Kiev 4 shutter malfunction

[prinz47]

Good morning, my Kiev4 (year 1975) have a shutter problem: when I change shutter time from B (or other shutter times from 1/1250 to 1/5 sec.) to 1/2 sec. the first time I shoot, the shutter work at about 1/4-1/5 sec, (I do not hear the slow speed escapement work). If I shoot another time at 1/2 the shutter works well at 1/2 sec. (I hear the slow speed escapement work). I did not found a procedure to calibrate the shutter (or repair it) nor on "Kiev survival site" or Rick Oleson site.
The Kiev Shutter is different from Contax II shutter.
There is someone who can help me?
Thank you
Enrico

 

[Sarcophilus Harrisii]

Try winding on the camera first, then adjust the speed. If that does not help I suspect moving the speed dial away from Bulb to 1/25 or so and *then* back to 1/2 may work. If it fires correctly at 1/2 after first being fired and wound it suggests the fault is not with the escapements. Sounds like a bit of wear.

 

[prinz47]

Thank you I will try, I always wound the shutter before changing time. If the shutter is worn Do you know if it is possible to adjust the shutter to take up the slack?
Thank you.
Enrico

 

[Sarcophilus Harrisii]

Thank you I will try, I always wound the shutter before changing time. If the shutter is worn Do you know if it is possible to adjust the shutter to take up the slack?
Thank you.
Enrico

I expect so. The second curtain is wound the furthest at Bulb, but you've said the shutter fires off at half a second correctly if it has been cycled once beforehand. Because Bulb and 1/2 second speed notches are very close to each other, I suspect that simply lifting the dial and shifting it from B to 1/2 isn't moving the second curtain far enough to stop it being held back on Bulb the first time, because of excess friction in the system. It may well be that simply cleaning and lubricating the mechanism will resolve it, if the ribbons are OK, (although ribbons are cheap, and if their age and origin are unknown, personally, I think it's prudent to replace them). Once the shutter has been released with the speed dial on 1/2, when it's subsequently wound, the curtain is being correctly tensioned and is at the correct position. I suspect that, if you try my suggestion (wind the camera with the dial on Bulb, and then, move the dial to Eg 1/25 or 1/50 and *then* back to 1/2 before releasing it) you'll likely find it will run off correctly the first time, because the curtain will then be correctly set. It should not be necessary to do this, normally, to make 1/2 second work properly of course, it's indicative of a need for servicing.
Cheers,
Brett

 

[prinz47]

Very kind of you Brett, unfortunately I tried you hint but it does not work. I have to repair/clean the shutter. Ribbons are in good shape, but when I tried to move the dial fron B to 1/25 the lower curtain disengages and travel to the bottom. Another problem to solve!
Do you know if there is a good manual in the web? I have an old Maizenber.pdf and Kiev survival site, but I found a Cyrillic manual with interesting drawig but I do not know at all the Russian alphabet and language.
Regards
Enrico

 

[prinz47]

Corrections about English: Very kind of you Brett, unfortunately I tried your hint but it does not work. I have to repair/clean the shutter. Ribbons are in good shape, but when I tried to move the dial from B to 1/25 the lower curtain disengages and travel to the bottom. Another problem to solve!
Do you know if there is a good manual in the web? I have an old Maizenber.pdf and Kiev survival site. I found a Cyrillic manual with interesting drawigs but I do not know at all the Russian alphabet and language.
Regards
Enrico

 

[Sarcophilus Harrisii]

The Maizenberg book is very detailed. There's always a bit of friction through the clutches on the first curtain as you adjust the speeds but it should be securely latched up by the hook that engages the small claws on the curtain centre top. If this is out of adjustment or bent a bit it may not be retaining the first curtain securely, as it should. Should be a fairly easy fix though you'll have to remove the light sealing across the top of the back of the body and the film rail plate to access it.
Cheers
Brett

 

[prinz47]

Thank you Brett, I think you are right, because when I take off the camera's back the lower curtain doesn't travel, no more, to the bottom when I change from "B" to shorter shutter times . Maybe the little deformation that occours when I put on the back is enough to lift (a little) the hook.
Regards.
Enrico

 

[prinz47]

I found the reverse mechanism gear (maizenberg manual pg. 256 figure 319 - a) particular n. 11) unscrewed. I manged to srew it fully again, but I have some doubt about the axial free play. Could you please tell me if you have some technical data about this. Thank you.
Regards
Enrico