Argenticien
Dave
I got my Vitessa with Ultron because I was intrigued with the extreme compactness of it (folded) and the thumb-wheel focus. When the lens is extended, it is surrounded on two sides by doors, since it's the barn door format rather than a single door; and the lens is small. Therefore, the aperture and shutter settings border on fiddly. If the focus ring were at the lens too, it would be too many small controls in a small space, so it's great that the focus is a wheel on the back. I say the aperture/shutter controls border on fiddly; I have average hands. If you have big ham hands, they probably are beyond fiddly. Overall, I dig this camera, and you can't (except Oly XA 
) beat its size and armored state when folded, as a camera to chuck somewhere other than a camera bag as an incidental (computer bag for work, etc.). Mind you this is an older Vitessa, without LV interlock, dead sexagenarian selenium meter, or fixed flash shoe. Everything you need, nothing you don't! Well, it does have a PC connector that you don't need. It and its M/X switch are rim-mounted amongst the shutter speed detents, so I suspect the ergonomics of working with a flash wired up to there would be dodgy. I've never tried.
You'd want to get a Vitessa you can test in person to ensure the film advance doesn't need repair. I had mine fixed by Essex and they did it well, but they are now gone and I have no idea who else might be able to handle such a job.
Last point: It's a conversation starter since beautiful and very idiosyncratic. That's either a feature (if you're out as a vintage camera evangelist) or a bug (if you want to shoot in peace).
--Dave
) beat its size and armored state when folded, as a camera to chuck somewhere other than a camera bag as an incidental (computer bag for work, etc.). Mind you this is an older Vitessa, without LV interlock, dead sexagenarian selenium meter, or fixed flash shoe. Everything you need, nothing you don't! Well, it does have a PC connector that you don't need. It and its M/X switch are rim-mounted amongst the shutter speed detents, so I suspect the ergonomics of working with a flash wired up to there would be dodgy. I've never tried.You'd want to get a Vitessa you can test in person to ensure the film advance doesn't need repair. I had mine fixed by Essex and they did it well, but they are now gone
and I have no idea who else might be able to handle such a job.Last point: It's a conversation starter since beautiful and very idiosyncratic. That's either a feature (if you're out as a vintage camera evangelist) or a bug (if you want to shoot in peace).
--Dave
archeophoto
I love 1950's quality
I was not a big fan of the folding Vitessa. Although the Ultron lens was nice, I found the camera big, the viewfinder was small and the plunger attracted a lot of unwanted attention.
The Zeiss Contessa would be a good choice. Another tip is the Zeiss Contina I with Tessar lens. It has "only" an uncoupled rangefinder, but it is one of the smallest 35mm cameras when folded. They are quite uncommon with the Tessar lens, though.
The Zeiss Contessa would be a good choice. Another tip is the Zeiss Contina I with Tessar lens. It has "only" an uncoupled rangefinder, but it is one of the smallest 35mm cameras when folded. They are quite uncommon with the Tessar lens, though.
Brian Legge
Veteran
Out of curiosity, has anyone done a side by side Ultra vs Retina Ektar comparison? I'm curious how the Vito III optically compares with the later Retina folders.
Dez
Bodger Extraordinaire
I will put in a vote for the beautiful little Retina IIa.
- The wind lever is where it's supposed to be
- It is not cursed with the EVS linkage of shutter speed and aperture
- It has clickstops in the aperture
- It is easy to load, and does not have a fall-out-and-lose takeup spool
- It has a good, bright, combined VF/RF
- It has automatic shutter cocking with the film wind, blank- and double-exposure prevention.
Unfortunately, unlike older models, it does not include a little folding prop to level the camera for vertical exposures, but that is definitely picking nits.
Cheers,
Dez
- The wind lever is where it's supposed to be
- It is not cursed with the EVS linkage of shutter speed and aperture
- It has clickstops in the aperture
- It is easy to load, and does not have a fall-out-and-lose takeup spool
- It has a good, bright, combined VF/RF
- It has automatic shutter cocking with the film wind, blank- and double-exposure prevention.
Unfortunately, unlike older models, it does not include a little folding prop to level the camera for vertical exposures, but that is definitely picking nits.
Cheers,
Dez
Robert Lai
Well-known
Tiny folding 35
Tiny folding 35
I have the Certo Dollina II, ca. 1938 with uncoated Tessar 50mm f/2.8, and a post-war Zeiss Contessa also with 50mm f/2.8 Tessar. They are both rangefinder coupled 35mm film cameras. Both fold up into tiny packages. The Contessa even comes with a nice selenium meter. Henry Scherer put a new selenium cell into mine, so the meter works perfectly.
Both the cameras have been overhauled. The Zeiss' Synchro Compur shutter doesn't have the dreaded EV system, but the dials are all concentrated behind the lens, on the shutter body. They are small dials too.
The Dollina II is quirky, also tiny. The little box rangefinder on top of the camera with the focusing dial looks very Rube Goldberg, but it works very well. Alas, the prewar shutter (Compur Rapid) doesn't offer flash synch, though it does go up to 1/500.
Tiny folding 35
I have the Certo Dollina II, ca. 1938 with uncoated Tessar 50mm f/2.8, and a post-war Zeiss Contessa also with 50mm f/2.8 Tessar. They are both rangefinder coupled 35mm film cameras. Both fold up into tiny packages. The Contessa even comes with a nice selenium meter. Henry Scherer put a new selenium cell into mine, so the meter works perfectly.
Both the cameras have been overhauled. The Zeiss' Synchro Compur shutter doesn't have the dreaded EV system, but the dials are all concentrated behind the lens, on the shutter body. They are small dials too.
The Dollina II is quirky, also tiny. The little box rangefinder on top of the camera with the focusing dial looks very Rube Goldberg, but it works very well. Alas, the prewar shutter (Compur Rapid) doesn't offer flash synch, though it does go up to 1/500.
Bar8barian
Established
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L David Tomei
Well-known
Other than my two earlier suggestions, there is always the Agfa Karat 36. Not a folder, but a collapsible. It takes the same size filters as the Retina, and if you really want a lens cap for it, you can use the lid off an Ilford film canister.
PF
P1070555_2 by br1078phot, on Flickr
Me too... Just finished doing the helicals on my Karat 36 Heligon and bought a couple rolls of Kodak Colorplus 200. Renewed my respect for this little camera though the film advance on the right moves backwards which takes a bit getting used to. David
bosjohn
Member
So doesn't anyone like the Zeus contessa or the Kodak bantam special which uses sprocket less paper backed 35mm film?
ZeissFan
Veteran
The Zeiss Ikon Contessa is an awesome camera with one minor drawback -- the front-mounted shutter release.
It otherwise is an outstanding camera with a coupled rangefinder, selenium meter, sharp Tessar lens and a sturdy body. I've taken many photos with this camera.
The front-mounted shutter release requires a bit of care. You also have to tension the shutter as a separate action.
The folding Zeiss Ikon Contina II with the same Tessar also is a fine camera, although lacking a meter. It has an uncoupled rangefinder and is the smaller sibling to the also excellent Mess Ikonta 524/16 (120 film).
The Vito III is an excellent camera, sharing the same basic platform as the Prominent. As opposed to the heavy and somewhat ungainly Prominent, I found the Vito III to be a better user, despite its focus-by-dial mechanism. And the Ultron is a wonderful lens.
It otherwise is an outstanding camera with a coupled rangefinder, selenium meter, sharp Tessar lens and a sturdy body. I've taken many photos with this camera.
The front-mounted shutter release requires a bit of care. You also have to tension the shutter as a separate action.
The folding Zeiss Ikon Contina II with the same Tessar also is a fine camera, although lacking a meter. It has an uncoupled rangefinder and is the smaller sibling to the also excellent Mess Ikonta 524/16 (120 film).
The Vito III is an excellent camera, sharing the same basic platform as the Prominent. As opposed to the heavy and somewhat ungainly Prominent, I found the Vito III to be a better user, despite its focus-by-dial mechanism. And the Ultron is a wonderful lens.
ZeissFan
Veteran
A different kind of folding camera
A different kind of folding camera
One camera that is a folding camera but having a focal-plane shutter instead of a leaf shutter is the Zeiss Ikon Super Nettel. It came with either a Triotar or Tessar (both uncoated), and has a full range of speeds running from 1 second to 1/1000, plus B and T (if you press and lock the shutter release).
The Super Nettel uses the Zeiss Ikon rotating wedge prism rangefinder system. It is nearly impossible to knock it out of alignment without physically damaging the camera.
The focusing dial is on the corner of the lens housing and is very easy to turn with a middle finger while the index finger is poised on the shutter release.
What's to like: A complete range of shutter speeds. Excellent build quality, as long. Ergonomics are excellent. It uses the Zeiss Ikon film cassettes and many of its other accessories.
What's not to like: Because it uses the pre-1945 Contax shutter, the shutter straps probably will need to be replaced. Also, there are two Contax I-style viewfinders for focusing and composing. Finally, the rewind knob is much too close to the viewfinder housing, making rewinding film a tedious chore.
A different kind of folding camera
One camera that is a folding camera but having a focal-plane shutter instead of a leaf shutter is the Zeiss Ikon Super Nettel. It came with either a Triotar or Tessar (both uncoated), and has a full range of speeds running from 1 second to 1/1000, plus B and T (if you press and lock the shutter release).
The Super Nettel uses the Zeiss Ikon rotating wedge prism rangefinder system. It is nearly impossible to knock it out of alignment without physically damaging the camera.
The focusing dial is on the corner of the lens housing and is very easy to turn with a middle finger while the index finger is poised on the shutter release.
What's to like: A complete range of shutter speeds. Excellent build quality, as long. Ergonomics are excellent. It uses the Zeiss Ikon film cassettes and many of its other accessories.
What's not to like: Because it uses the pre-1945 Contax shutter, the shutter straps probably will need to be replaced. Also, there are two Contax I-style viewfinders for focusing and composing. Finally, the rewind knob is much too close to the viewfinder housing, making rewinding film a tedious chore.
mdarnton
Well-known
In the Leica vein, for a while I had an early Fed with the collapsible "Elmar". Great pocketable combination, and I never worried about it getting taken from me. On one trip I took only that and a Voigtlander 15mm, in a hip pouch with a couple of rolls of film. In the other direction, the greatest pocket camera of all time is certainly the Oly XA.
Rodchenko
Olympian
I'd have recommended the Minox, too, but I was inhibited by the rangefinder stipulation. But it holds its own well. As regards ergonomics, I can't say that the aperture ring is the easiest feature to use, but otherwise, everything falls easily to the touch. And it has a lovely fold.
oftheherd
Veteran
Granted an old thread, but for anyone who reads it now or in the future, a good small folder is the Welta Weltini. Getting harder to find in good working order, but the are good. A little heave for their size, but that simply speaks to their build quality. Just like their little brother, the Welti, a non-RF version.
Below are two Weltinis I have.
The below photo is three folders. The Zeiss Ikon on the right is a 6x9, but is pretty thin and very light. The middle is I believe a Weltax, but I am not sure. It is a Welta 6x6 folder anyway. On the left is a Welti.
Even the Weltax is light, and iirc is one of my 6x6 645 combos with 645 insert.
All fun cameras to use and good photo takers.
farleymac noted above that the Weltini's viewfinder/RF patch is a little squinty, but so am I, so it's OK for me. The RF cam takes a little getting used to, but at least you can't forget to leave the lens at a close focus when you try to close the door; there is a mechanism that automatically moves the lens back recessed from the door.
Below are two Weltinis I have.
The below photo is three folders. The Zeiss Ikon on the right is a 6x9, but is pretty thin and very light. The middle is I believe a Weltax, but I am not sure. It is a Welta 6x6 folder anyway. On the left is a Welti.
Even the Weltax is light, and iirc is one of my 6x6 645 combos with 645 insert.
All fun cameras to use and good photo takers.
farleymac noted above that the Weltini's viewfinder/RF patch is a little squinty, but so am I, so it's OK for me.
The RF cam takes a little getting used to, but at least you can't forget to leave the lens at a close focus when you try to close the door; there is a mechanism that automatically moves the lens back recessed from the door.Brian Legge
Veteran
Ergonomically, I really am liking the Vito III. I love the retina line but haven't figured out a great way to hold them. Great for travel and occasional shooting but not my top choice for walking around for half a day with the camera unfolded and ready to shoot. The Vito III seems a lot more natural to leave open and then hold for me.
That would be more about the direction the door folds open (horizontal or vertical) than anything. After using a Barnack I realized how much I like a good amount of camera to grip.
That would be more about the direction the door folds open (horizontal or vertical) than anything. After using a Barnack I realized how much I like a good amount of camera to grip.
ZeissFan
Veteran
I think that cameras with downward folding lens beds offer the photographer a better grip. For me, that is the Retina's primary weakness.
I also like the Agfa Super Solinette / Ansco Super Regent. A friendly, easy-to-use rangefinder. The LV system isn't the worst thing, and it's easy enough for me to simply ignore.
I also like the Agfa Super Solinette / Ansco Super Regent. A friendly, easy-to-use rangefinder. The LV system isn't the worst thing, and it's easy enough for me to simply ignore.
farlymac
PF McFarland
Granted an old thread, but for anyone who reads it now or in the future, a good small folder is the Welta Weltini. Getting harder to find in good working order, but the are good. A little heave for their size, but that simply speaks to their build quality. Just like their little brother, the Welti, a non-RF version.
Below are two Weltinis I have.
The below photo is three folders. The Zeiss Ikon on the right is a 6x9, but is pretty thin and very light. The middle is I believe a Weltax, but I am not sure. It is a Welta 6x6 folder anyway. On the left is a Welti.
Even the Weltax is light, and iirc is one of my 6x6 645 combos with 645 insert.
All fun cameras to use and good photo takers.
farleymac noted above that the Weltini's viewfinder/RF patch is a little squinty, but so am I, so it's OK for me.
I probably would have kept my Weltini because of the Zeiss Tessar, but it was missing some parts, so I took one off I needed for another camera, and sent the remains to Mr. Flibble.
PF
bosjohn
Member
while it uses thirty five mm film it uses sprocketless paper backed film and my vote goes to the Kodak bantam special