My M9 died today.....

Keith said:
I'd love an M9 and may actually be in a position to consider one in a few months or so ... but this sort of thing worries me and I couldn't see myself going for a backup body option to ensure I didn't make a goose of myself with paid work in the event of a failure.
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Okay, everybody, mmm, let's hold our breath and count to ten...:D

...M10, that is.

Sympathies to the OP Keith. Just wanted you to know that I finally got a ZM 18, coded and all!, to replace the one I foolishly sold several years ago. After the disappointment of the CV 15, I can't wait to use the ZM 18 on the M8.

Like Raid, I, too, would be interested in hearing about which lenses are unsatisfactory (for whatever reason) on the M9.

Good luck!
 
kbg32 said:
I carry mine everywhere I go. I use it daily. Was out shooting when I pressed the shutter, nothing. I got an "Err" in the viewfinder and "Attention, Shutter fault" on the LCD. I tried two different fresh batteries and a new card to try to "reset" it, as well as reinstalling the firmware. No success. I guess it is going off to Leitz first thing Monday morning. My M8 died the same way, but was covered by the warranty. My M9's warranty has long since passed.

Has anyone else experienced this??
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Keith, you seem to be targeted by Murphy's law !
I think these digital cameras today are nothing but consumer items not made to last and that there was never any Mean Time Between Failure (MTBF) requirement in the statement of work.
My view of all new products containing electronics is that they are just computers on which the manufacturer adds the desired function:
Wheels for cars, Lens for cameras a.s.o.
Secondly, I listened recently to a radio documentary where the invited person was a dismissed high rank engineer for a big electronics components manufacturer: his role was to "control" reliability of those components and by reliability control he was actually defining a precise end of life for them.
We did not have much problems with electronics 20 years ago, but what they create today is another kind of electronics I think, it has a real bad soul if you know what I mean.
 
I have heard enough horror stories to never buy an M9. I frequent the Nikon forums as well, and though Nikon gear outsells Leica by a fantastic amount, I rarely hear of any inherent issues or complaints.

I think Leica have been working to quickly to make/keep a place in the digital market, and as a result have not been putting sufficient time and effort to verify the quality of their products, which is tragic for a company whose name was built on quality.

I won't hold out for the M10, maybe the M11 will have all the bugs worked out of it.
 
goodtimes said:
I think these digital cameras today are nothing but consumer items not made to last.
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It really depends on the camera, you can't really generalize, in my opinion. Some digital cameras, like the Nikon D3/D700 or Canon 1D/1Ds series are nearly indestructible and confidence-inspiringly solid!
 
The ZM 18 is a wonderful lens on the M8. Murphy's Law??? I use my cameras....alot. I expect them to last at the prices Leica charges.
 
With the number of documented issues I don't understand why people continue to buy these. It has to be the name leica.

There are way more issues than the sensor. Kodak makes the sensor for a number of cameras including the Hasselblad backs. I've never heard of a failure of any of these high end camera sensors except Leica.

Considering the number of Nikons and Canons vs Leica I would guess the failure rate to be much lower or almost non existent compared to Leica. How many people do you know or have you read complaints about that had Nikons, Canons, Sony or other cameras fail.
 
Higher rate of problems with highly complicated cameras relative to purely mechanical cameras is probably understandable, but give the price of M9 Leica should either expand the warranty or repair these kind of failure (i.e. no fall, water or similar) free of charge.

I am wondering whether (exceptionally) some kind of insurance would make sense with a camera this expensive (in most cases to insure electronic devices is a nonsense, but given the price of M9 this could be reasonable)
 
x-ray said:
With the number of documented issues I don't understand why people continue to buy these. It has to be the name leica.
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Because I hate SLRs and I like digital.

Considering the number of Nikons and Canons vs Leica I would guess the failure rate to be much lower or almost non existent compared to Leica. How many people do you know or have you read complaints about that had Nikons, Canons, Sony or other cameras fail.
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Every camera company has issues with all of its cameras. If you look for problems via google, you will find them. Honestly, I don't see too many catastrophic M9 issues either... just a few on this forum and a couple of other forums. All of this is blown out of proportion. I bet Leica repairs this for free or at a steep discount. They repaired my M8 shutter (which was a well known issue) for 50% of shutter cost and no work fees (and it was way out of warranty). Yes, it sucks, but this is not a common issue with this camera and shutter faults happen in many cameras.
 
Every camera Leica has every produced which involved electronics has had repetitive failures at rates that are unacceptable for the price - p&s CM, M8, M9. Leica's strength is great mechanical and optical engineering, outside of that their MTBF metric are completely unacceptable today...

I have viewed a need for full frame digital in an 'M' mount as table stakes to justify making the move from film as I have a large investment in Leica, glass specifically for its FoV. However, in the absence of anything outside of an M9, the best available is a 1.5x crop and the NEX 7 is looking very interesting. At this rate Im reasonably optimistic that a full frame mirror-less camera with 'M' mount capabilities, along with great MTBF metrics and price, isn't far away. Its unfortunate that Leica can't deliver as the form factor and feel is unsurpassed.
 
Oh, didn't the OP's shutter fail, not the sensor? Who makes the shutter? Panasonic? I didn't think there were many shutter manufacturers.

Vick
 
Where I am now, there's an M9 demo at a local dealer for $6300 CDN - it looks good and I've been tempted (depending on actuations) but after reading Keith's story I get that feeling in my gut that it may not be such a "good deal" if I ever encounter his situation.

Keith, I hope that the fix is quick, covered, and will be taken care of accordingly.

Cheers,
Dave
 
Would M9 owners take their camera on a two-week trip to another continent without a second camera?

To be honest, I've used my M6 like that, as well as a D700, D2X, F6, and I'd do it with my current EOS 5DmkII. I'm not sure about my X100...it's great, but seems a bit "delicate" for real travel and conditions (humidity, high heat, bumps and bruises).

I'm not really talking about rough usage...just real-world. For example, just shooting outdoors in the summer here in Texas has overheated cameras with electronics.

I can't wrap my mind around spending 7 grand for a Sunday shooter.
 
x-ray said:
How many people do you know or have you read complaints about that had Nikons, Canons, Sony or other cameras fail.
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Well, every Canon DSLR I have ever owned, or used for an extended period, (there are several including pro and consumer models) have failed me at least once resulting in lost photos and/or opportunities. My Leica M8? Never. If I were to follow your thinking I should never touch a Canon camera ever again and stick to Leica's.
 
I always used to travel around with 2 M4s. One with a 28, and the other sported a 21. In 30 years they never failed me. When I travel with the M8 and 9, I always have a small backup just in case. Friday I didn't. I was traveling locally, in town to shoot. I never expected the M9 to fail so suddenly. It always worked flawlessly. It is a shame that a manufacturer like Leica can't produce a full frame digital rangefinder camera that is as robust as their previous mechanical brethren. I truly wish that someone else would come out with one, and you know that it would be at a price point we all could afford!

On another note, for Dave Lackey, I don't think the M9 upgrades are worth 2K. Sapphire glass LCD and a new unobtrusive top and bottom plates? They only really need to replace the top plate anyway. The base plates are the same. I think I'll save my money in this regard.
 
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its so sad that a $139 digital P&S has a longer no-fail life than a $7500 camera, which is why I still have my Canon S70 from 2005. And yes, I have a M9p as well.

Keith-B-G-32: I am optimistic about your situation. Leica, in my research, is much more lenient to original owners of their M8s/M9s than second or third owners, etc. Even though it is out of warranty, you are original owner, so I think they will cut you some slack. As long as there is no evidence on the camera of dropping it or negligent care, I think you should be OK .. Will pray to the camera Gods for you
 
David_Manning said:
Would M9 owners take their camera on a two-week trip to another continent without a second camera?
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Without a doubt. While I'm not lucky enough to have the M9, I always bring my M8 when I travel. That's more than a month on three continents so far in 2011, to answer your question. If I need to travel light, it's the only camera. If I can have more stuff, I bring at least a second camera. I like to use more than one camera body for mostly other than reliability reasons, although I tend to speak of them in terms of main camera and backup(s).
 
goodtimes said:
I think these digital cameras today are nothing but consumer items not made to last and that there was never any Mean Time Between Failure (MTBF) requirement in the statement of work.
My view of all new products containing electronics is that they are just computers on which the manufacturer adds the desired function:
Wheels for cars, Lens for cameras a.s.o.
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Just my thoughts. But I do not agree with those saying errors shouldn't happen at this price tag. I believe electronics is electronics, that's why military design electronics different way than civil engineers - it has to last no matter what while consumer grade stuff can be replaced. M9 is consumer camera stuffed with electronics thus failure is not excluded.

What I wonder is that M9 has only two years warranty, when cheap hard disk from Samsung has three years! Probably Leica have to talk to Samsung how they manage to do this.
 
If CaNikon can make reliable DSLRs for $500, why can't Leica do the same? For the price, the digital M's should be more reliable than they are or at the very least, Leica should provide a very good warranty (3-4 years).

I would like to have a digital M, but I'd never buy one that is out of warranty.
 
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