cablesnarl
Member
I tried both cameras. I bought a Zeiss Ikon, but I preferred the black M6 TTL .58 that I tried (I wear glasses). I didn't like the higher magnification M6s I tried.
Around that time there was a price cut on the Ikon and I just felt that it was the right choice to get a new camera instead of a used one. Also - I know this is stupid - but I was glad it didn't have a red dot and say "Leica" on it.
But the M6 felt very nice and I'd still like to try one. It feels great in my hands. I like the fact that the M6 has a cloth horizontal shutter. I don't have a logical reason - my Pentax s1a is my favorite SLR and it has a horizontal cloth shutter. (I feel that there's more of a "kick" from the vertical metal shutters.)
On to what I think is good about the IKON:
As a left eyed shooter, please note that the viewfinder is as far to the left as it possibly could be due to the rewind crank being on the bottom. This means it should be possible to wind the film and keep the camera to your eye. The AEL button will be right in front of your nose. The way my nose is shaped, I can press this button with my right thumb without moving my eye away from the viewfinder. My thumb goes between my eyes and presses the button. YMMV, depending on the shape and size of your nose. I really like the fact that you don't have to keep the AEL button pressed for it to hold your setting.
I don't mind the covering and I don't use a strap. However, this camera has not seen heavy usage so far.
The viewfinder is definitely a strong point, but for me with my glasses the 35mm framelines are just usable. I think it would be great with a 50mm.
I haven't been as thrilled with the images I've gotten using this camera, probably due to operator error (although my 35 Biogon lens focus was slightly off, which I've had fixed.)
I don't think I"ve quite gotten into the rangefinder gestalt, or maybe it's not for me. I might try a .58 M6 if I can find one. But I'm sure they're both good cameras (in the right hands.)
Around that time there was a price cut on the Ikon and I just felt that it was the right choice to get a new camera instead of a used one. Also - I know this is stupid - but I was glad it didn't have a red dot and say "Leica" on it.
But the M6 felt very nice and I'd still like to try one. It feels great in my hands. I like the fact that the M6 has a cloth horizontal shutter. I don't have a logical reason - my Pentax s1a is my favorite SLR and it has a horizontal cloth shutter. (I feel that there's more of a "kick" from the vertical metal shutters.)
On to what I think is good about the IKON:
As a left eyed shooter, please note that the viewfinder is as far to the left as it possibly could be due to the rewind crank being on the bottom. This means it should be possible to wind the film and keep the camera to your eye. The AEL button will be right in front of your nose. The way my nose is shaped, I can press this button with my right thumb without moving my eye away from the viewfinder. My thumb goes between my eyes and presses the button. YMMV, depending on the shape and size of your nose. I really like the fact that you don't have to keep the AEL button pressed for it to hold your setting.
I don't mind the covering and I don't use a strap. However, this camera has not seen heavy usage so far.
The viewfinder is definitely a strong point, but for me with my glasses the 35mm framelines are just usable. I think it would be great with a 50mm.
I haven't been as thrilled with the images I've gotten using this camera, probably due to operator error (although my 35 Biogon lens focus was slightly off, which I've had fixed.)
I don't think I"ve quite gotten into the rangefinder gestalt, or maybe it's not for me. I might try a .58 M6 if I can find one. But I'm sure they're both good cameras (in the right hands.)
Turtle
Veteran
I think shutter noise is a minor consideration (My MP is quiet, but the Mamiya 7 is FAR quieter)
Robustness is an issue mainly for those on assignments where repair facilities are not available. Most people do not work under such circumstances.
I think AE is not nearly as useful as some people think. I dont wish to sound arrogant, but the more experienced you are the less useful AE is, especially in B&W where high contrast often means lost shadow detail in AE mode - I often update my shadow readings and find they change relatively little. AE is often swayed too much by sudden appearance of the sun etc and it does its own thing even when you dont want it to. Manual mode can be VERY handy, wllowing you to know your shadows will be good in a grab shot having locked in a sensible exposure. AEL is not the same because you have to meter one area and then lock it in for the shot...so if the shot is fleeting and backlit you may well be in trouble. If you have a good low value used to establish your expoure, you are still good for that quick backlit shot. Of course the z1 allows both, but is absence in a M6/P is a non-issue to me.
Handling, handling, handling. Ignoring the above and assuming you could work with both, which feels right in your hands? This will dictate your results more than anything else. do the controls come to hand. Does the camera come up to your eye sweetly every time. do you find your eye aligns nicely with the VF? Can you predict the shutter release every time?
I bought MPs because after handling an M2 I was smitten. They felt perfect and I was also glad to have a mechanical shutter because working far from home I wanted to know that if I did not manage to get hold of batteries/lost/misplaced them, I would still be good to go. do I regret it? No. Would I prefer AE...well, it would be handy sometimes, but I do not feel I have lost a shot because of it and am sure I have nailed a few because I lacked it....Has the lack of AE helped me think about the light more? Yes (but then again I shoot LF with a spot meter). Would I have done as well with a Z1, probably. My conclusion? The best camera is the one you feel happiest with. Who cares what anyone else thinks. I would ensure hands on with both or if you have handled one and liked it and its features suit you, just get it. You don't have to justify your decision to anyone. Take the pictures and let them do the talking. Nobody will ever wonder what you would be producing with a M6 rather than a Z1 or vica versa. Make a sensible decision you are happy with and then take pics. If you rin into problems you are perfectly entitled to change your mind!
Rgds
Robustness is an issue mainly for those on assignments where repair facilities are not available. Most people do not work under such circumstances.
I think AE is not nearly as useful as some people think. I dont wish to sound arrogant, but the more experienced you are the less useful AE is, especially in B&W where high contrast often means lost shadow detail in AE mode - I often update my shadow readings and find they change relatively little. AE is often swayed too much by sudden appearance of the sun etc and it does its own thing even when you dont want it to. Manual mode can be VERY handy, wllowing you to know your shadows will be good in a grab shot having locked in a sensible exposure. AEL is not the same because you have to meter one area and then lock it in for the shot...so if the shot is fleeting and backlit you may well be in trouble. If you have a good low value used to establish your expoure, you are still good for that quick backlit shot. Of course the z1 allows both, but is absence in a M6/P is a non-issue to me.
Handling, handling, handling. Ignoring the above and assuming you could work with both, which feels right in your hands? This will dictate your results more than anything else. do the controls come to hand. Does the camera come up to your eye sweetly every time. do you find your eye aligns nicely with the VF? Can you predict the shutter release every time?
I bought MPs because after handling an M2 I was smitten. They felt perfect and I was also glad to have a mechanical shutter because working far from home I wanted to know that if I did not manage to get hold of batteries/lost/misplaced them, I would still be good to go. do I regret it? No. Would I prefer AE...well, it would be handy sometimes, but I do not feel I have lost a shot because of it and am sure I have nailed a few because I lacked it....Has the lack of AE helped me think about the light more? Yes (but then again I shoot LF with a spot meter). Would I have done as well with a Z1, probably. My conclusion? The best camera is the one you feel happiest with. Who cares what anyone else thinks. I would ensure hands on with both or if you have handled one and liked it and its features suit you, just get it. You don't have to justify your decision to anyone. Take the pictures and let them do the talking. Nobody will ever wonder what you would be producing with a M6 rather than a Z1 or vica versa. Make a sensible decision you are happy with and then take pics. If you rin into problems you are perfectly entitled to change your mind!
Rgds
