M6: Strange rewind crank symptoms...

[caffeineshutter]

I've recently purchased a used M6 "bargain" classification from KEH. (I dig them; have been a customer for years),

I've run one roll of film through this one, and was idly twiddling with the rewind crank the other night, wondering if the next roll would be Tri-X or Fuji Superia.

So the camera had no film in it, but I noticed when I turned the rewind crank that at a certain point (I believe 7 o'clock judging by the crank slot) I'd feel a slight & short bit of resistance. Is this supposed to happen (perhaps to maintain tension)? Or could this just be a quirk of this particular body?


CJ

 

[JNewell]

Is the rewind knob bent to any degree?

 

[caffeineshutter]

If you mean...

If you mean...

the arm you fold out; no. The 'arbor' (can't think of the correct word--anyone?) ...the post that actually goes down into the body to turn cotact other gears; no.

In fact, I didn't notice anything unusual when I was shooting the first roll.

I'm perplexed.

Is the rewind knob bent to any degree?

 

[caffeineshutter]

the arm you fold out; no. The 'arbor' (can't think of the correct word--anyone?) ...the post that actually goes down into the body to turn cotact other gears; no.

In fact, I didn't notice anything unusual when I was shooting the first roll.

I'm perplexed.

PS: The circular part of the crank that the arm folds into is about..
.maybe 2mm off the surface of the body. (don't have it with me right now).

 

[LeicaTom]

......the knob maybe got tapped?

Or there`s some gunk in the top of the body inside and perhaps it just needs cleaning?

I`m going to add the *all brass* SL2 crank to my M6 sometime in the future and also a black M3 advance lever, to make things a little more simpler, faster and more robust 🙂
(I talked to DAG about this and this is the solution to the weak crank and slipping advance lever problems commonly known with the M6)

Other than that the M6 is a perfect camera 😀

Enjoy!

Tom

 

[varjag]

Your knob was knocked a bit. Rewind cranks are fairly delicate on Ms.

Mine have been scratchy two times now. Small bend can be amended by pressing it out with finger.

 

[caffeineshutter]

Ok, so the knob was knocked a bit...

Ok, so the knob was knocked a bit...

by the previous owner. That hypothesis seems to fit.

So my question to you all is: Do I send this back to KEH and have it sorted out? Or should I just deal with it?


CJ

Your knob was knocked a bit. Rewind cranks are fairly delicate on Ms.

Mine have been scratchy two times now. Small bend can be amended by pressing it out with finger.

 

[caffeineshutter]

by the previous owner. That hypothesis seems to fit.

So my question to you all is: Do I send this back to KEH and have it sorted out? Or should I just deal with it?


CJ

...and FWIW, this isn't the small rewind arm; it's the post that goes down into the body and attaches to the film cassette.

 

[SolaresLarrave]

Hmmm... you may have a legitimate reason to send it back to KEH. Check with them first, though.

 

[JNewell]

If you're sure that the shaft that the knob is attached to is bent, send it back. It needs to be replaced, which requires removing the top plate. (You could do it yourself, but it's a bit of a job.)

If it's just the knob itself that's bent, which is more usual, you could replace it yourself. The part shouldn't cost much more than return shipping to KEH. You might be able to talk them into sending you the part.

When you get home, look at the knob carefully from the side while turning it. Clearances are close and if it contacts the body at any point you'd feel it sticking.

 

[Ken Ford]

Chances are it's a bent knob, not crank.

My M6 came with a pranged knob that I replaced with an SL2 knob on Don's advice. A thirty second fix, and it solved the problem for all time.

 

[caffeineshutter]

Ok. Got home, took a good look at it. Interesting...

Ok. Got home, took a good look at it. Interesting...

The rewind knob is bent. With the arm pulled back (as in preparation to rewind) when I look at the two 'halves' of the knob closely--looking at it from the 6 o'clock position, with the extended crank pointing away from me--I can see that the right "half" is lower than the left. When I turn the crank slowly and observe where the resistance starts in the rotation, it's due to this lower half grinding against the top plate.

So that's the problem. Question is, what to do? bend it upward somehow? Send it back? (would rather not of course--just because this kid doesn't want to part with his new toy, but if it's the intelligent thing to do, I will).


Advice? Tips?

Thanks,

-CJ

Chances are it's a bent knob, not crank.

My M6 came with a pranged knob that I replaced with an SL2 knob on Don's advice. A thirty second fix, and it solved the problem for all time.

 

[LeicaTom]

The rewind knob is bent. With the arm pulled back (as in preparation to rewind) when I look at the two 'halves' of the knob closely--looking at it from the 6 o'clock position, with the extended crank pointing away from me--I can see that the right "half" is lower than the left. When I turn the crank slowly and observe where the resistance starts in the rotation, it's due to this lower half grinding against the top plate.

So that's the problem. Question is, what to do? bend it upward somehow? Send it back? (would rather not of course--just because this kid doesn't want to part with his new toy, but if it's the intelligent thing to do, I will).


Advice? Tips?

Thanks,

-CJ

Bending it up and down will only make it loose, I say REPLACE IT!......put a SL2 knob on it, call DAG and ask if he can do it for you with a quick turn around, simple job will cost you like maybe $70 or less plus the shipping back and forth........
(the ORIGINAL M6 rewind knob is JUNK, filmsy and always lets people down)

If the cameras really good, shutter speeds are dead on and exposures and this is the ONLY issue, KEEP the camera, the rewind knob is an easy fix as I stated

I`m doing that job to mine as I explained in my first post for like $200
(but with a viewfinder adjustment also added) and the two new items, SL2 knob and M3 advance lever, it will make for a BETTER camera and make the M6 100% user friendly 😀

Tom

 

[Ken Ford]

It is literally a one minute job to remove the knob, I wouldn't send it out or back! The original knob can be flattened with no harm for a zero-cost fix, but I recommend removing it first to bend it - I wouldn't just pry on it while it's on the camera.

Do you have a set of jewelers screwdrivers?

 

[varjag]

Question is, what to do? bend it upward somehow? Send it back? (would rather not of course--just because this kid doesn't want to part with his new toy, but if it's the intelligent thing to do, I will).


Advice? Tips?

As I already mentioned, try to press out with your thumb a bit. Push on side of the knob a bit, spin to see if it helped.. if not, repeat. Worked for me (and am not especially muscular).

 

[JNewell]

If the camera's really great, keep it. Either fix it (may or may not work) or replace it ($40 for the part from DAG and you can do it yourself). If the camera's not so great, send it back.

The original part is thin aluminum. The earlier M4/SL2/etc. part is brass. It's not indestructible but it is definitely more robust.

 

[Andrew3511]

For some reason a dropped Leica always lands on it's rewind crank. I replaced mine and have had no problems since, as it is cast aluminium trying to bend it back into shape is quite likely to break it, be warned.

There is the world's tiniest grub screw holding the crank to the shaft. You don't actually need to take it out altogether, just loosen it. But do it over a surface that is easy to locate an absolutely miniscule black screw on or you will spend a long time on your hands and knees.

We often learn by our mistakes. Part of the fun of maturity is having done a lot of that you find it's much better to learn from other people's mistakes

 

[caffeineshutter]

Excellent info Andrew...

Excellent info Andrew...

I appreciate your words of advice and everyone else's in the thread.

So now I've got a nice M6 whose rewind crank slowly scrapes more zinc each time I advance the film (yep it must have passed through the enamel before it got to my hands).

I'm not prepared to do any manual work with it due to a numbness condition in my hands. Typing is fine; little screws would send me over the edge. ;-)

That being the case, I may as well just live with it for now, and eventually get a replacement (alloy or brass) from DAG. I'd love to get a Panzer-spec brass crank, but hearing that Leitz chose a less-hardy crank to give the M6 a 'crumple zone' to ensure survivability in a crash, I'd agree with their interest in protecting the camera's innards. (Have you SEEN a diagram of an M rangefinder's optical path? Yeesh! Makes most SLRs look like box Brownies in comparison.)

I'm tempted to bend the side of the crank upward, so that it won't continue to whittle the top plate away...but I don't want to break it.

Has anyone else here bent & weakened the crank such that it eventually broke?

CJ

For some reason a dropped Leica always lands on it's rewind crank. I replaced mine and have had no problems since, as it is cast aluminium trying to bend it back into shape is quite likely to break it, be warned.

There is the world's tiniest grub screw holding the crank to the shaft. You don't actually need to take it out altogether, just loosen it. But do it over a surface that is easy to locate an absolutely miniscule black screw on or you will spend a long time on your hands and knees.

We often learn by our mistakes. Part of the fun of maturity is having done a lot of that you find it's much better to learn from other people's mistakes

 

[ampguy]

Another known M6 rewind problem is the slotted washer coming loose. The symptoms are when the rewind prevents advancing past about frame 15 or so.

I have my M6 off to DAG, and am going to ask about the brass rewind crank.

 

[JNewell]

In your shoes I think I'd send it back. The knob is bent because the camera got whacked at some point. You don't know how, how hard, or what was done by way of service afterward. You are within the KEH return/exchange period - take advantage of it if the camera isn't otherwise compelling.