LightBender
Member
Well, it appeals to nobody with a bunch of M lenses... other than it is a cool little camera like a lot of other cameras we have to choose from right now.
I'm really not sure why it is brought up here. It is a cropped factor camera that happens to have a viewfinder. It just happens to pay an odd sort of "Ludditic/nostalgic" homage to the vanities of those that really wanted an M.
It seems odd that the Fuji gets credit for its design (that copies the M) while the M gets demerits for copying itself.
If I were Fuji, starting from a clean sheet, I'd have designed a more ergonomically formed camera with more tech forward features.
Just me.
LightBender
Member
airfrogusmc
Veteran
It doesn't work for me.
adamjbonn
Established
Well.... the Fuji doesn't have a MESSSUCHER nor does it have any native manual focus lenses, these are about the 2 things that make an M an M
To the best of my knowledge... RE their shared features, Leica didn't invent the optical viewfinder, didn't invent placing the viewfinder in the top left corner, nor did Leica invent the rectangle shape or the shutter speed dial or the aperture ring
The 'copy' tag IMO only persists because Fuji resurrected design and features once found on many cameras, but ones which were largely obsolete except on the Leica.
I don't doubt that Fuji saw a market for that type of camera (although by most accounts the original X-Pro wasn't a commercial success at launch price) but targeting a market share and copying an existent product aren't the same thing.
Devils advocate: The 240 however, brought features that Fuji already in place on the X-Pro (live view, an EVF, video - in fact with the multi function grip and EVF fitted the 240 is a LESS simplistic camera than the X-Pro1)
But no one says that the 240 copied the X-Pro. Why? Becuase (like Fuji the other way around) Leica weren't looking to 'steal' Fuji customers, they were looking to broaden the appeal of their products
My HUNCH would be that a few people have bought the Fuji and ended up getting the Leica they actually wanted, I bet that's not true the other way round. Also people have no doubt seen the Fuji in the camera store, gone home to read it about and discovered the Leica.
Fuji have inadvertently been good for Leica, they've raised awareness of the M whilst taking none of Leica sales, and anyone buying a Fuji to scratch a Leica itch will remain icthy - they haven't got what they truly want.
I get the sense that a few people own both a X-Pro and a M. That (IMO) demonstrates the differences and viability in each product.
fenixv8
Established
Hmmm, still looks fatter than a Film M.
coelacanth
Ride, dive, shoot.
Looking at my M4-P in my hands, it appears to be. Seems to be thinner than M240 though.
The ISO dial looks decent. I wish they found a way to put exposure compensation dial somehow though. Maybe the ISO dial there could have been the Exp comp, and use M2 frame counter-like dial around shutter release for ISO.
M10-D with no display, exp comp on the back and lose the thumb dial then we get an ultimate M-D.
olakiril
Well-known
What I don't understand is why a company that favors simplicity fails to realize what a modern touch sensitive surface with a screen can really do.
Make it a touchscreen, flat with the body, get rid of all the rear buttons/dials & implement them on the screen like phones do, and voila you have a nice looking camera again.
Make it a touchscreen, flat with the body, get rid of all the rear buttons/dials & implement them on the screen like phones do, and voila you have a nice looking camera again.
mpaniagua
Newby photographer
yeah, only problem with that is that those buttons and dials is what make a M camera a M camera.
Regards.
Marcelo
Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
It was originally called as the "T". Leica TL currently.
https://en.leica-camera.com/Photography/Leica-TL/Leica-TL-System
benlees
Well-known
I think he means the stuff on the back of the camera, not the dials up top.
Just having a touch screen on the back is a great idea.
That's called the Leica T or TL. Ko.Fe beat me too it. But the M is really not the platform for such changes...
SaveKodak
Well-known
We have no indication that this camera doesn't have a touch screen. If they reduced buttons on the back it very well may have some touch functionality. Doesn't the Q, SL, and obvs the TL now? Then again, I'm not sure what the wheel and d-pad would be for, but then again, again, other cameras with touch screens have not-always eliminated buttons even if they're redundant.
froyd
Veteran
Chrome! Not steel grey, chrome! Tired of seeing the most recent batch of M cameras come out in black only (looking at you M-D)
Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
IMO, touch screen makes sense for two:
1. Touch for AF, M10 has no AF, if I'm not mistaken.
2. Touch to measure exposure, I don't know if M10 has measuring sensors spread across the sensor.
So, touch screen on the back of M is great idea for which functionality? I think, they need to add Bluetooth and Safari browser to use it with RFF mobile app to make it "great again". For some
1. Touch for AF, M10 has no AF, if I'm not mistaken.
2. Touch to measure exposure, I don't know if M10 has measuring sensors spread across the sensor.
So, touch screen on the back of M is great idea for which functionality? I think, they need to add Bluetooth and Safari browser to use it with RFF mobile app to make it "great again". For some
SaveKodak
Well-known
IMO, touch screen makes sense for two:
1. Touch for AF, M10 has no AF, if I'm not mistaken.
2. Touch to measure exposure, I don't know if M10 has measuring sensors spread across the sensor.
So, touch screen on the back of M is great idea for which functionality? I think, they need to add Bluetooth and Safari browser to use it with RFF mobile app to make it "great again". For some
Having an instant-movie button right next to the shutter made no sense either, especially one that can't be reprogrammed, even after firmware updates...but Leica did it anyway!
It could still be used just to select menu items, scroll through photos, that kind of thing. I don't think the touch is is an absolute necessity on any of the Leicas save the T, but you can use it if you want. I'm not saying it's GOING to have it, but it wouldn't surprise me.
gavinlg
Veteran
The issue with a touchscreen is that you have to take the camera away from your eye and look at the screen to see what button you are pressing. With real haptic buttons you get something where you can change settings without having to take the camera away from your eye, or without having a beaming screen glowing in your face, or without having to look at the screen.
Honestly I love the screen on my microsoft surface pro tablet and the touch interface is amazing for editing and general computing, but on a camera where I hate looking at the screen on the back, I can't think of anything worse than not having controls and just a screen. In fact the leica M is the camera that least needs a touchscreen out of literally every single camera available - the entire concept of the M line is that it's a manual experience with direct controls.
olakiril
Well-known
Well the M platform shouldn't have an LCD in the first place... :angel:
Removing the atrocious buttons/dials from the back.
But the most important manual controls for photography are there: MF/Aperture/shutter speed/ISO. All the rest need to go.
Anyways, this is my personal opinion so no need to get upset. I just believe that they can make the camera look even nicer without sacrificing usability.
pechelman
resu deretsiger
Looks like it's missing an EVF port.
I thought the rumor said it would use a similar\same interface to the EVF-2?
Though maybe it's just not shown there in this model...looks like they have room for it with the off-center engraving of the "Made in Germany" text even if the "Wetzlar" is close to the place where it needs to be.
I thought the rumor said it would use a similar\same interface to the EVF-2?
Though maybe it's just not shown there in this model...looks like they have room for it with the off-center engraving of the "Made in Germany" text even if the "Wetzlar" is close to the place where it needs to be.
Duane Pandorf
Well-known
If this is an accurate photo of the next M model it would appear to me that it won't have live view so won't do video nor need an external EVF. And since the name appears to be M10 indicates to me that the M240 was an interim model until the SL came on the scene.
Those that want or desire liveview will need to buy the Q, T or SL.