M3 vs. M6

[peter_n]

I've tested the meter in my M6 against my Megatron Euro-Master and Minolta IIIF and found it to be extremely accurate. Once I set up the basic aperture/shutter combo I've learned to ignore what's happening at the bottom of the viewfinder and trust my judgement.

 

[drec]

I had an M6 a few years ago. I found myself wanting to make an exposure reading every time I lifted the camera to my eye. Now I have an M3. I find it much more intuitive to just take a light reading and approximate for that, metering again every hour/every tricky lighting situation. It makes my shooting a lot faster. Pre-metering and pre-focusing-- makes my M3 faster than a Nikon F5 on automatic-everything... well, on the first shot, anyway! The F5 could be done a roll by the time I'm on the second frame!

 

[Jarvis]

I just have experience with the M6 Classic and I think it's a very well built camera. Unfortunately I have never had the pleasure of holding an Older M but my thought would be that if you purchase a camera for day to day use I would allways go for the newest model one can afford, like a previous thread metioned, every scratch on a real classic (M2) will not only decrease the value but will cause you a sleepless night. As for lightmetering, you don't have to use it, you can still use handheld, but when it's there and available why not use it. The M6 lightmeter is pretty acurate actually, I could live without... but it's good to have.
Also 2nd hand market prices do not differ between M2/3 and M6

 

[peter_n]

Unfortunately I have never had the pleasure of holding an Older M but my thought would be that if you purchase a camera for day to day use I would allways go for the newest model one can afford...

My thoughts exactly. I too have never even seen an M2 or M3 in real life, never mind held one. I'm inclined to the newest one I have the money for, which is why I'm really, really, really hoping I can afford an M7 this year. 🙂

 

[denishr]

Peter, I wish you were closer, so I could loan you either my M3 or the M2, just to play with them for a few days and shoot some film. Those are excellent cameras, and coupled with top notch optics, deliver stunning results. No need for meter or any kind of batteries - kind of "back to basics"... No, perhaps not "basics"... I'd rather say "back to photography" instead of 'you press the button, we do the rest' - philosophy... 🙂
I don't know if I'm making myself clear - but those mechanical Leicas are something one really appreciates after a while. If you like rangefinder cameras, then you'd surely appreciate a mechanical Leica. Nothing like it - at least I haven't found anything like it. Perhaps it's just hype, but there must be some reason why the M3 is glorified as a supreme mechanical camera - top of the Leica line.

I was also wary of using external meter, but surprisinly rarely got wrongly exposed negs with my mechanical Leicas (unlike with the modern M6 🙂). These "shortcomings" (lack of built-in meter) actually make you think more when shooting, taking into account the changing light, etc... No "portrait program" or "snow program" or "landscape program" to do it for you, based on how a computer chip thinks the scene fits its exposure database....

If you have money to spare, by all means go with the M7 - but don't discard M2 or M3 just because they are "old". I'd really advise you to try and handle one of the "oldies" (M2 or M3) - newer is not always necesarily "better".

Denis

 

[FrankS]

Denis, I was wondering why you went ahead and bought an M6 after you already had an M2 and M3? Was it for the built-in light meter, the extra framelines, the deal,...?

Jarvis, I wouldn't have a sleepless night because of a scratch on a camera, nor do I care about the resale value of these Leicas. I'm going to use them, and then pass them on to my children. I agree that it would be a waste for someone to buy a good camera and then not use it for fear of scratching it. So either don't buy one you're not going to use, or buy it and use it fearlessly (but with respect.)

 

[Jarvis]

Frank,

I use my camera's fearlessly, innitially I wouldn't care for any schratches either, but still I do for some strange reason. I have a Hassleblad 500C/M and if my wife wouldn't of objected I would take it to bed with me, it can stand bumps and "wild handling" but after a new dent or scratch I tend to nurse it like a baby..... But then on the other hand it adds to the character of the camera ... (I have the same with my Guitars)

 

[back alley]

denis, you said it well.
i too am absolutley in love with the mechanical all manual way of shooting.
i remember shooting with auto everything cameras and enjoying the experience, but also needing to remember to 'fool' the meter to do what i wanted of it sometimes. and having to manually undo some of the auto settings, like changing the film speed to what i wanted it to be.

i really enjoy shooting now, the whole process, not just looking at finished prints.

and i'm with you frank, shoot, be mindful of the equipment but you can't be afraid of putting a mark on it.
joe

 

[peter_n]

Peter, I wish you were closer...

Lovely thought Denis, someday hopefully I will handle an M2 or M3. But my M6TTL is mechanical and I can always remove the meter battery if I want to! 😉 With an M7, I can use it just like my M6 or use the aperture priority AE when I wish. Its a very practical camera... 🙂

 

[denishr]

Denis, I was wondering why you went ahead and bought an M6 after you already had an M2 and M3? Was it for the built-in light meter, the extra framelines, the deal,...?

The answer is simple, Frank: GAS!!!

Sheesh, now I realize I'll have to get me an M4 and an M5, too 😀

Denis

 

[former member]

Well, now that I have my M2, M3DS, and M3SS, I could see my way fit to picking up an M6 Wetzlar. The M5 just does not look like a Leica... Well maybe like a Leica on prednisone. The M4 is just an M2 with a rewind crank and self-resetting counter. The M4-2 and M4-P are M6's without exposure meters. Been there, done that with Nikon RF's. Not gonna Collect em all... (no! Not Gonna do it AGAIN!)

I can load the M3 in the same amount of time as the M6; I bought a second take up spool and make a pre-threaded "cartridge" to drop in. I have a harder time loading the M3SS with the "quick-load" kit that is installed in it.

 

[Stu :)]

The answer is simple, Frank: GAS!!!

Sheesh, now I realize I'll have to get me an M4 and an M5, too 😀

Denis

Don't forget about an M1, M7 and a MP 😀

Stu 🙂

 

[FrankS]

This is the way I look at it, and this is only my opinion: cameras like the M2 and M3 are just not being made anymore. I don't think, and I may be totally wrong on this, but I don't think that the later Leicas have the same build quality. I have absolutely no evidence to support this belief, but think about it. The M2 and M3 were built in a different time and era, where the engineers made more decisions than the accountants, which is how it works today. There is a greater degree of hand-assembly, and the attitude of workers was different then than it is today. I just can't see that today's M7's especially, are still going to be around in 40-50 years from now. Maybe they don't need to be, and that may be a design/manufacturing decision that was made.

I hope I don't offend anyone with this view, and I am totally prepared to be wrong. It wouldn't be the first time.

 

[aoresteen]

The M3 won't take a motor. I like motors. I had Don at DAG mod my M3 to use the M motor and M4 loading. I like it better than an M6!

 

[FrankS]

Denis, you own an M2 , M3, and an M6 (which is probably the best of the newer Leica crop, and an early German version at that). Can you discern a difference in feel between them that might be explained by build quality/worker idealism?

Who else has both an older M body and a newer one? Can you comment on how they compare/feel?

 

[denishr]

Frank, to be honest, I haven't shot enough to be able to tell. I mean, I'd have to carry them around all the time, shooting all three for several months to be able to provide a precise and argumented answer to that...
However, from my brief experience with the M6, I'd say that both the M2 and M3 are a bit "smoother" in operation (wind lever, etc.).
Also, I have not tried the M6 with the grip yet - both my M2 and M3 have grips, which might account for a small difference in operation. With the M6, I'm using Lutz's "Sling". Felt a bit strange at first, but it actually eliminates the need for a grip. However, due to the position of my fingers in the sling, I usually end up winding to the next shot with two short strokes on the lever.
But, that's not a real difference in camera design and feel - just that I use the M6 in a different way.
Still, I think I can feel the diffeerence in the operation of the lever - the older ones are smoother.
I'll probably put one of the grips on the M6 these days and then I'll be able to make a proper comparison.
One thing is for sure - the Leicas handle much better with a grip - at least for me.
Oh, and BTW - my photos have not improved with the M6 😀

Denis

 

[RubenBlaedel]

FrankS - I have the M2 and M6 and besides small isues they are both nice cameras - I shoot a lot of slide film so when I have had to use the meter in the M6 I have done that with respect to that. I shoot mostly with the 35 cron so I like the finder in the M2 and in the M6 wereas the finder in the M3 fits better if your prime lens is a 50 mm. I mentioned earlier on this thread that there is a plastic thingy on the filmwinder on the M6 that I do not like but both cameras have great mecanics and great feel to them - as the only electronics on the M6 is the meter, it is still as usefull as the M2, if that part brakes, so I guess it will be able to live for just as long. 40+ years

 

[FrankS]

Oh, and BTW - my photos have not improved with the M6 Denis
__________________


Darn! I was hoping a Leica would improve mine.

 

[richard_l]

There's a difference between the "feel" of the M2/3 and M6 which can be attributed to brass vs. steel gears in the winder. I wonder whether plastic gears could be made even smoother than brass (wouldn't last as long, obviously).

I'm not sure there is any significant difference in actual build quality between my M2 and M6. They both seem solid as a rock, with perfect fit and finish (to the naked eye at least). If I like the M2 a little better, it's because of the smooth brass gears, uncluttered viewfinder, and lack of engraving on the front of the top plate. If I use the M6 a little more often, it's due to the difference between grabbing a single item (camera) and two items (camera plus meter) as I leave the house.