Kiev Frame Spacing

[brachal]

I had posted a little while back that I thought using the old metal film cassette on the take-up side of a Kiev might help with the frame spacing issue these cameras seem to have. Well, I shot a test roll this week, and boy was I wrong. Whatever causes this problem with Kievs, the cassette doesn't seem to help at all. The spacing problem doesn't really bother me much -- nothing overlaps on a 24 exposure roll. Might on a 36, though ...

Just letting y'all know.

 

[santino]

uneven spacing or just small spaces?
it's actually normal that Kievs don't make large spaces.

 

[colyn]

I had posted a little while back that I thought using the old metal film cassette on the take-up side of a Kiev might help with the frame spacing issue these cameras seem to have. Well, I shot a test roll this week, and boy was I wrong. Whatever causes this problem with Kievs, the cassette doesn't seem to help at all. The spacing problem doesn't really bother me much -- nothing overlaps on a 24 exposure roll. Might on a 36, though ...

Just letting y'all know.

Are you making sure the film is wound onto the take-up spool right?
If you are using the original Kiev take-up spool the leader will go into the top slot (when holding it in the same position it goes into the camera) and bend over and into the other slot (not completely through though)..

I use an original Kiev cassette with the Kiev take-up spool and as yet have not had problems with frame spacing.

 

[Stu W]

Dan Ridings posted a fix for this problem a while back. I cut and pasted it.

I have found one more variable that has helped.

As Stu says, the sprockets turn at a fixed speed.

It seems that if the take-up spool pulls too much, it can pull film to it faster than the sprockets want to deliver it.

If you look at the fork for the take-up, you will see a screw. You can loosen that screw a bit so that the fork will slip rather than forcefully pull film to itself.

I've done that adjustment (loosening the take-up fork screw) on my Kiev 4A's and it definitely helped. I don't get perfect spacing, but very close to it. And this is after having drastic erratic spacing (usually huge amounts between the frames in the beginning and then leveling out towards mid-roll).

Daniel

 

[brachal]

In my case, the spaces start out normally, but the frames get progressively closer toward the end of the roll. I'm not sure if the spool is an original Kiev or not -- it's the one that came with the camera 🙂

I'll take a look at adjusting the take-up screw.

Thanks to all.

 

[colyn]

In my case, the spaces start out normally, but the frames get progressively closer toward the end of the roll. I'm not sure if the spool is an original Kiev or not -- it's the one that came with the camera 🙂

I'll take a look at adjusting the take-up screw.

Thanks to all.

If it's an original it should be marked either Kneb or Kiev.

 

[rolleistef]

It seems everybody gets problems with their Kiev... Odd that I never got such issues on mine! There must be something hidden that will be breaking at the most unexpected moment...

 

[colyn]

It seems everybody gets problems with their Kiev... Odd that I never got such issues on mine! There must be something hidden that will be breaking at the most unexpected moment...

I have 2 Kiev 4a's and neither has given me any problems. I also had a Kiev 4am which worked fine.
I suspect many of these cameras just need a CLA to bring them up to snuff..

 

[rpinchbeck]

Frame spacing is the bane of the Kiev system. I'm convinced it has to do with all the accumulated backlash in the gear train that drives the sprocket advance. The take-up spool is two more gears removed from the sprocket drive. As Dan Ridings suggested, messing around with the friction slip on the take-up spool is probably the only feasible fix. If you can adjust the slip on the take-up spool so it is consistantly pulling the film so that the sprocket advance always has the backlash preloaded then it should be consistant. Sounds easy in theory, I too have one Kiev that defies to have consistant frame spacing. Anyone good at micro-machining? Custom cut gears with proper gear shaft tolerances would probably be the ticket.

OK, maybe screwing around with the friction slip would be easier...

Cheers,

Russ Pinchbeck

 

[Xmas]

Russ

First try a drip of PTFE liquid lube on to the clutch axis with the camera inverted, then operate the camera upside down holding the drive stationary, to work the libe into place. leave the camera upside down overnight.

If you dont have a Kiev AM, this is simple, and it might work... If you have an AM you need to undo the three screws holding the take up spool first.

I only do this if the sproket holes tear out.

The different problem I have is lots of Kievs have an offset gear teeth on the take up spool drive and might strip given stress, I only strip a clutch to offset the gear for 100% engagement...

Noel