Leica IIIc 1000s shutter speed

[TR3B]

I have an older Leica IIIc factory converted with Summitar from 1949 that is in beautiful condition, both the body and lens, from a cosmetic standpoint. I've tested the slower shutter speeds and all seems well up to 500sec. At 1000sec the shutter does not move.

Can someone advise on what this could be please?
I'm considering selling and would like to not pay for a CLA, and would sell with full disclosure of condition.

Thank You

 

[colyn]

Either it needs a CLA or the 1000s speed is not adjusted correctly. It also could be that someone at some time replaced the curtains and did not properly position the closing curtain on the main shutter drum..

 

[ZeissFan]

It probably needs to be serviced. Was it ever serviced? If not, you can't expect a mechanical device to run for decades and decades without it ever being service.

 

[Dez]

Exactly what happens when you push the shutter button? Does it also not release when you release the button? It seems very unusual that it would work at 1/500 but not 1/1000.

In the IIIC there is a difference in the way the trailing curtain is released at these speeds, but not the leading curtain. The shutter dial should sit about 1mm higher when properly engaging the 1/1000 speed than it does at all the other speeds- is that the case in your camera?

What is the factory conversion you mention?

Cheers,
Dez

 

[TR3B]

The 1000sec does sit higher than other speeds. When I set the shutter speed at 1000sec and push the shutter button, the shutter does not move and the button returns to the initial position it was in. I then set the speed to 500sec, and it works fine, just not at 1000sec. The conversion was for flash sync and self-timer.

How often do folks use these cameras at 1000sec. Just hoping someone could use the camera, even though it is compromised.

 

[Filzkoeter]

This sounds strange, as it's exactly the same mechanism that trips the second curtain, no matter what speed... the rod that unlocks the second curtain only sits in different positions for each speed.

Take a look at http://www.pentax-manuals.com/manuals/service/screw_mount_leicas.pdf to understand how the shutter works.

The 1/1000 speed sits higher because that speed uses a different post for tripping the second curtains then the slower ones.

What happens if you push the shutter button down, hold it and you try to move the shutterspeed dial a tiny bit clockwise? Does the shutter work then (you would propably get no exposure doing this and don't worry, you can't damage the shutter that way 😉 )?

 

[TR3B]

Filzkoeter:
As you suggested, I pushed the shutter down while advancing the shutterspeed dial clockwise and now the shutter advances. Only while performing this sequence does the shutter advance at 1000sec. Any input on what I have going on here?

Thanks so much for your help- much appreciated.

A beautiful camera aside from the problem

 

[Luddite Frank]

Unless you're using film speeds above ISO 400 in bright sun, I don't think you'll "need" 1/1000 sec.

I shoot with a number of cameras whose shutters max out at 1/250, 1/400, 1/500 sec., and I can't ever remember myself wishing for one more faster shutter speed.

Now, there are PLENTY of times I've wished for one or two stops larger aperture ( low light conditions ) ... 😛


One time I shot a roll of 3200 Ilford B&W in a black Leica III ( 1/500 max shutter speed ), and it came-out all-right. Granted, I was mostly shooting interior scenes - Railroad roundhouse, and concert in an 18 th century Moravian church...

 

[Filzkoeter]

TR3B: Was this camera ever serviced? My guess: dry lubricants/dirty or incorrectly adjusted 1/1000 speed or both.
There's a lever which disengages the second curtain movement in relation to the first curtain. Setting the shutter speed dial adjusts the way of travel of the first curtain before the second is released.
At 1/1000 the way the first curtain has to travel before releasing the second one is very small
Either dirt, dried lubricants or whatever prevent that the first curtain has enough speed/momentum to release the second curtain at 1/1000. So basically nothing happens at all, since the movement of the first curtain is also stopped by the lever.
At speeds 1/500 and below the first curtain gets enough momentum to release the second curtain.
By moving the speed dial by hand you are pushing that blocked lever away and the shutter fires.

Should be no big deal, this doesn't sound like broken, but it sounds like time for a CLA 😉

 

[TR3B]

Thank you again for all your contributions, I appreciate it.

I'm going to lower the price to reflect a good cleaning and hope there is some interest.