LTM CZJ Lenses vs Contax CJ Lenses with Amedeo Adapter

[CameraQuest]

I love photographic history and finding obscure goodies,
but I fail to see any advantage of the wartime CZJ lenses
over pre or post war CZ Contax lenses and the wonderful Amedeo adapter

that is especially true when considering the Ruskie LTM lenses
why go to all of the trouble to pick out the best ones out of their dismal QC
and then go to the touble of shimming it or adjusting it
when you have a good one from the git go with a CZ Contax lens and Amedeo adapter?

Am I missing something on this ?

Stephen

 

[KoNickon]

In truth, I don't think there is any advantage. I think it's just the rarity of the LTM CZJ lenses and the thrill of finding a real one.

 

[brbo]

Amadeo adapter is a bit stiff for me (usable, but a bit softer would be better).

Do LTM Sonnars also have "wrong" focusing/aperture direction?

 

[ferider]

People are cheap and hopeful, Stephen.

An Amedeo with good Contax J3 easily runs close to US 350.

BTW, I don't think it's QC as much as different "standard focus" in later Jupiter lenses. Which is why 1951 and earlier LTM J3 copies run above US 300 these days, too, and are increasingly faked, IMO.

Roland.

 

[johannielscom]

In truth, I don't think there is any advantage. I think it's just the rarity of the LTM CZJ lenses and the thrill of finding a real one.

This.

But, the thrill has worn off a bit these days, since a new load of fakes is flooding the market (notably '1947 3K' Zonnar Krasnogorsk lenses, often just hacked Jupiter-8s) and prices for real ones have gone up considerably.

A few years back finding a real one was a treat since they were factory-optimised for Leica LTM, fairly cheap, and even not that hard to find. Nowadays, there are lenses faked to look like early postwar lenses with Zeiss elements, and even those are expensive. Also, by now it's common knowledge how to get any Jupiter in the Leica correct-focusing ballpark with some shimming so getting an early Jupiter will mostly do.

Dismal QC yes, but this is more of a partially-true tale than most people realize. Some ranges are not as good as others, but in general any lens before 1957 is pretty spot-on for Leica focusing, since it was constructed in the first Soviet factory which was built with Carl Zeiss machinery and operated by a number of Zeiss-employees who had been put on transport from Dresden to Russia. After that, QC deteriorates over time. Once you get to the black 50mm lenses with painted-on lettering, it turns into a crap shoot with the QC. IIRC correctly that was early 70s. Apparently there are some lenses made early this century which were really good again but it was too little, too late. I've never seen one yet, I reckon they did not sell much. The factory that made them was called DVD Technik, go figure!

Besides, with more and more people shooting them on CRC cameras with an EVF or LCD, it really doesn't matter all that much for them.

 

[CameraQuest]

This.

Dismal QC yes, but this is more of a partially-true tale than most people realize. Some ranges are not as good as others, but in general any lens before 1957 is pretty spot-on for Leica focusing, since it was constructed in the first Soviet factory which was built with Carl Zeiss machinery and operated by a number of Zeiss-employees who had been put on transport from Dresden to Russia. After that, QC deteriorates over time. Once you get to the black 50mm lenses with painted-on lettering, it turns into a crap shoot with the QC. IIRC correctly that was early 70s. Apparently there are some lenses made early this century which were really good again but it was too little, too late. I've never seen one yet, I reckon they did not sell much. The factory that made them was called DVD Technik, go figure!

In about 1997 the San Jose camera show (then the largest camera show in the US by FAR) had its first just off the plane Russian camera dealer I had seen, complete with suit cases full of Russian lenses - mostly for $20 to $30 each.

I bought about six of them as I recall, 28 to 50 mm lenses.

then I went back over to my table, and found only one of them would mount onto a Leica IIIf properly ! The others had the 39mm lens threads cut incorrectly! Quickly got my refund. Those were my first and last Russian LTM lenses. No idea of the vintage, but some black, some chrome as I remember.

Stephen

 

[ferider]

... then I went back over to my table, and found only one of them would mount onto a Leica IIIf properly ! The others had the lens threads cut incorrectly! ....

I have one of those: a 1951 J3 that doesn't mount on Canon P or Leica IIIG properly. But: it mounts on a CV 50mm LTM adapter (I was surprised myself). And even better, it focuses correctly at 1m and infinity on my M3s. Go figure ....

 

[raid]

The adapter adds weight to the lens. This is the main disadvantage. The advantage is that you can find cleaner copies more easily in Contax mount than in ltm.