saxshooter
Well-known
I sold my M8 and ended up with an NEX-5. Gorgeous LCD screen and I'm very happy with the images it produces (I was never happy with color images from the M8 and had no patience for working the RAW files)
Since the NEX mount is highly adaptable, I'm also using my legacy Pen F lenses, Nikon F lenses, Canon EF lenses, m39 LTM lenses, C-mount lenses... it's a lot of fun. via $30 adapters found on ebay. I find the kit 16mm 2.8 (24mm equiv) Sony pancake lens adequate, and I'm using Leica lenses from 21mm to 135mm with no problems.
This development with Ricoh is a good thing, but we are talking Fall 2011. I hope the NEX series has an EVF by then but for now I'm good with using the LCD screen.
If Ricoh made a FF sensor module for M lenses, that would be a game changer!
I also find it interesting that B&H Photo doesn't stock this system?
Since the NEX mount is highly adaptable, I'm also using my legacy Pen F lenses, Nikon F lenses, Canon EF lenses, m39 LTM lenses, C-mount lenses... it's a lot of fun. via $30 adapters found on ebay. I find the kit 16mm 2.8 (24mm equiv) Sony pancake lens adequate, and I'm using Leica lenses from 21mm to 135mm with no problems.
This development with Ricoh is a good thing, but we are talking Fall 2011. I hope the NEX series has an EVF by then but for now I'm good with using the LCD screen.
If Ricoh made a FF sensor module for M lenses, that would be a game changer!
I also find it interesting that B&H Photo doesn't stock this system?
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hipsterdufus
Photographer?
I know it sounds terrible, but looking at the responses from most people in this thread, it looks like this product is an answer to a question that very few people are asking...
I only know of three places that do carry Ricoh in the US... popflash, adorama, and amazon. Apparently, Ricoh does very well in Japan but it is a niche within a niche in the US. It's too bad... because they are high quality cameras. I like my GXR a lot and am excited for this module. The M-mount module was most likely a labor of love, so I think that is fair to say hipsterdufus.
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DougFord
on the good foot
As others have suggested, ricoh needs a new compact grx body with an integrated high resolution evf just to keep pace with some of the other manufacturers that will be able to accommodate m-mount lenses, i.e. the nex 7 and the next generations of the 3 & 5.
I couldn't disagree with you more.
Leica M shooters are actively looking for alternatives to the ultra expensive M9 camera. the Ricoh will be one of those alternatives.
All we have at the moment is a press release of Ricoh's FIRST effort into that arena. We have no reports of working prototypes, much less the final specs or capabilities.
Only time will tell how well the Ricoh GXR Leica M (and its successors) compare to the like of the present and future M43 and NEX cameras taking Leica M lenses via adapters.
Great news indeed!
Stephen
Well, until those models come out it is pure speculation. Also, I would imagine Ricoh is not banking on selling tons of these units.
Jamie123
Veteran
I'm sorry if my comment makes no sense to you. My point is quite obvious. For most electronic products there are various similar models from different manufacturers. It's called competition. Just because one manufacturer sells a product doesn't mean others don't want a piece of the pie. Ricoh obviously thinks they can sell this product and why shouldn't they? For all of their GXR modules there is probably a camera from another manufacturer that has a similar sensor and lens but people still seem to buy them.
Why do people on RFF always have to whine when a manufacturer brings out a product they don't want to buy? No one's forcing them. Sony just released a couple of Cybershot cameras. I don't want or need them. So what.
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
It's not a good looking camara IMO ... kind of clunky!
GSNfan
Well-known
The GXR is like inkjet printers, the ink costs a lot more than the printer itself.
Do you mean the mock up? Which is not the final camera.
Nonsense. Many people confuse the GXR with a SLR system and calculate how much it would cost to own the entire line of modules. Thats not what the GXR is about. Chose the universal back, chose the modul that fits your type of application and use both as a high quality compact.
The GXR is not about carrying a bunch of modules.
No one would complain anyway if Ricoh glued back and sensor together. But make them available separately and people start to complain... ridiculous.
wgerrard
Veteran
No one, including Leica, sells "tons" of any Leica product.
wgerrard
Veteran
I'm about two whims and a passing fancy from selling a bunch of stuff and buying into the GXR. I've spent too much money buying good hardware I think I ought to use frequently and with enthusiasm, but don't. Little cameras and little lenses are more in tune with how I actually play the photography game.
shadowfox
Darkroom printing lives
Because of the APS-C sensor, this is an alternative for the M8, not M9.
Though I don't care for an M8, I'd probably go for a real Leica rangefinder rather than the Ricoh module (which, I'd still prefer than the NEX).
Though I don't care for an M8, I'd probably go for a real Leica rangefinder rather than the Ricoh module (which, I'd still prefer than the NEX).
Okay. Let's Dream Here.
The Ricoh system basically separates the sensor and lens mount into a module that fits onto the camera body, which provides display, memory storage, controls, etc.
So they have a module that includes the sensor and M-Mount. Seems to me, they could put a rangefinder into it.
The Ricoh system basically separates the sensor and lens mount into a module that fits onto the camera body, which provides display, memory storage, controls, etc.
So they have a module that includes the sensor and M-Mount. Seems to me, they could put a rangefinder into it.
A ton of these would be about what, a 1000 units in boxes with accessories?
So the M9. I think we're well into tons of sales.
So the M9. I think we're well into tons of sales.
I dont think there is any room (physically) for a mechanical rangefinder, given the way the modules slide into the LCD back. The GXR has an accessory shoe that can take external finders. Onfortunately it is not on the optical axis of the lens though.
It will be a side-mounted Kalart Rangefinder.
bensyverson
Well-known
I have great respect for Ricoh's heritage and chutzpah. And I think any new products that support the base of rangefinder users are welcome. However, Ricoh never should have let the GXR happen. It's simply a bad idea that's not getting any better with age.
The core concept is that for certain applications—such as extreme zoom in a small package—a small sensor is fine. DOF doesn't matter. For other situations, you want a big light gathering sensor. Furthermore, there are lens, sensor and software optimizations you can perform if the lens and sensor are in one monolithic unit (as in a point and shoot). So why not let the user swap out the lens and sensor unit, but keep the camera body? Sounds great.
The problem with this idea is that the camera body is cheap to make, but the sensor and and lens are not. This is clearly evidenced by the prices of the GXR modules, which are as expensive or more expensive than their closest competition. For example, the 50/2.5 APS-C module costs about as much as a brand new Canon DSLR, which actually lets you change the lens. So the only consumer advantage of the GXR system is the theoretical environmental benefit of not manufacturing a new body for each new camera.
Ricoh users who want to put an M lens up to their eye could potentially pay $350 for the body, $250 for the EVF, and lets say $600 for the M module. At $1200, you could have bought a used RD-1. But even assuming you already had the body and EVF, a NEX is still cheaper—albeit without the EVF option.
It's like a laptop that lets you swap out the motherboard depending on whether you want great battery life or high performance. It's an admirably crazy idea, but in the end, consumers (even geeks) just want to carry one thing that does most of what they need.
The core concept is that for certain applications—such as extreme zoom in a small package—a small sensor is fine. DOF doesn't matter. For other situations, you want a big light gathering sensor. Furthermore, there are lens, sensor and software optimizations you can perform if the lens and sensor are in one monolithic unit (as in a point and shoot). So why not let the user swap out the lens and sensor unit, but keep the camera body? Sounds great.
The problem with this idea is that the camera body is cheap to make, but the sensor and and lens are not. This is clearly evidenced by the prices of the GXR modules, which are as expensive or more expensive than their closest competition. For example, the 50/2.5 APS-C module costs about as much as a brand new Canon DSLR, which actually lets you change the lens. So the only consumer advantage of the GXR system is the theoretical environmental benefit of not manufacturing a new body for each new camera.
Ricoh users who want to put an M lens up to their eye could potentially pay $350 for the body, $250 for the EVF, and lets say $600 for the M module. At $1200, you could have bought a used RD-1. But even assuming you already had the body and EVF, a NEX is still cheaper—albeit without the EVF option.
It's like a laptop that lets you swap out the motherboard depending on whether you want great battery life or high performance. It's an admirably crazy idea, but in the end, consumers (even geeks) just want to carry one thing that does most of what they need.
deirdre
Well-known
And 2x crop on the micro-4/3 with M lenses.