Medium Format Upgrade, Gear Advice!

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streetshoot

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I hope to avoid coming off wordy with my question but my camera gear and style has undergone some drastic changes in the last year and In good ways for the most part and I'm hoping to address my questions and situation to the best of my ability!

Quick run down, I briefly dabbled with 35mm film in my early photograph years but ended up receiving a Canon t2i rebel as a gift which fueled my passion for photography for quite some time while I was still learning some of the basics of composition. I've grown fond of shooting street photography, travel photography, my friends skating, architecture, and I pretty much try to bring my camera everywhere. About a year ago after voyaging on a trip to Puerto Rico and bringing along my Canon and although I took some awesome pictures, I felt extremely disconnected with the dslr. First thing when I got back home was picked up a Canonet Glq17 and started shooting and developing my own film at home. I had a blast, and felt great to get see my images and realize how much more that goes into a photo than a quick snap and the value of each exposure. After that I picked up my current setup the Bessa r2 to get improved 35mm results and love it.

Being somewhat confused about what to do next I sold my T2i and knew i wanted to upgrade to something else film or digital. I made the mistake of getting caught up in the hype of the sony a7 and being able to integrate my bessa lenses... Purchased one and I really disliked it and sold it within a week.

So here I am now. I'm really enthralled in the idea of owning a Medium format camera and the opportunity to blow up my prints to a beautiful size. I was looking at a Mamiya 6/7 and they seem like the ideal option for me being a rangefinder and somewhat portable compared to other MF cameras, but somewhat expensive. Being the same price as a used Canon 5dMii I've thought about looking into one of those, but haven't that much since I'm not sure about how ill feel about owning another digital camera, but it is a great camera, I know that. I'm not trying to spend more than 1.2k really but around that is okay. Ive also considered some of the fuji MF cameras but some are pretty oversized but also more reasonably priced... So I'm really trying to find a camera ill fall in love with and be able to travel with and have it grow to be an extension of me. I'm somewhat lost as you can see and have weighed my options but I'm curious what others have to say or weigh in. Im open to any opinions and feel free to comment whatever you believe would be a good move.

I truly appreciate any replies and I'm really looking forward to hearing back from you guys !
 
fuji gf670 go for $1300 used. that's probably the best option for a travel camera that has a classic feel to it and barely exceeds your budget. the gs645, ga645, and bronica rf645 are other less costly options, but they are more modern.

you can also try a tlr and see how that works out.
 
Are you set on it being a rangefinder?

For rangefinder cameras, here are some options

Zeiss Super Ikonta III and IV - Very compact, good optics with Tessar lens

Voigtlander Bessa II - 6x9 with coupled rangefinder, good optics

There are some other good folders with coupled rangefinders - Mamiya SIX, Balda, Certo 6...

Bronica RF645 - newer camera, vertical 6x4.5 format

Fuji GS645 - great optics, bellows can be problematic

Mamiya 6/7 - sounds like you know about them

Fuji GF667/Voigtlander Bessa III - bigger folding design

Fuji GW690/680/670 - big, fixed lens, great cameras

Kodak Medalist and Medalist II - very good cameras, 6x9, superb lens, heavy, uses 620 film spools

Plaubel Makina 670 - Folding design, great Nikkor 80/2.8

IIRC, there are some other Plaubel cameras

I'm sure I missed a few.


If you are open to other types of cameras, I highly recommend looking at a Rolleiflex 3.5 or 2.8. The waist level finder takes a bit to get used to, but once you do it's a superb street camera.
 
1) 35mm can be quite beautiful when enlarged to even humongous sizes, especially when it's black and white film. I've seen exhibitions of Elliott Erwitt's 35mm work, at greater than 6' across, and it was stunning. Color is probably not so effective that way, but it can work, if you want to work in that kind of aesthetic.

2) You mentioned the big Fuji rangefinders (6x9, etc.). They do not have meters. Just be aware. I was recently interested in them, as well, as they are capable of beautiful results, but i didn't want to add the metering step/process and equipment when traveling.

3). Mamiya 7 is probably the optimal choice. Sharpest lenses, a nice viewfinder. I had the Mamiya 6, and while it was nice to have the additional 'compactness,' i didn't like the bokeh from the 75mm lens, and at this point, i'd rather have the 6x7 proportion in that type of camera.

4). Bronica RF645. I had one and liked it while it worked. But, i needed to have the RF patch alignment fixed, and when that was being done, something must have been damaged internally, as the camera sucked battery power even when switched off. And, that problem was never able to be fixed, somehow....

5). The various Fuji 6x4.5 AF cameras.... Convenient. But, you never know if it's focusing accurately until you've wasted film/opportunities. I tried three different AF Fujis over a period of time, and had bad results with two of them. Swore i'd never try again, but i did and i currently have a GA645i. But, whenever results aren't razor sharp, i have to wonder about the AF module.... I just don't trust them.

You like the Canonet and Bessa, so a rangefinder experience isn't going to be new to you, so i'd think the Mamiya 7 would be fantastic. The Plaubel Makina makes amazing pictures, as well, and i'd consider that if i could get one for the right price, but i think you have more to worry about, reliability-wise. Seems like a more delicate design.
 
I have a Super Ikonta IV in great shape that I will be putting up for sale soon. Do some searches. It will be less than $400 (how much less is up in the air for now). The meter 'works' but appears to be off by a couple of stops (another thing I play with before listing it).

But rather than try to convince you to buy this or that camera- what do you think medium format will give you that 35 doesn't? What are you shooting? What types of scenes, how quickly do you want the camera to react? Can you deal with the 8 exposures of 6x9, 12of 6x6, or 15/16 of 6x4.5? It creates a pressure to think before pushing the shutter. Are you ready to travel with a bag of film?

Twin Lens Reflexes are another approach, the one I use. In terms of image quality, $1200 will get you as good as it gets. I like working with just one focal length, but that doesn't work for many people. And the viewfinder of TLRs, the whole style, won't work for some. Still, give it some thought.
 
I would just buy one that you like and go for it. Both of the cameras that you are looking at are great. Plus if you end up not liking MF then you can sell the camera for pretty much what you bought it for as prices aren't dropping.
 
I second the recommendation for Bessa II, except for the squinty finder.

I saw a couple recommendations for Rolleiflex, so, why not Hasselblad 500c / cm with an 80mm lens? Stunning camera. More compact than you think. And you will love the sound of it when it fires.
 
A Rollei could certainly be an attractive choice.

If the objective is to have the ability to make large prints, particularly of landscapes and travel subjects, then a 6x9 negative has clear advantages over 6x6.
 
go for the mamiya 6. while the 6x9 fujis are very attractively priced right now and feel more solidly built than the mamiya, i don't think you'd like their size. i use the gw690iii and gsw690iii, but only on hikes, not for travel. built-in metering is another plus, and still not too expensive at $850 or so in user condition.
 
I have had a nice Mamiya 7II kit and it was fantastic -I shoukd have kept it, but I wanted something else and it sold for several grand. I now have a GSW690III it is a nice camera but yyoougge. I had a Rolleiflex that was very nice, but not nearly as usable as the Mamiya or Fuji and I never fell in love with 6x6. I still have a nice old Agfa Isolette folder that produces very nice 6x6 images and fits in a jacket pocket.

From the Agfa ( have to be careful with framing)
https://flic.kr/p/5m41Ds
 
At one time I had 3 Pentax 6x7's I used for commercial and aerial work. They are on the large and heavy side but they're very reasonably priced, built extremely well, lenses are superb and there's a full range reasonably priced from fisheye to 800mm. They have interchangable finders and a great meter prism and I have swapped screens in the ones I had. They don't just drop in but they're not difficult to swap.

I owned 2 GSW690III and found them to also be excellent. No meter was never a problem. I had one of the GS645 cameras and it was great except bellows failure. Now I have a tiny GS645S with a 60mm and love it. The lens is extremely sharp and the nets are big enough to make very large prints if you take care selecting film.
 
The OP asks a very difficult question, because we, and probably he, have no idea of the type photography to be practiced.

I started collecting entire medium format systems, but have evolved to the generally using different and specific camera/lens combinations for each particular need according to most frequent photos taken.

My favorites -

Compact Cameras - Mamaya 6 and XPan

Portrait cameras - Fujica 690//100/3.5 lens - Rittreck 66//80/2.0 lens - Pentax 67 II//105/2.8 lens - Pentacon 6//180/2.8 lens

Landscape cameras - Fujica 690//65/5.6 lens + 50/5.6 lens - Linhof 617//90/5.6 lens - Rittreck 66//40/4 lens

Telephoto cameras - Fujica 690//Zoomar 1,000/8 lens - Pentacon 6/several available teles.

It just depends on how deeply you want to get into it.

Overall, I'd suggest an XPan, for starters, for overall convenience and versatility.

Texsport
 
streetshoot said:
I hope to avoid coming off wordy with my question but my camera gear and style has undergone some drastic changes in the last year and In good ways for the most part and I'm hoping to address my questions and situation to the best of my ability!

Quick run down, I briefly dabbled with 35mm film in my early photograph years but ended up receiving a Canon t2i rebel as a gift which fueled my passion for photography for quite some time while I was still learning some of the basics of composition. I've grown fond of shooting street photography, travel photography, my friends skating, architecture, and I pretty much try to bring my camera everywhere. About a year ago after voyaging on a trip to Puerto Rico and bringing along my Canon and although I took some awesome pictures, I felt extremely disconnected with the dslr. First thing when I got back home was picked up a Canonet Glq17 and started shooting and developing my own film at home. I had a blast, and felt great to get see my images and realize how much more that goes into a photo than a quick snap and the value of each exposure. After that I picked up my current setup the Bessa r2 to get improved 35mm results and love it.

Being somewhat confused about what to do next I sold my T2i and knew i wanted to upgrade to something else film or digital. I made the mistake of getting caught up in the hype of the sony a7 and being able to integrate my bessa lenses... Purchased one and I really disliked it and sold it within a week.

So here I am now. I'm really enthralled in the idea of owning a Medium format camera and the opportunity to blow up my prints to a beautiful size. I was looking at a Mamiya 6/7 and they seem like the ideal option for me being a rangefinder and somewhat portable compared to other MF cameras, but somewhat expensive. Being the same price as a used Canon 5dMii I've thought about looking into one of those, but haven't that much since I'm not sure about how ill feel about owning another digital camera, but it is a great camera, I know that. I'm not trying to spend more than 1.2k really but around that is okay. Ive also considered some of the fuji MF cameras but some are pretty oversized but also more reasonably priced... So I'm really trying to find a camera ill fall in love with and be able to travel with and have it grow to be an extension of me. I'm somewhat lost as you can see and have weighed my options but I'm curious what others have to say or weigh in. Im open to any opinions and feel free to comment whatever you believe would be a good move.

I truly appreciate any replies and I'm really looking forward to hearing back from you guys !
Click to expand...

streetshoot said:
Appreciate the feedback guys I'm currently looking at the Fuji GW690III and Mamiya 6... Unfortunately price is playing a part for me
Click to expand...
Wordy. Yeah, I know wordy. I can do that.

It can be quite hard, working out the lay of the land, so to speak, in medium format, if you've not tried it before so I am not unsympathetic to your situation. Like all of us I was there once, myself. And it took a lot of reading and research to inform my preferences for equipment.

But here's the thing. There are few more knowledgeable and experienced communities on the web for MF (and none with a better signal to noise ratio if you'll forgive the digital analogy) so you are asking in the right place. But we can't inform the best candidates for your use unless you give us something to work with. And at the moment, no offence intended, you're all over the place. You've referenced the Canon 5D Mark III, a digital body in the 3:2 image ratio. Then you've mentioned both the Mamiya 6 and 7 rangefinders (1:1 and 6x7 respectively) and for good measure referred to the Fuji rangefinders (6x7 & 6x9 as I recall?) in passing. You are going to have to define your criteria more precisely, and image ratio is only one of those.

Let's look at the basic options;
SLRs
TLRs
Rangefinders
Folding cameras (rangefinder or scale focus)
Technical cameras (Eg. Baby Linhofs)
Press cameras (Eg. Linhof and Mamiya).

There are certain things any of these listed can arguably do better than any other type of camera mentioned above. But they will have different viewing systems, different aspect ratios, very different handling in use, may or may not have the ability to interchange lenses and/or film backs (that last, mainly a feature of SLRs). Then there's the matter of built in metering, which can vary from quite sophisticated to non-existent.

Are you beginning to see our problem trying to help you? You're going to have to consider the things that are most important to you in your camera and then prioritise them so you can match up a type that offers most or all the features that matter most.

Image ratio.
I cannot imagine how many different types of similar queries I have responded to over the years whether it's here at RFF or other online pages. Working the process logically, eventually I've concluded that it's possibly best to decide which image ratio or shape you like to compose in (and not to lose sight of the fact that a few SLRs, for example, may give you a choice of more than one ratio such as 645/6x6, or even 6x7/6x6). After all, despite the many virtues a quality TLR has, there is very little point recommending any of them to someone who dislikes the square, because almost without exception this is the shape of image they produce. Right?

Once you've decided that you "see" best in the classic 35mm 3:2 (Ie. 35mm or 6x9 film formats) or 645, square or 6x7 or whatever, you can narrow down the cameras that offer this.

Finders.
I love TLRs and I love shooting square. But these usually have a waist level finder with laterally reversed image view. I would never say you cannot shoot travel, street or action with a TLR, as history contains abundant examples of stellar images to prove this statement wrong. But, one might not be most people's first choice for the above genres of photography, simply because they'd probably rather have a corrected view of their subject. (And just to play devil's advocate, Rollei and Mamiya TLRs, just to name a couple, have models that can accept a pentaprism for corrected reflex viewing).

Lenses.
Are you happy with a single lens around the 50mm L/R field of view (the 35mm format equivalent) for your chosen format? If so, the choice is huge. If you really need a wide, there are not nearly as many choices of camera with a fixed wide. A part of this is whether or not you need to work with more than one focal length. This is a real deal breaker in itself because many phenomenal MF cameras have a fixed lens.

Magazines
If mid roll film changes are important (you've not mentioned this, so perhaps not, but, again, it's just another thing we don't know because you've been rather vague) then it's really a choice between several SLRs with all the benefits and baggage that comes with them.

There are many other points I haven't even touched on: flash sync and connectivity; movements; auto focus; just to name three. You'll have to get to those later, when and if they actually matter.

So:
Please, go away and work out: the shape or shapes you compose in; how you like to see the world through your camera; whether you meter in camera or separately; which focal length you prefer, (and whether or not you will need more than one); and lastly, how you need a camera to handle (because you can, after all, shoot a Baby Linhof hand held, if you so wish, though this might not be most people's first choice for action photography, despite its unsurpassed flexibility to image almost anything else). Then, when you've decided what your needs are (and desires, let's be honest here, those matter, too) come back and post again. Because we do want to help you. But you need to help us do that by reviewing your preferences, and we of course cannot inform these, for you. 😉
Cheers
Brett
 
I loved my Koni-Omega when I had it -- great quality 6x7 negatives, and as an added bonus (or drawback, depending), it sounds like you're racking a shotgun when you cycle film. People will get out of your way. Seriously, you can get one of those for under $200 if you just want to try out the format. But as the other posters have written -- there are virtually endless possibilities. Spend a lot or spend a little -- it's all out there.
 
For a carry around camera, nothing beats Bronica RF 645 in my book. It is very compact with the 65 or 45 mm lens, It behaves like a truly modern camera plus the lenses are deadly sharp and with great tonality, but the bokeh is very pleasant. I would go for one with the 65mm lens and give it a shot. Outside the rangefinders a Rolleiflex would be an obvious choice, but it is not a fast shooting camera by any means.
Bronica RF, 65mm
MF20144403 by marek fogiel, on Flickr
 
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