New M lenses offered with the M8?

[MP/CLE]

I have heard rumors of additional wide angle lenses as well as another tri-style lens... anyone know any particular focal lengths?

 

[PeterL]

WA is to be expected, if there's a crop factor. 21mm becomes 28mm with the 1.33x, so I expect a few lenses wider than that. Leica has built up some experience with small focal length lenses in their cooperation with Panasonic, so I'm curious what they'll come up with.


Peter.

 

[Fred]

This would be very interesting news that I for one will keep looking for more information as well. I do wonder though if the new lenses will be digital sensor only or full frame. I know I'll not be able to afford the digital M for quite some time if at all but some fast wide Leica glass would be good, but can't afford that either. Funds are low at the moment so the wait for new will not be too bad for me.

A wide tri style lens full frame would be very atttactive depending on the size.

 

[kbg32]

There will be a 17mm I believe, that after crop factor will be 21mm.

 

[Ben Z]

15mm Voitlander=20mm on M8, use 21mm accessory finder. 12mm Voitlander=16mm on M8, use 15mm accessory finder. I already have both lenses and finders. If I actually manage to swing an M8 it'll be a looooooooong time before I can afford another Leica lens, let alone a brand new one.

 

[gmc]

15mm Voitlander=20mm on M8, use 21mm accessory finder. 12mm Voitlander=16mm on M8, use 15mm accessory finder. I already have both lenses and finders. If I actually manage to swing an M8 it'll be a looooooooong time before I can afford another Leica lens, let alone a brand new one.

The little 12 can make some lovely shots.
Thanks for the finder comment, I did not even think about that. I will just pop the 15 finder on the Rd1.

 

[Ben Z]

IIRC the RD1 has a 1.5x crop which would make the 12 an 18, so I'm not sure how well the 15 finder would work out. You might need to set the camera on a tripod and take some shots and compare the finder view with the review on the LCD and perhaps mask off the finder with some electrician's tape.

 

[HenningW]

Finder for 12 on RD-1

Finder for 12 on RD-1

IIRC the RD1 has a 1.5x crop which would make the 12 an 18, so I'm not sure how well the 15 finder would work out. You might need to set the camera on a tripod and take some shots and compare the finder view with the review on the LCD and perhaps mask off the finder with some electrician's tape.

Try and find a 16mm finder for the Contax Hologon. I ordered one a number of years ago to use with my 15 Leica Hologon so I wouldn't risk smashing the original finder, and after paying about $200Cdn got the '16mm' finder and found it actually showed about the equivalent of 18 or 19mm full frame, so should be just fine for the 12mm VC.

Henning

 

[Mark Norton]

I think people who are moaning about the cost of the M8 will need to be sitting down when there hear of the cost of the new wide angles. The 21mm Elmarit is beaten only by the 50mm Noctilux and the 75mm Summilux and a 17mm Elmarit is going to be more difficult and hence expensive to make than the 21mm lens, assuming it is full frame. The 21mm Elmarit is currently €3000 before the zebra price increase, so a 17mm f2.8 is going to be €3250+, and then there's the finder to buy as well.

 

[jaapv]

You might be surprised, Mark. Leica stated some time ago that these that these lenses would be priced "attractively" and would be offered as a " package with the M8" whatever that may mean. I think they will picth them at the same level, or just below Zeiss.

 

[Mark Norton]

Well, there's attractive and attractive. They might introduce a line of lenses made by whoever is making the new lens for the Panasonic L1, maybe restricted to 1.33 like the Nikon DX lenses.

They currently offer the M7 and R9 with a heavily discounted Summicron 50mm and I can see them doing an M8 package with, say, a 35mm f2 or a 28mm f2.8, but the ultra-wide lens is going to be expensive, just look at the price of the Zeiss 15mm. Plus, Leica is trying to add value uniquely to its lenses with the zebra stripes and associated processing.

 

[jaapv]

I think they will have to do a package with a not-too-expensive 21 asph 2.8 included. Designwise they can do it too. Now for the marketing department.

 

[Mark Norton]

Japp, why will they HAVE to do that? Because you want a 21mm Elmarit and don't want to pay for it? If I believe your other posts, the camera will be in short supply for months. Why would they need to offer an incentive to buy a product in short supply by under-cutting one of their most expensive lenses?

Looking at a recent price list, a 50mm Summicron is €1300 but only €500 when bought with an M7; something of a bargain. The 35mm Summicron ASPH is €1900, so they might offer it for €1000 with the M8.

Most of all I do not expect Leica to compromise the quality of their lenses by introducing a "budget" range.

 

[jaapv]

They have to do that to attract non-Leica users. Of course there will be a drooling mob of Leicaphiles outside their gates in the first half-year or so, and they will have to tool up for a quite hefty production, in fact I would be surprised if the weren't producing a stockpile right now, but after that it will be quite difficult to tool down, so they must insure a steady flow of customers. The only way to do that is to offer a financially attractive package to new users, at a total price of, say, somewhere between a Canon 5d and 1Dii plus 17-40L. That would mean about 5500 to 6000 Euro, even if the lens is sold at break-even or maybe slightly less. The body will then generate future lenssales of 35 asph lenses, Noctiluxes etc. The reason they can do that is because they have been fine-tuning their lens design and production system over the last ten years, enabling them to cut down drastically on both R&D costs and production costs whilst actually making a quantum leap in quality. For instance, the 50 Summilux asph cost actually less then its predecessor when it was introduced.

 

[Ben Z]

As long as Leica adheres to their stated pledge that all future lenses will be fully usable on film (i.e. image circle sufficient for 24x36), I can't see where a wider-than-21mm f/2.8 lens could be anything but staggeringly expensive. Unless they outsource the production to Japan as they do with some of the zooms in the R system. Frankly having handled some of those zooms I'd be perfectly ok if Leica did that with all the M lenses. As it is the prices are now really into the realm of absurdity.

 

[jaapv]

A 21/3.5 would be a quarter of the price.....or a 19/4.0.

 

[Mark Norton]

A 21/3.5 would be a quarter of the price.....or a 19/4.0.

Which would put them at less than Leica's least expensive lens, the 50mm Elmar. Seems unlikely don't you think unless they do something radical and make the lenses elsewhere and to a lower standard.

 

[Ben Z]

But Leica's first order of business has to be restoring the 21mm fov lost to the crop factor. That would mean a 15-16mm. And we don't know how the M8 will do with high-iso noise, so we can't predict whether an f/4 lens would go over well or not. Remember there's been constant moaning about the Tri-Elmar's f/4 limit since it first came out and Leica was pressed to develop a 28/2 and discontinued the 28/2.8. Somehow I don't see them developing any lens slower than it absolutely must be to not obscure the rangefinder window.

 

[Mark Norton]

I've only recently realiseed the 28mm Elmarit had gone, it was one of the last non-ASPH lenses so I expect we will see a new 28mm Elmarit ASPH. Was wondering if there might be a 28mm Summilux?

I agree that going wider than the 21mm is important but it's going to be costly. Can't see it being slower than f2.8. Personally, I think 15mm f2.8 would be good with a finder to handle 15, 18 and 21 (corrresponding to 20, 24 and 28mm), though I'm hoping the camera will handle 21mm (28mm fov) natively.

 

[J. Borger]

Look at the gallery: how many 21mm pictures are in there???
And if you find a couple try to find out how many of those really work?
So how important is restoring the 21mm really?