unixrevolution
Well-known
I've been an RX100 owner since just before new year's, and I have to start off by saying that I am duly impressed with my little Sony. The images I get out of this little guy are astounding, what with background blur even on objects more than a few inches away (something my old P&S could never do), very sharp detail, good colors and spot-on exposure and focus in anything but the most challenging conditions. The RX100 also seems to shoot in the dark like no camera i've ever used. I can get images I could only dream about before with one of my digitals, unless I brought a tripod.
The RX100 also has some amazingly good and well thought out controls. Not having to menu dive for pretty much anything is nice. There are, however, some things I'd like Sony to change in the next firmware (And I don't mean the control dial lag, cause I don't notice it and it isn't a huge deal...)
1. Customizeability of the control ring. I wish Sony would implement one of the following solutions:
a. Control ring has a single function across all modes, but the rear dial can be customized. As such, the rear dial is always mode dependent.
b. Control dial is customizeable, and what it is set to control is saved per mode, not universally.
c. In the "User Memory" mode, save the control dial function as part of the memory settings.
d. In the Fn submenu, allow one of the 7 customizeable functions to be "Control Ring Function".
These 4 solutions would all do away with the single biggest niggle I have with the whole camera. In P, A, and S, I like having quick access to EV comp and the primary control (shutter, aperture, or Program shift) from a main dial. In Manual, I like having shutter on one, aperture on the other. I'd prefer if the control ring around the lens controlled the main function in P/A/S, and the rear dial did the secondary. Sadly that isn't possible. The "good enough" solution is to put the secondary function on the big control dial, and the main attribute on the rear dial.
Setting the control dial to EV comp is 99% of the way there, except that when I drop into manual mode, I get EV with an "Unavailable" symbol and shutter speed. If control ring functions could be assigned per mode, this would be no issue; dropping it into M would put the control ring back to controlling aperture as it should.
Similarly, if I could use the "User Memory" mode to save the settings with the control ring as Av in manual, I'd be okay too. Little bit of a pain but no worries.
The last proposed solution just gives quicker access to the menu setting that changes the ring function. Least ideal, but perhaps the easiest to impliment?
As it is, this little issue is no dealbreaker for me. I don't use my RX100 in full manual very much. In fact if you glued the mode dial into A mode I doubt i'd notice very quickly.
The other issue is that in Manual mode, for long exposures, there's a bulb mode. On a camera with no remote control or cable rellease socket, why bulb? Could Sony have made it T instead?
Additionally, no intervalometer? Not that I'd personally use one much, but even my Fiancee's $80 ($80 brand new, mind) Pentax P&S waterproof camera has one. It's not a hard feature to include.
The Auto-bracketing is only .3 or .7 EV. What about manual settings for that from 0.3-3EV like a DSLR?
For its primary role as a pocket camera and a handheld shooter none of these is a dealbreaker, but some of it would be very nice. Admittedly for T shots, time lapse, and Auto-bracketing in RAW to make HDR I'd probably use a DSLR instead of my pocket camera. If I'm going to haul a tripod I'm going to haul an SLR around too. The worst part is, this is all stuff that's fixable in firmware. I really hope Sony step up and make a fantastic camera all but perfect. That would elevate the RX100 from "Pocket DSLR Replacement" to "Do-it-all Compact."
There are, also, one or two little hardware quirks:
I have to agree with the masses that the HDMI slot is in a terrible location. Maybe sony have a tripod-socket-mounted viewfinder thingy coming out for it?
Because there is very little clutter on the sides or top of the camera, there are plenty of places to stick a remote control sensor or a cable release socket or a headphone/mic jack. Odd that none of these exist anywhere, for such a serious little compact.
The WhiteMagic LCD screen is wonderful, and I knew full well going in that it was my only option, but if Sony put an EVF/Accessory port on the top, I'd buy a Sony EVF to go with it.
Additionally, a wireless flash sync or a hotshoe would have been very cool. Perhaps combined with the accessory port like the RX1/Oly Pen/Oly XZ*/Lumix G/Lumix LX* cameras?
I realize full well that the RX100 is unbelieveably tiny for what it is, and that they had to save every tiny ounce of space to make it as small as it is with the sensor and lens it has. I am fully willing to accept some of the compromises, but a slightly larger camera with the same user experience but the above features would be pretty rockin'.
Wishlist for the next RX pocket camera:
1. The shutter button should have standard cable release threads, or there should be a remote control sensor somewhere.
2. The ports (HDMI and maybe audio) should be elsewhere.
3. The control ring should be fully customizeable and the customization should be saved for each mode separately.
4. This is just me being crazy, but replace the large rear-mounted LCD with a smaller LCD for a function display, and do all live view/playback through a NEX-7 EVF. Yes, eliminate the LCD in favor of an EVF. I'd hit it.
5. A lens with a smaller zoom range but a wider wide end. 24-90 would be okay. No slower than 2.8 even at the long end.
Okay, now that I'm done venting, on to the good:
The RX100 does the "low light" or "nearly no light" thing like no camera I've ever used. Even at 6400ISO with NR off in RAW, the files are completely useable for prints up to about 8x10, in my estimation. I will run a couple off and see if I'm right sometime. After Jpeg or 3rd party NR, they're probably even better. The fast lens and AF system mean this thing focuses and shoots reliably with good results even in the dark.
The RX100 is also great about background blur. It has a long enough FL that actual bokeh can be had even at wide angle. I love that it has a real 7 blade aperture diaphragm.
The lens, even without the distortion correction in the Sony JPEGs, is very good. Sharp and contrasty and just lovely.
Physically, the damn thing is TINY. Truly small and without a doubt, a real "Pocket camera". This will fit into even the hip pocket of skinny jeans. I haven't tried it cause I don't smoke, but I wouldn't be suprised if it fit comfortably inside a pack of cigarettes.
Now, the questions!
1. I really like the idea of a little bit of a handgrip, but I like the idea of a case more. I'm currently using a Lowepro neoprene D-wrap, a camera wrap I used on my Optio and called the "Burrito case". It's a stretch on the RX100 and leaves the sides unprotected.
I'd like to put a leather every-ready style case on it, for added padding/protection and because it looks good. But I still want to keep it in a pocket. What cases are out there that look good and offer good protection while allowing me to still pocket the camera without too much trouble?
Aki Asahi offers leather kits for the RX100. Is it worth $16 to cover the camera's lower front half in leather very few people will ever see?
The RX100 also has some amazingly good and well thought out controls. Not having to menu dive for pretty much anything is nice. There are, however, some things I'd like Sony to change in the next firmware (And I don't mean the control dial lag, cause I don't notice it and it isn't a huge deal...)
1. Customizeability of the control ring. I wish Sony would implement one of the following solutions:
a. Control ring has a single function across all modes, but the rear dial can be customized. As such, the rear dial is always mode dependent.
b. Control dial is customizeable, and what it is set to control is saved per mode, not universally.
c. In the "User Memory" mode, save the control dial function as part of the memory settings.
d. In the Fn submenu, allow one of the 7 customizeable functions to be "Control Ring Function".
These 4 solutions would all do away with the single biggest niggle I have with the whole camera. In P, A, and S, I like having quick access to EV comp and the primary control (shutter, aperture, or Program shift) from a main dial. In Manual, I like having shutter on one, aperture on the other. I'd prefer if the control ring around the lens controlled the main function in P/A/S, and the rear dial did the secondary. Sadly that isn't possible. The "good enough" solution is to put the secondary function on the big control dial, and the main attribute on the rear dial.
Setting the control dial to EV comp is 99% of the way there, except that when I drop into manual mode, I get EV with an "Unavailable" symbol and shutter speed. If control ring functions could be assigned per mode, this would be no issue; dropping it into M would put the control ring back to controlling aperture as it should.
Similarly, if I could use the "User Memory" mode to save the settings with the control ring as Av in manual, I'd be okay too. Little bit of a pain but no worries.
The last proposed solution just gives quicker access to the menu setting that changes the ring function. Least ideal, but perhaps the easiest to impliment?
As it is, this little issue is no dealbreaker for me. I don't use my RX100 in full manual very much. In fact if you glued the mode dial into A mode I doubt i'd notice very quickly.
The other issue is that in Manual mode, for long exposures, there's a bulb mode. On a camera with no remote control or cable rellease socket, why bulb? Could Sony have made it T instead?
Additionally, no intervalometer? Not that I'd personally use one much, but even my Fiancee's $80 ($80 brand new, mind) Pentax P&S waterproof camera has one. It's not a hard feature to include.
The Auto-bracketing is only .3 or .7 EV. What about manual settings for that from 0.3-3EV like a DSLR?
For its primary role as a pocket camera and a handheld shooter none of these is a dealbreaker, but some of it would be very nice. Admittedly for T shots, time lapse, and Auto-bracketing in RAW to make HDR I'd probably use a DSLR instead of my pocket camera. If I'm going to haul a tripod I'm going to haul an SLR around too. The worst part is, this is all stuff that's fixable in firmware. I really hope Sony step up and make a fantastic camera all but perfect. That would elevate the RX100 from "Pocket DSLR Replacement" to "Do-it-all Compact."
There are, also, one or two little hardware quirks:
I have to agree with the masses that the HDMI slot is in a terrible location. Maybe sony have a tripod-socket-mounted viewfinder thingy coming out for it?
Because there is very little clutter on the sides or top of the camera, there are plenty of places to stick a remote control sensor or a cable release socket or a headphone/mic jack. Odd that none of these exist anywhere, for such a serious little compact.
The WhiteMagic LCD screen is wonderful, and I knew full well going in that it was my only option, but if Sony put an EVF/Accessory port on the top, I'd buy a Sony EVF to go with it.
Additionally, a wireless flash sync or a hotshoe would have been very cool. Perhaps combined with the accessory port like the RX1/Oly Pen/Oly XZ*/Lumix G/Lumix LX* cameras?
I realize full well that the RX100 is unbelieveably tiny for what it is, and that they had to save every tiny ounce of space to make it as small as it is with the sensor and lens it has. I am fully willing to accept some of the compromises, but a slightly larger camera with the same user experience but the above features would be pretty rockin'.
Wishlist for the next RX pocket camera:
1. The shutter button should have standard cable release threads, or there should be a remote control sensor somewhere.
2. The ports (HDMI and maybe audio) should be elsewhere.
3. The control ring should be fully customizeable and the customization should be saved for each mode separately.
4. This is just me being crazy, but replace the large rear-mounted LCD with a smaller LCD for a function display, and do all live view/playback through a NEX-7 EVF. Yes, eliminate the LCD in favor of an EVF. I'd hit it.
5. A lens with a smaller zoom range but a wider wide end. 24-90 would be okay. No slower than 2.8 even at the long end.
Okay, now that I'm done venting, on to the good:
The RX100 does the "low light" or "nearly no light" thing like no camera I've ever used. Even at 6400ISO with NR off in RAW, the files are completely useable for prints up to about 8x10, in my estimation. I will run a couple off and see if I'm right sometime. After Jpeg or 3rd party NR, they're probably even better. The fast lens and AF system mean this thing focuses and shoots reliably with good results even in the dark.
The RX100 is also great about background blur. It has a long enough FL that actual bokeh can be had even at wide angle. I love that it has a real 7 blade aperture diaphragm.
The lens, even without the distortion correction in the Sony JPEGs, is very good. Sharp and contrasty and just lovely.
Physically, the damn thing is TINY. Truly small and without a doubt, a real "Pocket camera". This will fit into even the hip pocket of skinny jeans. I haven't tried it cause I don't smoke, but I wouldn't be suprised if it fit comfortably inside a pack of cigarettes.
Now, the questions!
1. I really like the idea of a little bit of a handgrip, but I like the idea of a case more. I'm currently using a Lowepro neoprene D-wrap, a camera wrap I used on my Optio and called the "Burrito case". It's a stretch on the RX100 and leaves the sides unprotected.
I'd like to put a leather every-ready style case on it, for added padding/protection and because it looks good. But I still want to keep it in a pocket. What cases are out there that look good and offer good protection while allowing me to still pocket the camera without too much trouble?
Aki Asahi offers leather kits for the RX100. Is it worth $16 to cover the camera's lower front half in leather very few people will ever see?
unixrevolution
Well-known
Wow. No responses in what, 11 hours? What's wrong, guys? TL;DR or what? :bang:
That's a lot to respond to. 
Mostly, it's a point and shoot. Not really going to quibble about what it doesn't do or what I wish it did.
I wouldn't change a thing about my RX100. Will they improve it with an RX200? Most certainly.
Mostly, it's a point and shoot. Not really going to quibble about what it doesn't do or what I wish it did.
I wouldn't change a thing about my RX100. Will they improve it with an RX200? Most certainly.
dfatty
Well-known
lol, yeah, i suspect that some TL;DR is going on. but i'm sure your thoughts will be helpful to future potential buyers.
i haven't seen anyone use an ever-ready style case, it would seem to defeat the purpose size-wise. i can't speak for the aki-asahi leather trim, but i love the franiec grip. it gives you a really nice hold and still lets you put it in your pocket.
also, there seems to be only 1 question, don't know if you meant to have more.
i haven't seen anyone use an ever-ready style case, it would seem to defeat the purpose size-wise. i can't speak for the aki-asahi leather trim, but i love the franiec grip. it gives you a really nice hold and still lets you put it in your pocket.
also, there seems to be only 1 question, don't know if you meant to have more.
back alley
IMAGES
works great for me...exactly what i want in a pocket cam...
jky
Well-known
Franeic grip out front and a couple small plastic stoppers at the back for thumb leverage. Works great. Didn't bother with a case as it would defeat the purpose I purchased it for - a compact pocket cam.
back alley
IMAGES
i put some griptac where my thumb rests on the back, between the movie button and the screen...plus the rf grip as well.
unixrevolution
Well-known
The Franeic grip looks nice, but, well, yes I know I'm looking at a leather case but the grip seems to add too much bulk, as well as make mounting any kind of camera case impossible. I need the protection for my expensive camera more than I need the grippy.
Many of the ever-ready style cases fit the camera closely, and I carry mine in a cargo pocket more so than a hip pocket. I also wear khakis, so when I do have hip pockets they're very big.
That's a lot to respond to.
Mostly, it's a point and shoot. Not really going to quibble about what it doesn't do or what I wish it did.
I wouldn't change a thing about my RX100. Will they improve it with an RX200? Most certainly.
I won't let designations like "point and shoot" lower my expectations. That said, the Sony really is a dream. I just like to nitpick.
The back thumbrest seems fine to me. Where I need grip more so than the back is on the front. The camera isn't "Slippery" like people say it is but a firmer grip would be better.
There are about 450 billion leather cases on eBay. I remember someone on RFF reccomending one other than the Sony's genuine pleather case, but I can't remember where I heard the reccomendation or which one they reccomend.
umcelinho
Marcelo
have you sent this feedback to sony already? (i mean it)
tbhv55
Well-known
I agree with almost all of the OP's list of likes and dislikes - in particular, the wish for an intervalometer - but there is one major complaint from me, and that is the video button. I really wish that the video button could be disabled in a menu setting. It's a real nuisance to have a button which is so readily inadvertently pressed... especially when you are not (habitually) a video shooter!
That aside, I'm increasingly impressed with the RX100. It took a little while to warm to it, but I'm getting there. The results from it are superb. It's sometimes difficult to believe that the images are from a compact camera!
That aside, I'm increasingly impressed with the RX100. It took a little while to warm to it, but I'm getting there. The results from it are superb. It's sometimes difficult to believe that the images are from a compact camera!
dhoun
Newbie
Totally agree with the point about the video button. Double press instead of single press activation would probably solve that annoyance.
tbhv55
Well-known
That's a good suggestion. In fact I'd like to see the two options combined (in a firmware update), to permit both disabling of the video button, and to set it to double-press activation. I wonder if anyone from Sony reads this forum?