jippiejee
Well-known
Or, just maybe, someone actually spoke the truth. Because he was not in the Kodak PR department, but just got this phone call from a customer, and told what everyone within Kodak already knows but hides.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Seems unlikely. As others have said, it would be hard to hide. Also, I think I'd trust both the engineer and the PR person I contacted, whom I know of old.
Cheers,
R.
Jamie123
Veteran
Exactly. A friend of mine used to work in customer service at Epson. The call center is in Barcelona and he worked in the team for customers from German speaking countries. He's not very computer savvy but he says he didn't have to know anything because they had a program where they had to tick boxes and then give answers according to what's on the computer screen.
Also, I don't think asking the same source 4 times warrants as 'fact checking'. The same idiot will always give the same idiotic answer.
jippiejee
Well-known
Roger, I sincerely hope you're right. At the same time, I cannot imagine an employee just making this up on the phone. I do think they're selling from stock, not knowing exactly what film will be continued or not. Maybe they really are to big to fill a niche profitably.
DominikDUK
Well-known
Maybe the employee got canned or will be soon and this is his revenge kill Kodak by spreading false rumours. False rumours can kill a stock company very fast and easy.
Dominik
Dominik
fstops
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Irrespective of who and where, this is a strange reply to a customer.
fstops
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You do have a point there but considering the value of Kodak stock, there is not much lower it can go.
0.210
-0.110 (-34.34%) Today.
http://www.google.com/finance?cid=10501
jippiejee
Well-known
Isn't that the standard response to whistle blowers? "Just someone trying to hurt the company"...
Roger Hicks
Veteran
On BW400CN, quite possibly: is there room for both BW400CN and XP2 Super? On Tri-X, I doubt it. But we'll see.
Unfortunately, I can imagine someone making it up very easily. Consider the likelihood of this, versus the likelihood of Kodak having ceased film production 8 months ago, and nobody noticing, or telling anyone they were laid off...
Cheers,
R.
Jamie123
Veteran
I agree. And it's not like making it up means someone had an evil plan to hurt the company. But the thing is, people whose job it is to give answers don't like to say 'I don't know' so sometimes they make guesses based on very little factual information. We all know that Kodak filed for Chapter 11 in january so maybe that's what that person is basing their information on.
BlackXList
Well-known
I think (I hope) there's definitely room for BW400CN and XP2 Super, because the results I get from the films are a world apart.
Sadly I suspect I'll have to go back to trying to get something useable out of XP2 Super, which I've never managed to my satisfaction before. I suspect shooting it at below box speed will get me to a more acceptable results (if not, then I'm going to end up shooting cheap C41 colour and desaturating, which will be most unsatisfactory)
(and for the last time, it wasn't the same source 4 times, this was the fourth source, and the only one who bothered to reply)
Sadly I suspect I'll have to go back to trying to get something useable out of XP2 Super, which I've never managed to my satisfaction before. I suspect shooting it at below box speed will get me to a more acceptable results (if not, then I'm going to end up shooting cheap C41 colour and desaturating, which will be most unsatisfactory)
(and for the last time, it wasn't the same source 4 times, this was the fourth source, and the only one who bothered to reply)
Phil_F_NM
Camera hacker
This thread is a soup sandwich. There have been a few who have offered good information regarding the original post. There have also been a few who have just been downright nasty.
We all know that Kodak film is still around so now it's come down to a lot of snarky personal attacks.
Can't it just die?
Phil Forrest
We all know that Kodak film is still around so now it's come down to a lot of snarky personal attacks.
Can't it just die?
Phil Forrest
Gumby
Veteran
... or maybe Luis just has poor written communication skills.
BobYIL
Well-known
My! In just half a day over 170 messages?! Kodak has died already in this forum while turning out films at the Rochester plant 
.
Why would a beloved, highly regarded, reasonably priced well-selling product would die?! Chrysler was bankrupt too and twice, but still going strong.. Leitz following the 70's lived through up and downs until it was divided into "portions" in 1986, the family probably has lost the great majority of their shares.. Captains change, vessels keep on cruising.. Such a great product having a sound customer basis all over the world, having almost no competition will attract many enthusiastic buyers, like Truesense bought a far more complex part of the same company.
Does a production bring money? This is the question.. Some Kodak films "bring" money more than any other similar product be it the HP5 or the Neopan do for example.. And the prospective future owners know it better than we do..
.Why would a beloved, highly regarded, reasonably priced well-selling product would die?! Chrysler was bankrupt too and twice, but still going strong.. Leitz following the 70's lived through up and downs until it was divided into "portions" in 1986, the family probably has lost the great majority of their shares.. Captains change, vessels keep on cruising.. Such a great product having a sound customer basis all over the world, having almost no competition will attract many enthusiastic buyers, like Truesense bought a far more complex part of the same company.
Does a production bring money? This is the question.. Some Kodak films "bring" money more than any other similar product be it the HP5 or the Neopan do for example.. And the prospective future owners know it better than we do..
sevo
Fokutorendaburando
Assuming that it is indeed selling well enough relative to the scale it is produced at (where I have my doubts when it comes to colour film - and BW400CN might be running off a colour line):
Sometimes because someone in management or the investors believes that a bit more profit could be squeezed out of producing something else. Or because someone in management or the investors disembowels the company for the immediate profit they can make out of selling its real estate and tools. Occasionally they'll even kill a profitable company just to make off with its pensioners fund or cash reserves. YMMV - but the list of survivable companies killed for no good reason is no smaller than that of the ailing companies trundling along at a loss.
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
migtex
Don't eXchange Freedom!
Roger, thank you for saving the day!
It will die one day, so, be prepared...
It will die one day, so, be prepared...
x-ray
Veteran
One of the last large manufacturers in my city, Robert Shaw Co, who made thermostats for cars and homes and had been here for almost as long as Kodak was purchased by a group of investors, shut down and all the assets sold for a substantial profit. Robert Shaw was the leader in a growing market for their products. This unfortunately is the new way of doing business.
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Contrary to what my post might suggest I personally would love any film producer to survive. But in Kodaks case we have seen paper production cease. It's beloved kodachome cease, other positive films cease, many black and white films cease, digital sensor section sold off, a chief exec who sees no future in film and kodak sink into bankruptcy protection. This isn't something that has just cropped up. Its something that has been happening for years and management has failed to stop the rot.
The problem kodak has is its large corporate mentality. It's too big for its film plant to survive in todays market. It can't downsize its site and plant the way it is now. IMO it needs to build a new film based plant totally seperate from its existing site of the right scale for it to be economically viable. But it isn't doing that and that means its going to fail in the film based stakes.
Yes the remaining film products are very good but they have no future under the current management strategy (if you can call it that). Therefore I'm not going to support it when I could support those companies who have a greater committment to keeping film alive such as fuji and ilford and the smaller companies such as the re-introduced agfa(adox) etc.
Being harsh on kodak is about their attitude and not their products.
Just my opinion, nothing more. You can interpret it how you like.
The problem kodak has is its large corporate mentality. It's too big for its film plant to survive in todays market. It can't downsize its site and plant the way it is now. IMO it needs to build a new film based plant totally seperate from its existing site of the right scale for it to be economically viable. But it isn't doing that and that means its going to fail in the film based stakes.
Yes the remaining film products are very good but they have no future under the current management strategy (if you can call it that). Therefore I'm not going to support it when I could support those companies who have a greater committment to keeping film alive such as fuji and ilford and the smaller companies such as the re-introduced agfa(adox) etc.
Being harsh on kodak is about their attitude and not their products.
Just my opinion, nothing more. You can interpret it how you like.