Moving to Bessa from older rangefinders

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thereabouts

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I got into rangefinders slowly. Went through a couple of old LTM copies and have a wonderful Canon P, which works really well.

Initially I was just experimenting and never thought that I'd take to film again on a regular basis. Now that I've been hooked (and bought more film than I know what to do with), I want to actually make it as convenient as possible to actually drop the camera in my bag and take some photos.

The Canon P is great, but heavy. So, if I'm not going out exclusively to shoot, I tend to throw a small digital in the bag. Also, it would be great to have a modern metering system and a warranty.

So a Bessa seems like an ideal choice. I have limited scope to go and test the camera out. So I have a few questions which I would be very greateful to hear some comments on.

1. The lenses I have are all LTM. I know there is a Voigtlander LTM to M adapter, but does this have any effect on image sharpness (which is one of the points of using a rangefinder), or any other negative effects? Also, does it make the camera much more bulky?

2. I have read online about cases (and had a chance to see) an original Bessa R, where the rubber covering had become very sticky and was even starting to fall off. Does this issue affect the current crop of Bessas?

3. I shoot almost exclusively 35mm (70%) and 50mm (30%) lenses. I'm unlikely to shoot much wider than 28mm, but I can't remember when I last shot over 50mm. So I was thinking about the Bessa R4. Does this model really hold a big advantage for these ranges, or is it overblown? And is the 50mm frameline still good, or is the emphasis on the much wider angles?

4. I like the idea of fully manual, so the R4M (or R2M, if I go for that model) really appeals. Does anyone, who has opted for either of the manual models, regret not having aperture priority in hindsight? Also, are there any reliability issues with either model - electronic versus mechanical?

Thanks.
 
I suspect you are a kindred spirit. I also have a Canon P (among altogether too many RF cameras) and love it dearly. It works splendidly, feels like a piece of precision machinery, and produces excellent results. But it is a bit on the biggish side.

If you have a bunch of LTM lenses, the adapter could allow you to use them on an M-mount camera for sure, and there would be no quality impairment. Basically, all it is is a piece of metal 1mm thick. They were made by many different vendors, and are easy to find. Note that they are focal length specific, and different ones are required for 35mm and 50mm lenses. But unless you want the exposure automation found in the rather expensive 4-series of Bessas, you are probably better off getting a Bessa R. Not only will it add a superior VF, switchable framelines and a modern behind the lens meter, but it is very light, and easily findable at a decent price.

I have had one of these for about five years now, and have never experienced any problem with the rubberized covering. I suspect there are some solvents that would turn it to goo, but I have not encountered the problem. If ever the covering on my camera were to come off or disintegrate, I would take the opportunity to go to a leather hobby store, and buy some exotic stuff to make new coverings for my Bessa.

The downside? There always is one, and that is that the modern Bessas are mostly made of modern materials, i.e. plastic, and if you are a borderline Luddite like me, you will miss the tanklike construction and precision feel of the high quality RF cameras of the 50's.

Cheers,
Dez
 
Based on your lens preference, might I suggest the R3M and 40mm lens? Yep, that's what I'm going to do! I find the 40mm focal length very nice and the R3M (i have the A) has a really nice 1:1 viewfinder. Shooting with both eyes open is great!

I had an sold an R4A, the framelines for 21, 25 and 28 mm are great. The downside is the 35mm is small and the 50mm, I never really bothered - picture the 90mm on a Leica .58 and that's about it. Tiny frameline. I also didn't find the baselength to allow for consistent spot on focusing. Maybe it was just me, but I missed focus on that R4A more than I should have. Especially with a 28mm lens. Maybe it was focusing and recomposing with the wide angle...

Overall, I like the size and weight a lot. And with the 40mm (find it used for between $350-400) it makes a nice light and compact setup.

Have a look at the comparisons: http://www.cameraquest.com/voigtchart2.htm
 
Thanks for the replies folks.

Hmmmmm. So it seems that for 35mm and 50mm lenses, the R2M or R2A are more approriate than the 4 series?

The thing with the original R, is that they seem to cost upwards of $300 on eBay and often closer to $500 for the R2. And, even from genuine reputable sellers, I've had mixed results buying second hand. I've probably spent about the same as the cost of a new Bessa, on various 1950s RFs. I don't regret it (for the most part) - they are great to have.

But, after messing around with CLAing a few older rangefinders, I'm about ready for somethng new out of the box.
 
thereabouts said:
1. The lenses I have are all LTM. I know there is a Voigtlander LTM to M adapter, but does this have any effect on image sharpness (which is one of the points of using a rangefinder), or any other negative effects? Also, does it make the camera much more bulky?

2. I have read online about cases (and had a chance to see) an original Bessa R, where the rubber covering had become very sticky and was even starting to fall off. Does this issue affect the current crop of Bessas?

3. I shoot almost exclusively 35mm (70%) and 50mm (30%) lenses. I'm unlikely to shoot much wider than 28mm, but I can't remember when I last shot over 50mm. So I was thinking about the Bessa R4. Does this model really hold a big advantage for these ranges, or is it overblown? And is the 50mm frameline still good, or is the emphasis on the much wider angles?

4. I like the idea of fully manual, so the R4M (or R2M, if I go for that model) really appeals. Does anyone, who has opted for either of the manual models, regret not having aperture priority in hindsight? Also, are there any reliability issues with either model - electronic versus mechanical?

Thanks.
Click to expand...

1) Makes no difference.

2) Don't know, never affected my R4A.

3) I'd say the 50mm in the R4A is not very good. The 35mm is alright (but not great), but the 50mm is like using a 90mm on anything else. I would not get the R4A if you like 50mm. If you like 35mm and wider, go for it, the 21mm and 28mm lines are superb.

4) I got the R4A, in terms of reliability, I don't know, but for me, at present I don't own any AE cameras, but for vacations etc. when you may be rushing around etc. AE can be a real time saver.

I went the other way, from new models like Zeiss Ikon and Bessa to my currently Leica IIIf. On a day to day basis, I don't miss the newer cameras, but on holiday, when I may be rushed, and have to reload in cafes etc. the new cameras with their AE, easy film loading, and metal (no pinholes) shutters really have their advantages.
 
1 - The M-mount adapter works fine on the Bessas with no loss of quality

2 - I've had my Bessa R2a for about 8 years and the covering is as good as new

3 - I wouldn't got for the R4a if you want to use 50mm - the 50mm framelines are pretty unuseable, and the 35mm are quite small. The R2a is optimised for using 35mm lenses and it does 50mm almost equally as well.

4 - I can't speak for the manual versions, but I have a R2a and R4a and have never had any reliability issues, and never regretted not getting the manual version. You can always turn off the aperture priority on the a's.

Honestly, you can't go wrong with a Bessa. For the money (and they are not exactly a 'cheap' camera), they are fantastic.
 
thereabouts said:
I'm about ready for somethng new out of the box.
Click to expand...

Well, as an owner of a Bessa R (although the Digital one, the R-D1) I can tell you this:

1) Doesn't affect;

2) My rubber covering has actually started to fall off, indeed. It seems high temperatures had affected the glue. So I guess that it is a common problem to Bessas.

4) The R-D1 has aperture priority mode and I could count with the fingers of my hands how many times I've used it. Thus, I would go for the Mechanical models. And I tell you more. I am so committed to make things even more manual and come back to the basics that I've just bought a brand new Bessa L! The rangefinder is dead; long life to scale focusing.

After hesitating whether to buy a 2nd hand or a new one, I rather prefer the excitement of opening the box and unwrap the plastic for the first time. I had a bitter experience after buying the R-D1 (shutter problems) and I don't want to repeat them again, even more when I can still find a brand new Bessa for such a low price.
 
Thanks again.

So, with the R2a, you can go fully manual? I've been reading on various sites and it does get confusing. Some seem to imply that it's prioity or nothing.

From a usability point of view, what are the main differences when using manual mode? I've been trying to work out the difference in the metering display, for example.
 
Here: http://www.cameraquest.com/voigtrwhich.htm

The R2A / R3A have electronic shutters which makes possible your choice of either metered manual metering (you adjust the f/stops or shutter speeds to match the finder readout) or Aperture Priority Automatic Exposure (you choose the f/stop, the camera automatically chooses the shutter speed) with AE exposure lock.
 
thereabouts said:
Thanks again.

So, with the R2a, you can go fully manual? I've been reading on various sites and it does get confusing. Some seem to imply that it's prioity or nothing.

From a usability point of view, what are the main differences when using manual mode? I've been trying to work out the difference in the metering display, for example.
Click to expand...

With the RxA bodies you have fully-manual shutter control (working just like the RxM), as well as aperture-priority autoexposure should you wish. What you have to be aware of, is that the shutter needs a battery in order to work.

Also you can use whatever LTM-to-M adapter you want - the framelines are selected manually by a switch on the top plate rather than being set automatically by the lens.
 
thereabouts said:
Thanks again.

So, with the R2a, you can go fully manual? I've been reading on various sites and it does get confusing. Some seem to imply that it's prioity or nothing.

From a usability point of view, what are the main differences when using manual mode? I've been trying to work out the difference in the metering display, for example.
Click to expand...

Yes, you can go manual. I haven't gone manual extensively, but the vf shows your selected shutter speed and also the metered speed, which flashes.

I have no idea how it works on the manual versions.
 
Dez said:
The downside? There always is one, and that is that the modern Bessas are mostly made of modern materials, i.e. plastic, and if you are a borderline Luddite like me, you will miss the tanklike construction and precision feel of the high quality RF cameras of the 50's.

Cheers,
Dez
Click to expand...

The new Rxa/Rxm have magnesium alloy bodies, I believe - they are not plastic. Maybe the older Bessas were.
 
First, I would not recommend the R3x model for your application, as you plan to keep your existing 35mm lenses. The R3x is very good for 50mm, but the frame lines for 40mm are already difficult to see IMO. For 35mm you would need an external finder. The 40mm frame lines had me moving around my eye in the finder looking for the lower frame line all the time. With glasses this must be even worse. One of the reasons I changed my R3A camera against a R2A.
Second, if you really prefer manual metering I would recommend the R2M over the R2A because of the meter readout/display. I find the meter display in the R2A a PITA and that is why I shoot AE mode 99% of the time. It also becomes difficult to see as soon as your eye is not 100% aligned on axis. I assume the display on the R2M is much more practical (but I must admit I never owned one).
If you can find the R2 new (I cannot find it on the site that expatinprogress has linked) it is of course another option, only remember that its rangefinder's close focus limit is 0.9m. the later models focus all the way down to 0.7m.
 
I love my bessa-r. Would I like something like an R3A? Sure, but this was relatively inexpensive and fun to shott with.
 
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