Medium Format

[kangarouge]

Can anyone please suggest a camera I can purchase second hand that has both 6x6 and 6x4.4 formats? Thanks.

 

[Godfrey]

Can anyone please suggest a camera I can purchase second hand that has both 6x6 and 6x4.4 formats? Thanks.

There are few cameras that have both of those formats. Essentially, however, any 6x6 camera can be used as a 6x4.5 camera easily, by composing and cropping appropriately. A few include specific tools to allow cropping on the original negative or the larger number of exposures per roll that 645 allows, like a Hasselblad 500 series camera fitted with an A16 back.

The same is true of any 6x7, 6x8, or 6x9 camera. A few have masking that allows them to shoot the smaller variants of the format (for example, my Mamiya Press 23 Super has a multi format back that allows reading the frame indicators for 645, 6x6, and 6x9 ... If you have the masks that were provided with it (I do not), you can use it as a native format camera for all three.

G

 

[jordan.dickinson]

Hasselblad has 6x6 and 6x4.5 backs (with viewfinder mask) and can be had for around $1k or better.

 

[BillBingham2]

The original Mamiya Six would be my recommendation. I have not owned one, but keep lusting around a MF camera. Olympus glass is said to be better Sekor , thought no bad glass was described in any of the reading I found.

B2 (;->

 

[KoNickon]

Much less expensive, but perhaps harder to find -- later versions of the Mamiya Six (the folding camera from the 40s-50s, not the modular SLR) have 6x6 and 6x4.5 capability by means of built-in masks. There may be other folders out there with dual format capability.

 

[rhl-oregon]

Solutions also depend on one’s budget.

There’s a Fuji GF670 (which shifts between 6x6 and 6x7, has a big beautiful rangefinder, and a very good meter) in the classifieds for $2300. I loved mine, but it is a battery dependent camera that now commands a premium.

Also in the classifieds are a scale focus Horseman with a couple of 6x9 backs for $650; I don’t know if there are film-backs in 6x6 or 6x4.5 to fit it, but presumably yes, since part of the logic and appeal of modular MF is being able to attach backs with different-ratio masks for 120 film. There’s also a mighty Technika IV with a Super Rollex 6x7 back, an optical rangefinder, and a Zeiss 100/2.8 lens for 700£. A Technika is built to outlive you, and has its own world of lenses, lens boards, film backs, etc.

If I were just starting out—without the budgets to acquire any of those, or the multiple Fuji GA/GS cameras as available alternatives—I’d consider getting Zeiss folding cameras. The 520 and 521 series are essentially the same camera with 6x4.5 or 6x6 chambers. They’re light, elegant, generally inexpensive even in fine shape. I think my total investment in my nearly pristine 520 (6x6) and 521 (6x4.5 portrait orientation) was $130.

Having said all that, Godfrey’s reminder about cropping 6x4.5 (or other ratios) from 6x6 means you could get the best 6x6 for your budget, and then all you need to know is when you’re shooting to crop.

 

[KoNickon]

"If I were just starting out—without the budgets to acquire any of those, or the multiple Fuji GA/GS cameras as available alternatives—I’d consider getting Zeiss folding cameras. The 520 and 521 series are essentially the same camera with 6x4.5 or 6x6 chambers. They’re light, elegant, generally inexpensive even in fine shape. I think my total investment in my nearly pristine 520 (6x6) and 521 (6x4.5 portrait orientation) was $130."

That's a good suggestion, Robert. I've found even the ones with the Novar lenses (3 elements) make excellent pictures, even if a tad slow (f4.5).

 

[jim_jm]

There's also the 6x6 Bronica SQ series, with available 645 backs. Similar to Hasselblad, but easier on the wallet. These used to be much cheaper on the used market, but seem to be going up in price the past few years. The advantage over just cropping from the 6x6 negative are that you have 15 or 16 shots per roll, versus 12 shots for 6x6.

 

[narsuitus]

A new Holga 120N medium format camera costs $40 and comes with a 6x6 cm mask and a 6x4.5cm mask.

A used one should cost less.

 

[oftheherd]

As some here have mentioned, the Mamiya Super Press has backs for 6x7 and 6x9. There is also a back that has 6x9, 6x7, and 6x6, but I don't know that is anything you would wish to consider given you asked for a 645 capability.

However, many camera makers made folding 6x6 cameras that had an insert so 645 could be used instead. They also had an additional red window and the 120 film used (still does?) to have numbers for those formats. Those inserts are most often missing the 645 insert these days, but I expect a machine shop would easily make one.

Now if you are asking about a camera that could switch between 645 and 6x6, I do seem to remember someone mentioning one he at RFF. I have no idea how is was done without having to wind forward to when changing formats, therefore losing some film space. I have only heard of that once, and never again.

 

[someonenameddavid]

The cheaper chinese Seagull TLR has an insert that converts it down to 645, but Seagulls are a bit Marmite. Most of them dont hold the film flat and spontaneously break.

 

[Kai-san]

As some here have mentioned, the Mamiya Super Press has backs for 6x7 and 6x9. There is also a back that has 6x9, 6x7, and 6x6, but I don't know that is anything you would wish to consider given you asked for a 645 capability.

However, many camera makers made folding 6x6 cameras that had an insert so 645 could be used instead. They also had an additional red window and the 120 film used (still does?) to have numbers for those formats. Those inserts are most often missing the 645 insert these days, but I expect a machine shop would easily make one.

Now if you are asking about a camera that could switch between 645 and 6x6, I do seem to remember someone mentioning one he at RFF. I have no idea how is was done without having to wind forward to when changing formats, therefore losing some film space. I have only heard of that once, and never again.

You can get 6x4.5 backs for Mamiya Press and Universal Press, I've got one myself. You can also get a motorized 6x8 back for these cameras using a G adapter.

 

[jawarden]

Hasselblad has 6x6 and 6x4.5 backs (with viewfinder mask) and can be had for around $1k or better.

I had no idea. If I had one of these backs would the image be vertical or horizontal in the viewfinder?

 

[markjwyatt]

There are few cameras that have both of those formats. Essentially, however, any 6x6 camera can be used as a 6x4.5 camera easily, by composing and cropping appropriately...

I have always thought about my Mamiya Cnnn TLRs as a flexible 6x4.5 with square format as an option. Generally, I cropped rectangular (6x4.5ish).

 

[KoNickon]

I had no idea. If I had one of these backs would the image be vertical or horizontal in the viewfinder?

Horizontal.

 

[wpb]

The A16 back is for horizontal images; 16 images per 120 roll of film. A32 back was for 32 images on a 220 roll.

The mask is transparent with lines for the format.

 

[jawarden]

Horizontal.

Cool, thanks.

 

[aizan]

I’ve been setting up my 500cm for 6x4.5, and it’s less than ideal with portrait lenses. There’s no right hand grip! I should have gotten a Bronica.

Here’s a list of what you’ll need:

A16 back
42146 mask
90-degree finder: HC-1, HC-4 (often confused with HC-3), PM90, or PME90
Pistol grip
Focusing lever

 

[oftheherd]

You can get 6x4.5 backs for Mamiya Press and Universal Press, I've got one myself. You can also get a motorized 6x8 back for these cameras using a G adapter.

Yes, I had forgotten about the G adapter for the Universal. And I never heard of a 645 back for the Press cameras. Do you know who made them?

 

[kangarouge]

Hi - thanks to everyone for all the helpful information. There's a lot to have a look at. Indeed, there seems to be quite a few options, including just cropping to 6x4.5 in the printing stage.

Not sure which way I'll go at the moment but I will certainly research all the suggestions mentioned above.

Cheers