My Wife & The Night Visitors

Feeding deer like this is directly linked to Chronic Wasting Disease and is spread by them coming into far greater concentration than they ever would naturally. I would also point out that such feeding is now illegal in NY for that reason. See http://www.dec.ny.gov/animals/7197.html for more information.


Please stop feeding them this way; it does them no go at all. If you are serious about helping the long term health of the deer population, please consider buying a tag and going hunting instead.

William
 
First off let me say I love animals, all animals and think it's a sin that hunters go out and kill them for trophies. I am going to turn my land into a game preserve, if your so anxious to kill them go buy your own land. As far as the Does bringing their young to see us we were in an open field in the Spring a aDoe came out of the woods, saw us, my wife and I, went back into the woods and brought out two offspring for us to see, she stayed there about 15 minutes showing off her young and then brought them back into the woods. This event had nothing too do with food as w=this area is not where we usually feed them. These deer come to within 6 to 8 feet of us and know they are safe here. Since food is always available for them here I don't see any problem as they do not have to hunt for food anywhere else. I spend hundreds of dollars every year feeding them and will continue to do so in the hope that you hunters stop killing one of natures most beautiful creatures.
 
This sounds like some propaganda hunters would make up. I've been feeding them for 5 years and have never seen an ill one or a dead one on my land, so not to be crude, but you know what you can do with your bullets!
 
Up here Winters are very hard and I'm sure many surcome to the elements, I attempt to help them through the Winter months. If you look at my photos you will not see a skinny deer in the bunch, they are all extremely healthy and well fed.
 
Hi Pat, I believe you and think that you are right do treat the animals the way you do on your land.

I also have friends who are hunters, and they aren't all bad and crazed, but they do have some quite unbelievable stories to tell.

Just be careful getting too close to them. We have a family friend who was able to feed families from his hand for years, and then one day one got spooked and accidentally bumped him and he broke some ribs. But they are friendly. I'd much rather the kids hung out across the street with the friendly deer and their calves, which look like kittens keeping up with the parents, than with IR wielding trigger happy hunters looking for a quick thrill.
 
Nice pictures....I really cant support you feeding them just for kicks. The deer population is out of control and non-natural feeding is a giant issue.

I do not hunt but I have no issue at all with hunting or hunters. There is a reality to the animal world that 3500lbs of corn will not influence.
 
Nice pictures....I really cant support you feeding them just for kicks. The deer population is out of control and non-natural feeding is a giant issue.

I do not hunt but I have no issue at all with hunting or hunters. There is a reality to the animal world that 3500lbs of corn will not influence.

I don't do it for kicks, I do it for love! My wife and I are true animal lovers, we used to spend weekends at the ASPCA in Manhattan feeding and walking the dogs. I probably spent thousands of dollars buying them bedding, food and treats as well as caring for them and consoling the ones that were terrified being their.
 
I don't do it for kicks, I do it for love! My wife and I are true animal lovers, we used to spend weekends at the ASPCA in Manhattan feeding and walking the dogs. I probably spent thousands of dollars buying them bedding, food and treats as well as caring for them and consoling the ones that were terrified being their.

I think you have the wrong idea. I make no apologies for hunting deer, but to say I enjoy killing is ignorant. I participate in the natural cycle of life.

Deer are *very* smart. I cannot stress this enough. They know how far our guns can shoot. They know where we are. We are in their backyard. There is only a few occasions you get a deer. And it mostly depends on how you hunt. They have to make a mistake or willfully expose themselves (on the run from drivers). Or you have to use all your gifts as a human to trump all their gifts as deer (good luck with that, you'll lose every time).

Hunting from a stand elevated over a trail is your best bet in a wooded area. And it usually ends with you sitting in a stand for a half hour before sunrise to a half hour after sunset for two weeks and never seeing a deer. Nobody does that to kill something. They do it to be out there, observing nature. They have an obstensible goal, but really they just enjoy that time in the woods.

A group of four to six hunters walking though cornfields and groves of trees with shooters posted at the end corners flushes a number of does and maybe a buck or tow if they are lucky, but in a state where doe permits are lottery, odds are with the deer. If the buck lies down, you have to step on him before he will move. DEER ARE NOT DUMB.

Even if you flush a deer on a drive, you've been walking through heavy terrain with your heart pounding from effort and now have to hit a deer bounding at full speed through cover. The posters have the best chance as they have not been slogging through plowed fields or swamp, but the deer is still moving at a good clip in a bounding pace and they are cold and stiff. Shooting one in flight is an art, not a cold-blooded killing worthy of disdain. I don't know anyone who doesn't feel a sense of accomplishment for doing a job that comes naturally to the wolf. It's not about the killing, it's about being a part of nature in a way you can't in your living room.

You can't hunt deer without developing a huge respect for the animal and it's inherent beauty and strength that transcends it's appearance. For as delicate as they look, they are monsters of survival inside and shame us humans.

Stone age man hunted deer in much the same way we do in Minnesota and the way you hunt them in New York. We choose our methods depending on the environment we have to hunt them in. Some of us live or know people in farm country, some of us have or know someone who has wooded land. Same as Stone-age man. The use of modern firearms doesn't level the playing field even a bit. We still have to match our wits and physical ability against an animal that knows the territory and trumps us six ways to Sunday as far as fitness.

Any difference between us and our stone age relatives is that modern firearms can often mean a quicker, more humane death for the deer.

Have you ever seen a couple wolves take down an animal? A rifleshot to the heart or head is quick and painless. A shotgun slug to a vital organ is a mercy. I like wolves, but two or three wolves will eat a deer *alive.* They will tear out it's gut as soon as they can get a grip, even if the deer is still on it's feet. Ideally one will grab it's throat and clamp down so it can't breath, no blood gets to it's brain and it passes out so there is no struggle while feeding, but they don't particularly care about the suffering of their food.

I've never met a hunter who didn't make damn sure the deer was dead before cutting into it. Nor one who didn't think deer are one of the most beautiful animals on the planet. You don't sit on a stand all day watching the sun rise and set in the cold, day after day, just to kill something. You don't walk through a muddy ditch, or fight your way through a willow swamp, because you are trigger happy and want to see something die.

You do it because human nature put you in that spot, and it gives you the chance to see the animals and plants and birds and whatever in a state of flux in the fall, in a state where you stand a very good chance of getting skunked but you know that people just like you have done that job for as long as humans have been alive. The tools you have at your hand are no better at the ranges most deer are shot. They just have a better chance of making a cleaner end, and suffering is one thing that ruins the hunt.

Again, I understand why you feed the deer. I just wish you wouldn't. If you think most deer hunters are cretins, please join them and show them how to do it right. I think you'll find most hunters are bigger fans of living things than you appreciate. But more to the point, I think you'll find more beauty in a deer in the wild, and birds and plants and foxes, etc. than you ever could in a deer feeding in your yard out of a bin filled with corn. To me, that's ugly and unnatural, like photographing crack addicts in your yard. I'm not condemning you, I'm just saying.

You don't have to shoot them, just be out there. Most people miss or never even see one. (In fact, most people miss the first one they see no matter how much they might talk :) )

I'd take you hunting and let you shoot with your camera instead of a gun, but Minnesota is IMHO a bit far from NY state for a whim. But I bet you could easily find someone near you who would let you use a stand off-season for phenomenal pictures of a deer just going about it's business. If you like wildlife, hunters are really your best allies. Get to know them, because if you like deer and other wildlife, they are your best friends. They will always shell out of their pocket to protect wetlands and wild spaces. They do it to preserve wildlife populations because they know balance is important. Probably because they spend more time outside experiencing said balance and it's effects.

I think this is a very important issue, hence my very long post. I do not discount your feelings. But I think it is too important an issue to delegate to one man's feelings. With all respect. Just because I choose to hunt and take the life of an animal for food does not make me insensitive to the person who sees that animal as merely a pretty living object. That is the give and take that makes society work. In this case I will always lobby for the animal as an integral part of nature which deserves respect thereof, rather than being treated as merely a decoration, which I feel iis an insult to the deer. (That reads as silly to me, but I don't know how to say it in words. Suffice to say, I do indeed feel for those who can't bear to know deer are shot for food.)
 
Last edited:
deer.JPG


This one was taken in Nara, Japan with a Hexar AF. Pretty darn close, huh? This isn't a petting zoo or anything. The darn things swarm over the city. They are one of the tourist attractions and people buy cookies to feed the deer. After only a day there it was easy to see what a pain these beautiful deer are for the locals. I watched a school girl get knocked down and damn near stomped on because the deer thought she had another cookie to give. There is something to be said for stewardship. We, humans, can put things out of whack pretty good just because, well we can. To be somewhat glib, feeding a wild animal isn't always helping it and eating it isn't always detrimental to the species.

db
 
We get up to a dozen deer in the backyard at one time. There seems to be enough for them to eat, we see the same ones year after year. A pair of fawns born in our front Yard, under the Azalia bushes. Not too tame, not too timid either. We do not leave food out for them, do not need to. If they eat the flowers and plants, fine with me. 5 acres, I let it pretty much do what it wants. I've seen a 12-point buck chasing after the Doe in the snow, a beatiful sight. We also get Owls, Hawks, and Foxes in the backyard. I have a few nice pictures of them, sometimes get enough time to grab the 300/4.5 and ready camera.

Of late, the young bucks are getting the antlers in, and stay with the Does. I suspect they will be breaking away soon.

No shots of them with my Leica, but have them with the EP2 and other SLR's.

As this is the Leica M forum, and not W/NW or the Philosophy forum- I will not post them here.
 
Last edited:
I think you have the wrong idea. I make no apologies for hunting deer, but to say I enjoy killing is ignorant. I participate in the natural cycle of life.

Deer are *very* smart. I cannot stress this enough. They know how far our guns can shoot. They know where we are. We are in their backyard. There is only a few occasions you get a deer. And it mostly depends on how you hunt. They have to make a mistake or willfully expose themselves (on the run from drivers). Or you have to use all your gifts as a human to trump all their gifts as deer (good luck with that, you'll lose every time).

Hunting from a stand elevated over a trail is your best bet in a wooded area. And it usually ends with you sitting in a stand for a half hour before sunrise to a half hour after sunset for two weeks and never seeing a deer. Nobody does that to kill something. They do it to be out there, observing nature. They have an obstensible goal, but really they just enjoy that time in the woods.

A group of four to six hunters walking though cornfields and groves of trees with shooters posted at the end corners flushes a number of does and maybe a buck or tow if they are lucky, but in a state where doe permits are lottery, odds are with the deer. If the buck lies down, you have to step on him before he will move. DEER ARE NOT DUMB.

Even if you flush a deer on a drive, you've been walking through heavy terrain with your heart pounding from effort and now have to hit a deer bounding at full speed through cover. The posters have the best chance as they have not been slogging through plowed fields or swamp, but the deer is still moving at a good clip in a bounding pace and they are cold and stiff. Shooting one in flight is an art, not a cold-blooded killing worthy of disdain. I don't know anyone who doesn't feel a sense of accomplishment for doing a job that comes naturally to the wolf. It's not about the killing, it's about being a part of nature in a way you can't in your living room.

You can't hunt deer without developing a huge respect for the animal and it's inherent beauty and strength that transcends it's appearance. For as delicate as they look, they are monsters of survival inside and shame us humans.

Stone age man hunted deer in much the same way we do in Minnesota and the way you hunt them in New York. We choose our methods depending on the environment we have to hunt them in. Some of us live or know people in farm country, some of us have or know someone who has wooded land. Same as Stone-age man. The use of modern firearms doesn't level the playing field even a bit. We still have to match our wits and physical ability against an animal that knows the territory and trumps us six ways to Sunday as far as fitness.

Any difference between us and our stone age relatives is that modern firearms can often mean a quicker, more humane death for the deer.

Have you ever seen a couple wolves take down an animal? A rifleshot to the heart or head is quick and painless. A shotgun slug to a vital organ is a mercy. I like wolves, but two or three wolves will eat a deer *alive.* They will tear out it's gut as soon as they can get a grip, even if the deer is still on it's feet. Ideally one will grab it's throat and clamp down so it can't breath, no blood gets to it's brain and it passes out so there is no struggle while feeding, but they don't particularly care about the suffering of their food.

I've never met a hunter who didn't make damn sure the deer was dead before cutting into it. Nor one who didn't think deer are one of the most beautiful animals on the planet. You don't sit on a stand all day watching the sun rise and set in the cold, day after day, just to kill something. You don't walk through a muddy ditch, or fight your way through a willow swamp, because you are trigger happy and want to see something die.

You do it because human nature put you in that spot, and it gives you the chance to see the animals and plants and birds and whatever in a state of flux in the fall, in a state where you stand a very good chance of getting skunked but you know that people just like you have done that job for as long as humans have been alive. The tools you have at your hand are no better at the ranges most deer are shot. They just have a better chance of making a cleaner end, and suffering is one thing that ruins the hunt.

Again, I understand why you feed the deer. I just wish you wouldn't. If you think most deer hunters are cretins, please join them and show them how to do it right. I think you'll find most hunters are bigger fans of living things than you appreciate. But more to the point, I think you'll find more beauty in a deer in the wild, and birds and plants and foxes, etc. than you ever could in a deer feeding in your yard out of a bin filled with corn. To me, that's ugly and unnatural, like photographing crack addicts in your yard. I'm not condemning you, I'm just saying.

You don't have to shoot them, just be out there. Most people miss or never even see one. (In fact, most people miss the first one they see no matter how much they might talk :) )

I'd take you hunting and let you shoot with your camera instead of a gun, but Minnesota is IMHO a bit far from NY state for a whim. But I bet you could easily find someone near you who would let you use a stand off-season for phenomenal pictures of a deer just going about it's business. If you like wildlife, hunters are really your best allies. Get to know them, because if you like deer and other wildlife, they are your best friends. They will always shell out of their pocket to protect wetlands and wild spaces. They do it to preserve wildlife populations because they know balance is important. Probably because they spend more time outside experiencing said balance and it's effects.

I think this is a very important issue, hence my very long post. I do not discount your feelings. But I think it is too important an issue to delegate to one man's feelings. With all respect. Just because I choose to hunt and take the life of an animal for food does not make me insensitive to the person who sees that animal as merely a pretty living object. That is the give and take that makes society work. In this case I will always lobby for the animal as an integral part of nature which deserves respect thereof, rather than being treated as merely a decoration, which I feel iis an insult to the deer. (That reads as silly to me, but I don't know how to say it in words. Suffice to say, I do indeed feel for those who can't bear to know deer are shot for food.)

I too at one time used to be a Hunter and loved being out in the snow tracking a deer. It really was like being alive being out therein the fresh air and then I started meeting a lot of morons who called themselves hunters who were lucky they made it back alive and shooting for them was just for a trophy. I accept hunting if it's to put food on your table but not for a trophy head. Did you ever wonder if that Doe or Buck you just killed had a family or young ones to take care of. I watch the babies following their mothers like little ducks, they seem to have a wonderful family closeness, it doesn't bother you that something is depending on the animal you just killed. Maybe we should teach them to shoot and have a hunting season on humans, you think your wife and children would survive or maybe enjoy seeing your head on a wall.
 
Do we eat meat? Isn't eating meat the same as partaking in this "murder" of animals?

I do not hunt, but I do eat meat. So basically that does not make me better than hunters. In fact, hunting for food is probably more humane than buying it from a store. I have a brother that used to be a supervisor at a Tsyon's Foods plant were they processed chickens. Believe me, there is nothing a hunter can do that is worse than these plants. Chickens are bred for fast weight gain. They live in cramped quarters, in there own sh**. They are scooped up by machines, shoved into crates, and then truck drives ride down the highway at 70mph while the chickens a cramped in there tiny cages, 3 to 4 chickens per cage. Some fall out and are shattered on the road. My brother once picked up a full grown chicken and nearly crushed it with his bare hands (my parents raise chickens and they are very strong). He was used to our chickens and lifting them did not damage. These chickens were so brittle that the majority had no bones. They developed so fast in size that the bones were yet not developed and only had cartalidge. Believe me, a hunter hunting dear in its natural habitant is nothing like processed/breed animal farms. Watch a documentary video by This American Life about pig farming. It is disgusting. Forced selective breeding, cramped quarters, genetically feed, etc, etc.

Yes, some hunters do kill for the pleasure and the trophy. I had a friend that did that. He would drop the dead dear at my folks place, take a small chain saw to get the antlers, and would then drive off. His killing, as I understood it, was for pleasure. However, even with that, he was providing food for our family.

Anyways. My point is that even though we may not hunt, we take part in much more gruesome acts of animal torture by eating meat, wearing leather, and etc.

And I still do eat meat. :(
 
The food we put on our tables is breed just for that, the Cows, the chickens, the pigs. It may be inhumane the way they are treated and killed and if I could do something about that I would, it's beyond my control. I can control what goes on on my land, so I do, it's Posted and God Forbid I catch anyone shooting on my land. If a family must hunt to meat I have no objection but most hunt for trophy.
 
The guy is posting photos from a beautiful animal and gave some food, there is nothing wrong with it. so why are you trying to be smart-asses, keep your comments to you and move on. It is a free country right? And this is a photography site.
 
The food we put on our tables is breed just for that, the Cows, the chickens, the pigs. It may be inhumane the way they are treated and killed and if I could do something about that I would, it's beyond my control. I can control what goes on on my land, so I do, it's Posted and God Forbid I catch anyone shooting on my land. If a family must hunt to meat I have no objection but most hunt for trophy.

But technically we CAN do something about it. We can not eat meat. I have a friend raised under the Jainism religion and he has never (knowingly) eaten meat or purposefully taken the life of a living (animal) thing. When living with him, he would not kill even a fly or spider. He'd scoop it up and put it outside if it was being bothersome. His whole family was like that. If everybody did not eat meat, then there would be no need for meat farms.

I've considered it, being a vegetarian, but being Russian (watch "Everything is Illuminated" and the scene were the Jewish boy asks for potatoes without meat) and raised on a farm were eating meat was survival, I can not seem to commit to it.
 
Unfortunately, I was raised as a meat eater and although I love my vegetables I do not believe people I can have a good healthy existance with out meat. I have known many vegetarians in my life, most not what I would call healthy specimens. My Nephew is a Hockey Player and is extremely good, his problem, he is a vegetarian and has no body weight, He's already loss out on 3 scholarships because he refuses to eat meat to gain more mass and muscle. The coachs have told his father he needs meat in his diet if he wants to compete.
 
Back
Top Bottom