TennesseJones
Well-known
Dear Forum...
I'm current reading posts to learn the m9, it's ways and most of all the wonders of processing.
Like many of people here I imagine, I'm primarily a RF film user: m6 for me and a recent m2. I'm using a loaner M9 for a bit, to see if it works for me.
Now of course I'm reading all that the Internet offers about this process of moving from a film Leica to a digi one, and certainly am scanning this forum for facts (RFF taught me so much about how to use any type of camera) so my question isn't a product of laziness.
And the question is.. what would be your top tips for moving to using digi leica? In use and and working up final images.
I'm guessing that many people here were in the same boat: not all time digital wizards but who have had a similar (but longer and more distinguished!) use of 'simple' film cameras and then maybe the leica or fuji digis after.
I don't yet have access to using Silver EfEx, but that seems the best way to have a good black and white work flow? I use apple aperture at the moment, sluggishly.
My first two m9 images are on Flickr, if any use.
Anyway, all top tips would be wonderful.
Many thanks!
I'm current reading posts to learn the m9, it's ways and most of all the wonders of processing.
Like many of people here I imagine, I'm primarily a RF film user: m6 for me and a recent m2. I'm using a loaner M9 for a bit, to see if it works for me.
Now of course I'm reading all that the Internet offers about this process of moving from a film Leica to a digi one, and certainly am scanning this forum for facts (RFF taught me so much about how to use any type of camera) so my question isn't a product of laziness.
And the question is.. what would be your top tips for moving to using digi leica? In use and and working up final images.
I'm guessing that many people here were in the same boat: not all time digital wizards but who have had a similar (but longer and more distinguished!) use of 'simple' film cameras and then maybe the leica or fuji digis after.
I don't yet have access to using Silver EfEx, but that seems the best way to have a good black and white work flow? I use apple aperture at the moment, sluggishly.
My first two m9 images are on Flickr, if any use.
Anyway, all top tips would be wonderful.
Many thanks!
sevres_babylone
Veteran
I came to the M9 by a different route -- from the Epson R-D1, with only limited experience with rangefinders (Mamiya 7, XA).
I do recommend Silver Efex Pro, and use it for almost all of my black and white conversions.
Partly from habit with my Epson, I always shoot raw + jpeg. Raw processing is much easier than when I started, but sometimes for posting to the web, it's quicker just using the jpeg, and sometimes the M9 jpeg gets tricky light temperature situations right in situations where I would otherwise have to struggle to get the same result.
Good luck with your shooting!
I do recommend Silver Efex Pro, and use it for almost all of my black and white conversions.
Partly from habit with my Epson, I always shoot raw + jpeg. Raw processing is much easier than when I started, but sometimes for posting to the web, it's quicker just using the jpeg, and sometimes the M9 jpeg gets tricky light temperature situations right in situations where I would otherwise have to struggle to get the same result.
Good luck with your shooting!
TennesseJones
Well-known
Thanks Sevres!
Will get Silver EfEx for sure.
Will get Silver EfEx for sure.
flash
Member
My personal tips.
1. Use uncompressed DNGs. I do see a difference.
2. If you use Lightroom purchase the Huelight Profiles. They're pretty good out of the box.
3. Digital is far more sensitive with focusing. Some of my lenses (135 3.4 and 90 Sumarit) forcuis more accuratelt in one direction than the other)
gordon
1. Use uncompressed DNGs. I do see a difference.
2. If you use Lightroom purchase the Huelight Profiles. They're pretty good out of the box.
3. Digital is far more sensitive with focusing. Some of my lenses (135 3.4 and 90 Sumarit) forcuis more accuratelt in one direction than the other)
gordon
jaapv
RFF Sponsoring Member.
Tip 1: Ditch Aperture
Tip 2: Use Lightroom that came with the camera, or if you got it used, buy Lightroom.
Tip 3: Buy the Lightroom book by Scott Kelby to learn how to use it.
Silver Efex is a nice program, I use it as a Lightroom plugin for special effects, but the Lightroom tools for B&W conversion are excellent in their own right. You don't need SE.
It is ESSENTIAL that you calibrate your computer screen using a Color Spyder or similar, and the better your screen is the better your results will be. Eizo Coloredge or NEC Spectraview are the screens to aspire to. This is as true for colour as it is for black and white.
There is a wealth of M9 information here.
Tip 2: Use Lightroom that came with the camera, or if you got it used, buy Lightroom.
Tip 3: Buy the Lightroom book by Scott Kelby to learn how to use it.
Silver Efex is a nice program, I use it as a Lightroom plugin for special effects, but the Lightroom tools for B&W conversion are excellent in their own right. You don't need SE.
It is ESSENTIAL that you calibrate your computer screen using a Color Spyder or similar, and the better your screen is the better your results will be. Eizo Coloredge or NEC Spectraview are the screens to aspire to. This is as true for colour as it is for black and white.
There is a wealth of M9 information here.
tstermitz
Well-known
I've used Silver Efex a little bit, and find that only a few of the presets suit my taste. They seem to make better B&W than I do in Lightroom, but I think that is a matter of getting more practice.
I do think the hue, saturation and luminance controls in Lightroom ultimately will give me better B&W control than the filters in Silver Efex.
I do think the hue, saturation and luminance controls in Lightroom ultimately will give me better B&W control than the filters in Silver Efex.
icebear
Veteran
Welcome to the digital Leica RF. There is very little bascially that is different from an M6.
You don't have to use film, you use an SD card and here it starts.
- Do follow the freaking instructions in the short manual. Get some Lexar SDHC Pro cards 16gb max,
speed isn't that important as the camera isn't a real beast in writing but that you probably heard already
.
- ALWAYS format your cards in the camera.
If you used the cards before in different cameras I'd recommend a full override once.
- Shoot DNG only for jpgs you can use a point and shoot.
- Do manual white balance (I use Expodisc, various WhiBal cards and profile cards are available).
You will have accurate color right away and don't waste time on every individual shot in post production.
- Expose to the right, learn to read the histogram and max out the potential of resolution/information that can be captured.
Proper exposure is important and you will get great results without all that noise a lot of people have been complaining about with the M9, esp. at higher ISO.
- For b&w conversion work your file first to get the best possible result in color and then convert to monochrome
- Get out there and shoot and post some pictures
- Enjoy
You don't have to use film, you use an SD card and here it starts.
- Do follow the freaking instructions in the short manual. Get some Lexar SDHC Pro cards 16gb max,
speed isn't that important as the camera isn't a real beast in writing but that you probably heard already
. - ALWAYS format your cards in the camera.
If you used the cards before in different cameras I'd recommend a full override once.
- Shoot DNG only for jpgs you can use a point and shoot.
- Do manual white balance (I use Expodisc, various WhiBal cards and profile cards are available).
You will have accurate color right away and don't waste time on every individual shot in post production.
- Expose to the right, learn to read the histogram and max out the potential of resolution/information that can be captured.
Proper exposure is important and you will get great results without all that noise a lot of people have been complaining about with the M9, esp. at higher ISO.
- For b&w conversion work your file first to get the best possible result in color and then convert to monochrome
- Get out there and shoot and post some pictures
- Enjoy
Ronald M
Veteran
My tips
Keep the M8 for infrared.
Use a Whi Bal card to make a custom white balance in sun light and other places where you use the camera.
Save these so you can go back to them as they are more accurate than Leica provided settings.
Buy a good monitor and calibrate it .
It is a superb camera if you keep the imaging chain tight. Let it slip, well garbage in, garbage out.
Keep the M8 for infrared.
Use a Whi Bal card to make a custom white balance in sun light and other places where you use the camera.
Save these so you can go back to them as they are more accurate than Leica provided settings.
Buy a good monitor and calibrate it .
It is a superb camera if you keep the imaging chain tight. Let it slip, well garbage in, garbage out.
Monochrom
Well-known
Hi, i´ve laways be very interested in digital rangefinders, had the rd1s, then an m8...and finally got the m9, i´m happy with it, every day i squeeze a little bit more from it...with better results...
I use LR and photoshop, didn´t like silver efex because st´s always getting in the way i don´t like the definition of B/W it has...so i skip it.
The tips i´d suggest you is using up to 640 in day light and up to 1250 iso during night time...during daylight high iso is not a problem because there´s alot of light luminance noise is not present and high iso means high speed to use small apertures that means great dof and faster shooting...
I use a wrist strap only. safer and non intrusive.
Two batteries
And up to two lenses....50 and 28.....or 35mm alone...mainly zeiss glass...
It´s a terrific camera and try to get good lenses to get the best out of it...it diserves that and you too
Cheers!
I use LR and photoshop, didn´t like silver efex because st´s always getting in the way i don´t like the definition of B/W it has...so i skip it.
The tips i´d suggest you is using up to 640 in day light and up to 1250 iso during night time...during daylight high iso is not a problem because there´s alot of light luminance noise is not present and high iso means high speed to use small apertures that means great dof and faster shooting...
I use a wrist strap only. safer and non intrusive.
Two batteries
And up to two lenses....50 and 28.....or 35mm alone...mainly zeiss glass...
It´s a terrific camera and try to get good lenses to get the best out of it...it diserves that and you too
Cheers!
noimmunity
scratch my niche
This is so true, yet is often overlooked. I know I did.
TennesseJones
Well-known
This is all great, thank you so much..
I think I'll have to replace my computer in the next year anyway, so I think I'll be able to get a better quality of monitor. But I need to calibrate this one for sure.
I'll try the trial version of SFX and then see if it works out for me.
Thanks so much, all tips wonderful!
I think I'll have to replace my computer in the next year anyway, so I think I'll be able to get a better quality of monitor. But I need to calibrate this one for sure.
I'll try the trial version of SFX and then see if it works out for me.
Thanks so much, all tips wonderful!
shanenoir
Established
I too recommend Silver Efex Pro. It works especially well with Photoshop, since you can make a layer of light and dark, and apply that as the luminosity values to the original color image. This is simply not an option with Lightroom.
That said, Lightroom is also a fantastic tool for converting to black and white, especially when you get the hang of using the adjustments brush. When you need to make something look very good in a short amount of time, nothing to my knowledge comes close to Lightroom.
But when you need to make a photo look incredible, Photoshop and Silver Efex are the way to go.
As a side note, a few months ago Google bought out Nik Software, the creators of Silver Efex Pro. Silver Efex Pro is now included as a bundle with Nik Software's other products. Originally Silver Efex Pro cost $200 on its own, but the bundle costs $150, and also includes the programs for Color, Sharpening, Noise Reduction, HDR, etc. Pretty fantastic deal, and it gets better: anybody who bought one of the programs earlier can contact them and get a free download of the complete set.
That said, Lightroom is also a fantastic tool for converting to black and white, especially when you get the hang of using the adjustments brush. When you need to make something look very good in a short amount of time, nothing to my knowledge comes close to Lightroom.
But when you need to make a photo look incredible, Photoshop and Silver Efex are the way to go.
As a side note, a few months ago Google bought out Nik Software, the creators of Silver Efex Pro. Silver Efex Pro is now included as a bundle with Nik Software's other products. Originally Silver Efex Pro cost $200 on its own, but the bundle costs $150, and also includes the programs for Color, Sharpening, Noise Reduction, HDR, etc. Pretty fantastic deal, and it gets better: anybody who bought one of the programs earlier can contact them and get a free download of the complete set.
Richard G
Veteran
1. Lexar SDHC 8G cards.
2. Format in camera.
3. Carry spare card, formatted in M9.
4. Do not delete in camera.
5. Do not write to the card from anywhere else.
6. Do not use continuous mode if you don't have the spare card handy.
7. If you think you might use continuous, don't set advance mode to Discrete.
8. Shoot DNG.
9. Don't dismiss the M9 Jpegs, especially black and white.
10. Set profiles for your most used non-coded lenses.
11. Make one of these profiles DNG and black and white JPEGs - for me the ZM 21 4.5 profile.
12. Code the Zeiss lenses 35 and 50 as the two Leica ASPHS of those focal lengths.
13. Code the ZM 18 f4 and the ZM 21 f4.5 as the Leica 21 2.8 non-aspheric.
14. Get familiar with the lousy 50mm frame lines, deficient along the lower edge.
15. Relax collapsing your Elmar M 50.
16. Be careful changing lenses - wind, dust etc.
17. Regularly Rocket blow the rear of the lens and the rear caps before mounting.
18. Regularly take a shot of the sky or through frosted glass to check for dust on sensor: seems to be easier to blow dust off if it hasn't been there long.
19. Check the lens cap is off if the camera is unresponsive for ages: it will take the maximum duration exposure x 2 as it adds a second noise reduction phase.
20. Use faster shutter speeds than for film: I prefer 1/500s for street.
21. Expose sufficiently with higher ISOs: raising shadows underexposing at 800 is noisier than god exposure at 1600.
22. Don't have the exposure compensation available on the dial.
23. Candid light meter reading with the Info button for manual exposure.
24. Lightroom
25. Lightroom for black and white conversions. I have Silver Efex Pro but use it sparingly.
2. Format in camera.
3. Carry spare card, formatted in M9.
4. Do not delete in camera.
5. Do not write to the card from anywhere else.
6. Do not use continuous mode if you don't have the spare card handy.
7. If you think you might use continuous, don't set advance mode to Discrete.
8. Shoot DNG.
9. Don't dismiss the M9 Jpegs, especially black and white.
10. Set profiles for your most used non-coded lenses.
11. Make one of these profiles DNG and black and white JPEGs - for me the ZM 21 4.5 profile.
12. Code the Zeiss lenses 35 and 50 as the two Leica ASPHS of those focal lengths.
13. Code the ZM 18 f4 and the ZM 21 f4.5 as the Leica 21 2.8 non-aspheric.
14. Get familiar with the lousy 50mm frame lines, deficient along the lower edge.
15. Relax collapsing your Elmar M 50.
16. Be careful changing lenses - wind, dust etc.
17. Regularly Rocket blow the rear of the lens and the rear caps before mounting.
18. Regularly take a shot of the sky or through frosted glass to check for dust on sensor: seems to be easier to blow dust off if it hasn't been there long.
19. Check the lens cap is off if the camera is unresponsive for ages: it will take the maximum duration exposure x 2 as it adds a second noise reduction phase.
20. Use faster shutter speeds than for film: I prefer 1/500s for street.
21. Expose sufficiently with higher ISOs: raising shadows underexposing at 800 is noisier than god exposure at 1600.
22. Don't have the exposure compensation available on the dial.
23. Candid light meter reading with the Info button for manual exposure.
24. Lightroom
25. Lightroom for black and white conversions. I have Silver Efex Pro but use it sparingly.
Richard G
Veteran
26. Practise slow shutter speeds: very useable down to 1/4 but not as easy as with the M2.
27. Half press for exposure lock, signaled by a dot in the shutter speed read out in the VF.
28. Auto exposure might better be a start for a manual setting for the rest of a short session.
29. Limit the number of ISOs you use to help with manual exposure remembered settings.
27. Half press for exposure lock, signaled by a dot in the shutter speed read out in the VF.
28. Auto exposure might better be a start for a manual setting for the rest of a short session.
29. Limit the number of ISOs you use to help with manual exposure remembered settings.
OurManInTangier
An Undesirable
Hi James,
I have SilverEfex, its very good but not absolutely necessary. I tend to use Lightroom for most work and then edit via LR (Plugin) for any small details/extras etc - using the trial version will give you all the knowledge you need on what its capable of.
Jaap and Jon have both mentioned one of the most important aspects of digital photography - a calibrated monitor. Some question the need and point out that everyone viewing your images on their monitor/phone/tablet will not have their screens optimised to match yours but this is an argument that I for one don't understand especially when something like a Spyder 4 is so cheap.
Some photographers tend to dial in some level of negative exposure compensation or simply underexpose a little from the metered reading to avoid blowing the highlights - this will most likely depend on how you meter and how the camera meters.
I'm afraid my two 'digi' tips are exactly that, digital based rather than M9 specific - however, the M9 is a cracker and reminded me of using my M6 in a way that the M8 did not replicate. Not that it necessarily should have done, but it was a boon when the M9 felt like an old friend!
P.S. You seem to have had a number of suggestions recommending Lexar cards, there may be a very good reason for this that I never knew about whilst I had mine. However, I used a range of cards without any issue at any point - Sandisk Ultra/Extreme plus some crappier supermarket bought jobbies purchased when I was in need of more space.
I hope you enjoy using the M9, I will certainly return to digital in my personal photography at some stage.
I have SilverEfex, its very good but not absolutely necessary. I tend to use Lightroom for most work and then edit via LR (Plugin) for any small details/extras etc - using the trial version will give you all the knowledge you need on what its capable of.
Jaap and Jon have both mentioned one of the most important aspects of digital photography - a calibrated monitor. Some question the need and point out that everyone viewing your images on their monitor/phone/tablet will not have their screens optimised to match yours but this is an argument that I for one don't understand especially when something like a Spyder 4 is so cheap.
Some photographers tend to dial in some level of negative exposure compensation or simply underexpose a little from the metered reading to avoid blowing the highlights - this will most likely depend on how you meter and how the camera meters.
I'm afraid my two 'digi' tips are exactly that, digital based rather than M9 specific - however, the M9 is a cracker and reminded me of using my M6 in a way that the M8 did not replicate. Not that it necessarily should have done, but it was a boon when the M9 felt like an old friend!
P.S. You seem to have had a number of suggestions recommending Lexar cards, there may be a very good reason for this that I never knew about whilst I had mine. However, I used a range of cards without any issue at any point - Sandisk Ultra/Extreme plus some crappier supermarket bought jobbies purchased when I was in need of more space.
I hope you enjoy using the M9, I will certainly return to digital in my personal photography at some stage.
JMQ
Well-known
Use a screen protector (e.g. Giotto) -- the screen on the back scratches easily, especially if you are used to putting the camera down on its back.
hellomikmik
Well-known
Try Capture One.
TennesseJones
Well-known
Thank you so much everyone.
So no big fans of apple aperture!
Simon thanks so much for that. I'll certainly take that advice. (Although is the exposure idea the antithesis of 'exposing to the right?' I'm being dense I know, sorry)
And I'm still using that M6 I got off you heavily, and will continue to. It's been all around the world. Been brilliant.
I've got two 8gb San Disc cards which seem to be behaving, but might invest later in something better as suggested. I also found a couple 2gb integral cards unopened in the house, might keep them in a bag for emergency use.
And Richard G that's a great list, thanks so much for it all. I'll work through it.
So no big fans of apple aperture!
Simon thanks so much for that. I'll certainly take that advice. (Although is the exposure idea the antithesis of 'exposing to the right?' I'm being dense I know, sorry)
And I'm still using that M6 I got off you heavily, and will continue to. It's been all around the world. Been brilliant.
I've got two 8gb San Disc cards which seem to be behaving, but might invest later in something better as suggested. I also found a couple 2gb integral cards unopened in the house, might keep them in a bag for emergency use.
And Richard G that's a great list, thanks so much for it all. I'll work through it.
kshapero
South Florida Man
Since I mainly shoot B & W with my M9, I find the Jpegs are all I need. I do sometimes use DXO Film Pack for effect, but less so lately.
Fraser
Well-known
How I use mine.
Shoot Raw I never bother with jpegs and I never bother with in camera WB, and as already said high ISO is fine but make sure exposure is correct even 2500iso is alright a long as you overexpose a wee bit! Avoid Sandisk card especially the newer ones.
Shoot Raw I never bother with jpegs and I never bother with in camera WB, and as already said high ISO is fine but make sure exposure is correct even 2500iso is alright a long as you overexpose a wee bit! Avoid Sandisk card especially the newer ones.