M6 light leaks

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alex.wheatley

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My M6 has started to show light leaks, and I wondered if anyone has had experience/advice on this issue. Basically on almost every negative there are small exposed lines outside of the frame on the sprocket holes, then if the light was strong there is a leak line coming from this into the frame. The line outside the frame is always in the same place relative to the frame, and whether the leak hits the frame depends on the strength of the light.
I did a small experiment by advancing a couple of frames in darkness then taking a reference photo but not advancing the lever afterwards so that the blank film minus the photo sat still in the camera, I then took the camera outside, and when developed there was one mark on the film, and that mark, when the film is put in the camera and lined up with the reference photo at the opening, is in the gap between the cog that engages the sprocket and the spool the film wraps around, at the top end of the camera. So I'm now pretty sure where the light hits the film but not where it is coming from.
Could be the hinges of the back door, the strap lugs, or may be from the top plate, can anyone help?

Thanks
Alex

Not sure how to upload an image but have found a thread elsewhere from someone who had exactly the same leak marks but it is old and there is not a clear answer so here is a link to one of their pictures...

http://zvereff.com/leica/1.jpg
 
looks like it's coming from the flap seal on the back door. try another film and tape over the top of the back door hinge, left to right with gaffer tape and see if the leak disappears. My ttl had this. With clour film the leaks were orange.
 
Thank you nobbylon,
I did try this and the results were a little un-definative, there did appear to be a reduction in the leak but is was still present (the line on the edge of the negative was still there) and the fact that the position of the leak seems a-bit further to the right (looking at the back of the camera) than the hinge makes me unsure, I have another roll in at the moment and have tape in place so we will see how this turns out when the sun comes out again...
thanks
Alex
 
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Alex,
take the back of the camera off and make sure the flap seal at the top is sitting straight. If the leaks are on the bottom left then tape up the top edge on a few reference frames and then the right side of the door for a few more and finally top and side edge for another couple. Mine was an elusive leak and in the end I had the top flap strip replaced to sit slightly further down toward the film. It cured it.
Are you using colour or b&w film.
With the back fully taped I think with clour film you will only get blue tinted streaks showing leaks from the front. All rear leaks are orange I'm pretty sure.
If it doesn't stop after taping the back up, I'd next cover the finder windows and eye piece.
However from the pic you showed i'm certain it's the back door as that looks identical to my ttl's leaks,
regards john
 
Thanks for all your help. I have been using the black and white exclusively and so am not sure about the tinge, unfortunately I won't be able to buy/get processed any colour film until the shops open on monday so can only check with B&W for the moment. This morning I went out and tried taping the top edge of the door and the strap lug and both seemed to minimise but not remove the leak. Tomorrow when the sun is out I will try more taping as you have suggested.

Here is a link (i hope) to some images with the leak and one of the edge of the negative. The scanner didn't pick it up but it is clear to see in person that the damage in the frame spreads from the mark on the edge, the best way I can think to describe the way it looks is like a line drawn with a fountain pen that you have smudged in one direction with your finger. Please ignore the blemishes on the negative this was from me handling them while trying to establish where the leak was.

http://img340.imageshack.us/g/80868393.jpg/

Thank you again
Alex
 
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Thanks Alex, very unusual type of artifact. Not the regular light leak I'mused to seeing. Can't remember where I read it up try taping up your iso dial as well, very, very (did I say very ?) remote possibility this could be the source as well.
 
Will defiantly try that too, thank you. Would very much like to find the source as the camera is still under warranty from the shop I got it from a couple of months ago but I think unless I isolate the position of the leak myself there is a high chance they won't be able to find it or at least it will be gone for a very long while while they do!

Not having much luck really, first Leica I have bought after lusting after one for ages and already had the slow shutter speeds pack in, the preview lever jam, the rangefinder alignment go off and now this, but at least its pretty!

Thanks
Alex
 
There is a light shield around the shutter. Both of mine went bad on two M6 cameras. The problems shows as high density streak across sky area going down around 3/16 " into the picture area.
and sometimes extends into the space between the frames.

It was a $75 repair 10 years back from Dag. The replacement seal is silver mylar and will have better life.

My M6 were bought new when they first arrived and had very little use, may 25 rolls @ by 1995/2000. So it is a material, not wear problem.
 
Thank you Ronald, if this is the problem is there any clear way to see it? I'm not sure if this is my problem as the leak is always off the frame and sometimes on it rather than visa versa, and my tests showed the position of the leak affects the previous frame not the current one, which is not what you would think would happen around the shutter?! But certainly does seem an option, did your leaks look like mine?
Thanks again
Alex
 
Alex,
teething troubles and nothing more! It shows it hasn't had a hard life and once it's sorted it will be fine for years.
From the 3rd example, if the leak is from the back then the leak will bleed beyond the actual frame. On the example you can't see this but you say it's noticable for real. Check your films carefully and if it's bleeding beyond the frame from the edge of the film then my money is still on the rear door top light seal.
 
Thanks, I guess if it is a seal on the shutter it will be leaking from the front? So a colour film will be blue as opposed to orange, so I will test with colour as soon as I can.

With regard to the leaks the mark in the 3rd photo, the bright white line that is out of the frame right on the barcode of the negative, is present on nearly every negative (except indoor low light), where as it only bleeds onto the actual frame when in bright daylight or with fast film. So the leak is hitting the edge of the negative and when bright enough it bleeds from here onto the frame (you can on the negative see grey exposed lines and fog coming from the black (white when reversed) line at the edge). My hunch is that the leak is probably coming from the back as you'd think if it was the front/shutter area it would more likely hit the frame first and would perhaps be less dependant on lighting conditions, and the shape of the leaks that are on the frame look like the light is bending or blocked by something like the obstacles light from the back would have to get through, but this is just speculative.
Alex
 
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With colour print film, leak from front = blue
leak from back = orange/red
Tape the back up as suggested. You can always add a couple of light seal foam strips to the camera on the vertical sides where the door closes. I had this done on my ttl along with the later rubber door strip that is on some MP's on the non hinge side.
 
Well I will have a bit of a play tomorrow and see if I can find my leak! Just wanted to say thanks again for all the help and advice from everyone, nice to know that there a great people out there willing to help and share their experiences on your problems.
Alex
 
So I went out this morning with a few rolls of film and some electrical tape and have isolated the source of the leak I think, its the rangefinder window! This was the one place where if tape was placed the leak was gone, anyone experienced this before???

Does the window have light seals that might fail or does this mean the weak link is some joint between the top plate and film area?

Thanks Alex
 
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Did you develop the film already? if it's definately the rangefinder window then it's an odd one! has the camera been apart. You said that the slow speeds had been playing up. was the leak there before this was sorted. There is a shield which sits under the rangefinder mech, a little shaped plate that maybe has been omitted or fitted wrongly?
 
Looking over my old negatives, before the camera had a service a couple of week ago, the marks on the edge were always there but I had just assumed they were results of poor processing, or were already part of the film as they were so predictable and well formed. However it was only this week (the first time the sun has been out since I got the camera, english weather!) that the marks started to expand and reach the frames showing it was a leak. So yes I think it was there before the service but unfortunately I had not realised!
I am about develop my third roll this morning just to confirm the results, I want to ensure it is not the rewind lever as at one point I used a large bit of tape that covered both so will let you know once I see the negatives. Thanks Alex
 
can do if you would like but they were identical to the ones I posted of the flare! I can post a comparison of ones with the back taped and the rangefinder tapped, i can scan the edge again because that seems to be the best comparison. Or did you mean pictures of how I taped the camera back up?!
 
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