sig
Well-known
The price on Leica equipment makes it a showoff item.
I guess in the same way a lot of people here at rff thinks that people with big expensive dslrs with big white lenses are pretenders/showing off, a lot of people other places thinks leica users are pretenders/showing off (in both cases: expensive equipment but nothing more)
I guess in the same way a lot of people here at rff thinks that people with big expensive dslrs with big white lenses are pretenders/showing off, a lot of people other places thinks leica users are pretenders/showing off (in both cases: expensive equipment but nothing more)
JohnTF
Veteran
You certainly needed at least a Mamiya C330 size camera with big flash for wedding photography, if you did it for money. ;-)
Regards, John
On reflection, I do recall an incident a few years back when attention was brought to my old Leica in a public way. A guy who did custom B&W processing for the local camera shop/lab put on a photo workshop. All had film cameras, and he asked that we run a roll of slides for discussion later. For this I brought my Bessa-L with 15mm Heliar, and had some fun with dramatic perspective shots mostly of the other workshop folk doing their thing. This drew the attention of our leader. Done with the slide film, I switched to my old Leica M2 with B&W film. This riveted the attention of the workshop leader, and he exclaimed about it to the group, making me rather self-conscious. So (as he said), you were earlier shooting with a super-wide on a camera lacking a viewfinder, and now you've got a LEICA, with... yes... a first-version 35 Summicron!!!???!!! (Yeah, could have said I'd gotten the whole rig, used camera and new lens, $314.50 total... some 40 years before.) I'm not sure just why he was so astounded, as he clearly recognized what it was. Then I was forgotten as one of the other "students" upstaged me by setting up his Calumet 4x5!
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Robert Hooper
Established
Roger,
I don't agree with your premise. Certainly some people buy Leica to impress, but I believe the vast majority of us buy Leica because of its quality.
However, I must admit to a recent incident which inspired ownership pride. I was walking on a trail in Volcanos National Park in Hawaii with my wife when a group of Japanese tourists approached from the opposite direction. The group leader interrupted his tour narrative when he noticed the Leica M2 hanging from my neck.
"Excuse me, my grandfather had this camera and someday I will inherit it." The rest of his troupe were all looking puzzled. The tour leader spoke something to them in Japanese and suddenly my leica was the center of attention. The tour leader continued talking to them and there were a lot of oohs and aahs. My experience with Japanese tourists is that they are very polite, but some could not resist invading what I consider personal space to get a much closer look at the M2. Several were bowing and speaking Japanese I didn't understand, but my general impression was that they were very impressed. The tour guide said, "thank you", and, "very nice camera". Then the group continued on.
I don't agree with your premise. Certainly some people buy Leica to impress, but I believe the vast majority of us buy Leica because of its quality.
However, I must admit to a recent incident which inspired ownership pride. I was walking on a trail in Volcanos National Park in Hawaii with my wife when a group of Japanese tourists approached from the opposite direction. The group leader interrupted his tour narrative when he noticed the Leica M2 hanging from my neck.
"Excuse me, my grandfather had this camera and someday I will inherit it." The rest of his troupe were all looking puzzled. The tour leader spoke something to them in Japanese and suddenly my leica was the center of attention. The tour leader continued talking to them and there were a lot of oohs and aahs. My experience with Japanese tourists is that they are very polite, but some could not resist invading what I consider personal space to get a much closer look at the M2. Several were bowing and speaking Japanese I didn't understand, but my general impression was that they were very impressed. The tour guide said, "thank you", and, "very nice camera". Then the group continued on.
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Robert,
Re-read what I wrote -- not just the headline -- and you'll see that my premise is exactly the same as yours. Buying a Leica to impress someone is pointless and silly not only inherently, but also because no-one is likely to be impressed by it -- apart, it seems, from the occasional Japanese tourist (lovely story).
I find it amusing that this thread has had over 3000 views and 130-odd replies in 36 hours, despite at least one protestation of 'I don't get it'. Looks like quite a lot of people do get it.
Cheers,
R.
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Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Leigh,
A friend of mine was a founder member of the Jaguar Owners Club, and owned every model up to the 1960s including the pre-war SS models. The trouble was that by the 1970s or even 60s, when I fancied one, you normally had a simple choice with old Jags: superb bodywork and clapped mechanicals, or strong mechanicals and bodywork you could poke your finger through as a result of the tin-worm. In those days I wasn't brave enough to attempt a sort-and-merge of one of each.
Then again, the car I really wanted was a Bristol, preferably 401-402-403. That is the double-stroke M3 of cars (roughly contemporaneous, of course). Or maybe a Daimler DE36, as the Gandolfi of cars.
But cars are too much work and too bulky, so over the 70s I lost interest. It strikes me as interesting, though, that next to a half-decent Mk. II Jaguar, let alone an E-type, an M9 is a bargain. As I said at the end of the M9 review on my site, the M9 only looks expensive because it's so small. What would a good piano cost you?
Cheers,
R.
250swb
Well-known
In the wider world than seen from the confines of this or any other forum Leica M's mean nothing other than 'what?' or 'old camera'. This is fine by me, I can invisibly walk amongst Canon and Nikon users.
But if any evidence of a desire to impress is present in ownership, its precisely amongst forum members (not all obviously). And its evidenced by the extra cloak of invisibility that is perceived as possible by the black tape brigade. To all intents and purposes they are invisible in the world already, but the addition of black tape on the red dot transforms the situation. It is no longer 'how can I get away with photographing a stranger on the street', but 'look what I'm doing to my expensive camera'. Without come backs, permanent damage, de-valuing, or loosing 'street cred', its 'look at me, I've got an expensive camera, I don't care what it looks like, I'm hip'. To be true, they'd be wearing frayed Levi's, sandals, with rats in their hair, but driving daddies new Ferrari in another life
Steve
But if any evidence of a desire to impress is present in ownership, its precisely amongst forum members (not all obviously). And its evidenced by the extra cloak of invisibility that is perceived as possible by the black tape brigade. To all intents and purposes they are invisible in the world already, but the addition of black tape on the red dot transforms the situation. It is no longer 'how can I get away with photographing a stranger on the street', but 'look what I'm doing to my expensive camera'. Without come backs, permanent damage, de-valuing, or loosing 'street cred', its 'look at me, I've got an expensive camera, I don't care what it looks like, I'm hip'. To be true, they'd be wearing frayed Levi's, sandals, with rats in their hair, but driving daddies new Ferrari in another life
Steve
Dave Wilkinson
Veteran
Digital or analogue?
Jodorowsky
Well-known
My grandad loved taking pictures, and so did my father; I inherited my grandad's camera, and when it gave up the ghost, I decided to buy a 'rangefinder'. I didn't even know what a 'rangefinder' was- I just thought it sounded cool. And distinct. Like my narcissistic self image.
Then I started drooling over internet pictures, and reading endless posts on forums..... No change there. As I've 'progressed' I've realised that the image is everything, but that the route to the image is greatly facilitated by having something with you that you're comfortable walking around with (as well as something appropriate to most conditions). If the feeling of comfort is brought about by a feeling of coolness because you own a great camera, so what?
Ultimately, though, the camera needs to be able to do what you want it to, so you need to know vaguely what you're hoping to capture.... I just bought a Hexar RF, but I regard it as a 'Leica' because I can use my Leica lenses on it. Obviously, if it ever needs mending.....
Then I started drooling over internet pictures, and reading endless posts on forums..... No change there. As I've 'progressed' I've realised that the image is everything, but that the route to the image is greatly facilitated by having something with you that you're comfortable walking around with (as well as something appropriate to most conditions). If the feeling of comfort is brought about by a feeling of coolness because you own a great camera, so what?
Ultimately, though, the camera needs to be able to do what you want it to, so you need to know vaguely what you're hoping to capture.... I just bought a Hexar RF, but I regard it as a 'Leica' because I can use my Leica lenses on it. Obviously, if it ever needs mending.....
Frontman
Well-known
I didn't buy a Leica in order to show it off. After using many types of cameras over the years, I eventually picked one up. I simply think they are good cameras. Most people around me don't know the difference between one camera and another, and the few who do tend to be kindly, bespectacled old fossils who walk around in camera-clad groups at the weekends.
I do enjoy having nice things. I have suits which cost more than a new M9, and shoes which cost many times what I paid for my first car in high school. I'm not sure if it's really showing off, few people (if any) can tell the difference between an $8000 suit and one bought at a Men's Wearhouse. But I like to wear such things, and I will so long as I can continue to afford them.
Like any man, I am somewhat egotistical.
I do enjoy having nice things. I have suits which cost more than a new M9, and shoes which cost many times what I paid for my first car in high school. I'm not sure if it's really showing off, few people (if any) can tell the difference between an $8000 suit and one bought at a Men's Wearhouse. But I like to wear such things, and I will so long as I can continue to afford them.
Like any man, I am somewhat egotistical.
Leigh Youdale
Well-known
Ah yes, the Bristol! Lived there from 1958-62. Glorious straight six engines described as "making the sound of tearing silk". Aluminium bodies streamlined like no other and (I think) with a BMW/Frazer Nash heritage behind them.
Went to a hillclimb at Prescott and watched them, along with Romulus, (or was it Remus?) the twin rear tyred supercharged ERA. And the smell of Castrol R!
cidereye
Film Freak
Quite fortunate in the village where I live as it seems to be on Bristol cars regular test drive route. Often see the latest model coming through with trade plates on it or indeed older models. When I was younger I used to live close enough to the old factory at Filton I could hit it with a stone too which was a treat, beautiful cars with so much character.
Anyway back to the subject at hand, I think there's a case for Leica's being a status symbol or a camera to brag over but as Roger initially stated most people don't even know what they are so point of for such? I think more people are impressed by a whacking big DSLR like a D3 than they ever would be by a Leica. Then? the Leica S2 is reasonably large itself, but again would most people even know what that was compared to the sight of a Canon or Nikon badge?
maggieo
More Deadly
ramosa
B&W
i agree with roger. one of the things i like most about leica is no one knows what it is. no? what percent of americans have heard of sony, leica, nikon, and canon? ok, point made--and i really feel this when i'm out on the streets.
FrankHarries
Well-known
The point of showing off is that not everybody knows about the things you have. No need that anyone from the street recognizes what a Leica is. IF you want to show off you only would like to be recognized as a Leica owner by people, who at least know something about photography, take pictures with a small budget camera and THEN there is what showing off is all about: when you see the eyes lightening and getting longing....
Leigh Youdale
Well-known
Test
Test
Alright - there's a test here that I've seen applied in the domestic arena and it can be readily applied.
If you want to show off your camera, leave the price ticket clearly displayed on it. You can still use it of course, but the ticket must be visible so that people notice, and are shocked into asking if it really cost "that much". Then you can disingenuously claim to have forgotten to remove it. That's for the show-offs.
For those who don't want their wives to know how much they paid for it, or who don't want to be mugged, or who have a personality disorder that makes them compulsive-obsessive or even perfectionist-reclusive the answer is to remove the price ticket, cover the red dot and name with black tape and hide it under your jacket most of the time.
Test
Alright - there's a test here that I've seen applied in the domestic arena and it can be readily applied.
If you want to show off your camera, leave the price ticket clearly displayed on it. You can still use it of course, but the ticket must be visible so that people notice, and are shocked into asking if it really cost "that much". Then you can disingenuously claim to have forgotten to remove it. That's for the show-offs.
For those who don't want their wives to know how much they paid for it, or who don't want to be mugged, or who have a personality disorder that makes them compulsive-obsessive or even perfectionist-reclusive the answer is to remove the price ticket, cover the red dot and name with black tape and hide it under your jacket most of the time.
FrankHarries
Well-known
...and if you are still afraid that someone could think you are only showing off: get some of that vulcanite off, get your keys or other tools and make some nasty scratches on the body (which wouldn't affect picture taking) - make a ding here and there (but careful so that it doesn't harm the cameras technical performance) - they won't think that you are showing off any longer but might think that you have some severe problem of some other kind...
anu L ogy
Well-known
In all of the times I've pulled out my camera in public, I have had one person comment. I was climbing Picacho peak and some one on their way down the mountain was like "Sweet camera dude! Still shooting film?" As they patted their holstered film camera. I said something like "Tri-x and rodinal 1:25 for 7 mins at 68 degrees!" We had a laugh and went our separate ways.
Frank, I think you're onto something there!
Roger Hicks
Veteran
Dear Frank,
Point taken, but how many people buy their Leica for that purpose? As distinct, say, from taking pictures with it?
Chreers,
R.