"Modern" rangefinder advice

[jpa66]

I've finally decided to get a modern rangefinder. I've been using a Canonet ql17 recently, which I like, but I'd like to have one with:

- interchangeable lenses
- a meter ( preferably TTL )
- a variety of glass available ( old and/or new )
- of fairly recent vintage ( so I don't have to readjust/replace too many things, like on my other older cameras )
- wide angle framelines ( at least have a 28, but 24 would be preferable )
- can be new or used
- not terribly expensive ( this means Leica is most likely out ); anywhere from 400 - 800 USD on the body, with less being better

I've been thinking about a Bessa ( 2, 3 or 4 ), but am not too familiar with the newer rangefinders, which is why I'm seeking some advice.

If anyone wants to give their two-cents' worth, I'd appreciate it.

JP

 

[dmr]

If I were to get a new rangefinder, I would most likely go with the Bessa R series.

Why? Feedback here! 🙂

 

[kshapero]

I started with a Bessa R3A and it give me back my photographic life. Mate it with the CV 40mm/f1.4 and you won't go wrong.

 

[Spleenrippa]

My modern RFs started with the Bessa R, which has been a lovely camera. But, I wanted the ability to use M-mount lenses as well as LTM, so I picked up a R3A.
I would go with an M-mount Bessa for sure. That way you can use a new lens, or an older one with adapter.

 

[ferider]

The only camera that fits your specs is the Bessa R4*.

That being said, new Bessas are not necessarily cheaper than well-kept, un-metered Leicas, you might want to consider the M4P as well. Certainly fits in your budget, and one of the best.

Good luck !

Roland.

 

[mfunnell]

Well, I guess the Hexar RF fits your criteria - but the uncertain repair situation for them might be something you'd prefer to avoid.

I solved that problem by getting two of them. I like them too much to be without one.

...Mike

 

[Matus]

There are many variable, one on the technical side is your budged. I am personally tempted by the Zeiss Ikon (at least in the 35mm RF world), but actually would hardly find an excuse not to get R3A instead (OK, one is there - it does not come in silver 😉 ) and invest the rest in 2 - 3 nice lenses.

If you want wide angle framelines than the R4A is your only (I guess) choice, but on the other hand if you also want to use lenses 50mm and longer you may want to prefer R3A/R2A and using external viewfinders for the wides.

 

[sojournerphoto]

R4a/m is fabulous for wide angles, but I would prefer not to try and focus a fast 50 with it.

R2a/m is a 'normal rf' with 0.72 vf. Not really suitable for anyting wider than 35 in my case (glasses - can't remember if it even has 28mm framelines)

R3a/m big 1-1 vf and great for 50s - 40mm may be marginal if you wear glasses

Zeiss Ikon - my favourite and feels a whole lot different to the Bessa's in use - not saying their bad cameras, my R4m is as new (bought secondhand but only a few months old) and beautifully smooth and nice to use.

RFs have certainly helped reinvigorate my photography and give me much satisfaction. I routinely leave a 5D or 1Ds3 on the bench and head out with 35mm film these days. Try admitting that over on Luminous Landscape...

Mike

 

[Sam N]

R4a / R4m are the only cameras that fit all of your criteria. If you feel the need to use fast 50s later on, just grab an R3a/R3m to go along with your R4. It will still be well below the price of a single M6. The R3's finder is perfect for 50mm lenses.

If you can live with 28mm as your widest framelines and a higher price (~900 used?) a Zeiss Ikon would be great too.

 

[jpa66]

Yeah - I've been thinking that the Bessa is probably the way to go.

I'm not that familiar with the Zeiss Icon ( other than it is supposed to be well built, offers great glass and is on the expensive side 🙂 )

While I don't want to always rely upon the internal meter, I still want the camera to have one.

Also, since I don't wear glasses, and my 43 year old eyes are still in pretty good shape, those issues are moot. With that said, however, I still enjoy a larger viewing area.

JP

 

[thomasw_]

The only camera that fits your specs is the Bessa R4*.

That being said, new Bessas are not necessarily cheaper than well-kept, un-metered Leicas, you might want to consider the M4P as well. Certainly fits in your budget, and one of the best.

Good luck !

Roland.

In the long run I think it will be much cheaper to buy a M4-P than a Bessa R4*. There is one critical aspect to consider: build quality. Even if you decide the M4-P is not for you, it will hold its value way, way better than a R4*. Realistically you could buy a M4-P and give it roll for a couple of months, and suddenly decide that the M system sucks the proverbial bone; you'd have little trouble selling the M4-P for what you paid --- trust me, you'd have trouble getting your money back trying to unload a Bessa.


If I had your criteria, I'd go with a M4-P and a hand held meter.

 

[jpa66]

In the long run I think it will be much cheaper to buy a M4-P than a Bessa R4*. There is one critical aspect to consider: build quality. Even if you decide the M4-P is not for you, it will hold its value way, way better than a R4*. Realistically you could buy a M4-P and give it roll for a couple of months, and suddenly decide that the M system sucks the proverbial bone; you'd have little trouble selling the M4-P for what you paid --- trust me, you'd have trouble getting your money back trying to unload a Bessa.


If I had your criteria, I'd go with a M4-P and a hand held meter.

I'm Leica-ignorant, so some of the following questions may seem basic, but:

- what are the framelines of the M4-P?
- what kind of lens mount does it have?
- I assume it's fully mechanical - is it?
- how does the film load?

 

[ferider]

Think about it like an M6 without meter.

- what are the framelines of the M4-P?
28, 35, 50, 75, 90, 135
EBL is long enough to focus a 90/2, for instance.

- what kind of lens mount does it have?
Leica M, LTM lenses usable with adapter

- I assume it's fully mechanical - is it?
Yes.

- how does the film load?
Like an M4 or M6. You have to remove the bottom and can open
a back door and introduce the film into the loading "tulip". Very easy
for most.

Roland.

 

[Mcary]

A bargain M4P runs about $715 at Keh, get a Gossen Digisix (Incident and Reflected) meter $125 and you'll very a nice light weight outfit 🙂

To learn how to load my M4-2 I simple watched a video on Utube 🙂

 

[peter_n]

I think the CV R4 A or M is your best bet. I'm still missing mine, they are the only solution for really wide lenses. It was perfect for my 24/2.8. The other thing is that you use a 28, and the R4 has a solitary frameline for that focal length. Very sweet! 🙂

 

[kshapero]

After owning 2 Bessa's R3a and R3M, I must say that an older leica would be mighty nice.

 

[AgentX]

While a used Leica might cost the same as a new Bessa, a used Bessa will cost even less.

And the back actually opens up to load film! I have and love a Leica M3, but there's nothing it really does better than a Bessa if the same glass is up front. Especially if cost and metering are your priorities. And wider-angle framelines. And the electronically-timed shutter of an "A" model might fit your desire for less maintenance...

 

[uhligfd]

When you require frame lines you automatically reject the Contax G models. Good for lowering the price of these "most modern" of all rangefinder cameras and their "best of all" lenses.

So why not buy a Leica then?

 

[imajypsee]

Bessa R...

Bessa R...

... because it's a great value, can use MANY older lenses as well as the new ones from CV, and the meter is very good. I have two of them and often load color film in one and BW in the other. Frame lines for 35, 50, and 75, which is more than adequate.

35mm

 

[Sam N]

Just to clarify, all of the cameras being discussed here share the same lens mount (Leica M mount) and all can use the same M bayonet or LTM screwmount (with adapter) lenses.

The Zeiss Ikon can use the same lenses as an M4-P or an R4A.
For Leica-branded M-mount camera info, look here:
http://www.cameraquest.com/mguide.htm
For R4M/R4A info:
http://www.cameraquest.com/voigt4m4aintro.htm
and here's a review of the zeiss ikon:
http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.com/the_online_photographer/zeiss-.html

Again, the only camera that fits your needs as stated in the first post is the R4A / R4M.
Everything else is either unmetered (M4-P), hard to find parts for (Hexar RF), or too expensive (Zeiss Ikon (but only by a bit), M6, M7).