a bargain to me.
larmarv916
Well-known
Maybe Iam the ODD man out on the "New Noctilux" but Iam not holdiing my breath for that lens regardless of cost. I have shot a lot of image wide open on many differnt kinds of lenses. But the ASPH 50 F1.4 looks like a great and almost ageless lens. I would apperciate a ultra fast 35mm...F1.0 ASPH or maybe a 28mm ASPH F1.0 lens Also Iam not a big fan of the M8.
A Nikon RF that is dgital I would trust more....as the Nikon D200, D300 and other really are amazing. Also I would think that it would create such a sensation that it would be almost chaos in the streets. All the lenses from the ZF would be expected to fit. So here you are with a 85mm F1.4 on a electronic rangfinder for killer accuracy. Think how that would kill the 90 ASPH Summicron on the world stage. I mean there are a lot interesting things Nikon can do better from the sensor on up. While keeping the cost actually afforable.
So I guess all we can do is sit back and wait for the next "act" in this new comedy at Leica.
Best Regards....Laurance
A Nikon RF that is dgital I would trust more....as the Nikon D200, D300 and other really are amazing. Also I would think that it would create such a sensation that it would be almost chaos in the streets. All the lenses from the ZF would be expected to fit. So here you are with a 85mm F1.4 on a electronic rangfinder for killer accuracy. Think how that would kill the 90 ASPH Summicron on the world stage. I mean there are a lot interesting things Nikon can do better from the sensor on up. While keeping the cost actually afforable.
So I guess all we can do is sit back and wait for the next "act" in this new comedy at Leica.
Best Regards....Laurance
M. Valdemar
Well-known
Ahem.....
For the naysayers:
http://www.photographybay.com/2008/05/10/nikons-new-viewfinder-does-double-duty/
For the naysayers:
http://www.photographybay.com/2008/05/10/nikons-new-viewfinder-does-double-duty/
Timmy P
Established
I think the stuff about not improving ISO noise is a load of bull. I bet Canon 40D and Nikon D200 etc RAW's would be cleaner than their M8 equivalents. Heck, how come the 1D MkIII is 1.3 crop and 10mp and it wipes the floor with the M8.
I know it's down to sensor design, but you think they would have chosen something a bit better instead of it's horribly noisy incarnation.
Personally I don't think super fast lenses are the answer at all. They're expensive and you don't always want the very shallow depth of field low f numbers give you. Anything under f2 on lenses longer than 35 to me, doesn't give that great depth of field. For the kind of things I like to do, indoor doco work, you don't want some razor thin DOF, you want more in focus.
How about they just put a good sensor into the camera to begin with, instead of expecting people to shell out for lenses that cost close to or more than an M8!!
And if Leica's concerned about good old film photography, why don't they release a cheaper M film camera. Here's a hint guys, it was called the CL.
I liked the old CEO better. This guys seems really old fashioned. In a bad way. I don't think Leica's going under, but after Cosina & Zeiss's excellent lines, they're been shown they could be doing better with less.
I know it's down to sensor design, but you think they would have chosen something a bit better instead of it's horribly noisy incarnation.
Personally I don't think super fast lenses are the answer at all. They're expensive and you don't always want the very shallow depth of field low f numbers give you. Anything under f2 on lenses longer than 35 to me, doesn't give that great depth of field. For the kind of things I like to do, indoor doco work, you don't want some razor thin DOF, you want more in focus.
How about they just put a good sensor into the camera to begin with, instead of expecting people to shell out for lenses that cost close to or more than an M8!!
And if Leica's concerned about good old film photography, why don't they release a cheaper M film camera. Here's a hint guys, it was called the CL.
I liked the old CEO better. This guys seems really old fashioned. In a bad way. I don't think Leica's going under, but after Cosina & Zeiss's excellent lines, they're been shown they could be doing better with less.
aizan
Veteran
kodak sensors usually have more noise, but better color. *shrug*