Nicca III-s: perishable shutter curtains ?

Luddite Frank

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I finally snagged a nice Nicca III-A or B (?) for what I considered to be a reasonable price on e-bay, coming with a Nikkor HC 50 f:2 lens, ERC, instruction "booklet" ( 3-leaf fold-out card), and a GE 8DW meter.

The camera is really clean, and seems to function well. Only issue is crackly shutter curtains...

Did Nicca copy Leica TOO well ? 🙄
 
I think so. I have a Sears Tower Type 3, made by Nicca, and it also had very bad shutter curtains that required replacement. Other than that, a wonderful camera.
 
I must be lucky. My Nicca IIIS and my Tower Type 43 both have LN shutter curtains. Possibly they had been replaced prior to my acquiring them.
 
Not uncommon with cloth focal-plane shutters from this period. If you don't have any pinhole light leaks in the curtain, you can try to use the camera until they start to show up.

If you decide to have the curtains replaced, Youxin Ye does a great job on these type of cameras. He replaced the curtains and did a CLA on my Canon IVSB for a very good price, and had the camera back to me within 2 weeks.
 
I agree most cloth shutters from this period need replaced. I had 3 leicas done a number of exakta cameras a nicca and now I need curtains for My Leotax. Now on the other hand I have a kardon from the same period I'm not sure what the curtains are made out of there very thick and pliable in perfect shape
 
It depends on how the camera was stored. If in a hot attic, or a musty basement, they can deteriorate like any 60 year old piece of thin cloth. If kept in an air conditioned house, I've had cloth shutters work great that are that old. Actually most of my Japanese cameras, Canon, Nicca, and Tanack all had fine shutters when I got them. I've never replaced a curtain on a Japanese camera. But I have on most of my Leicas.
 
Interstingly, the curtains in my 1930's Leicas seem to be holding-up very nicely.

( I hope I have not just jinxed them... 😱 )


So are mine, ( two Leica lll) but the ones on two Nicca 3-S from the mid 1950s needed the shutter curtains replaced because they were cracked and leaked light.
 
I think goamules has the right of it, for the most part it seems to depend more on storage than quality control or quality of material. Have an early Leica I and a Tower 3S, curtains in both are just fine. Y'all want to see bad curtains, take a look at a Kodak Ektra some time. The (disintegrated) curtains on mine feel like some sort of a paper composite.
 
Just a thought on climate I'm 48yrs old My father keep just his bedroom air conditioned nowhere else in the house He kept his antiques downstairs when I was young we lived in the midwest. My grandparents didn't believe in the use of air conditioning preferred the windows to be opened in the hot humid months. I would guess at some point most these camera has been in hot and cold environments one time or another. If you notice the lens on the camera with a lot of haze or fungus it would be a good indications there would be other issues with the camera. I agree it is not brand related although I found a lot of east german cameras with poor shutters.
 
I'm sure storage conditions have a big impact on condition of shutter curtains; the only vintage camera with focal-plane shutter I own whose history I know of is my Dad's Nikon S. He bought it in the mid-1960's, and it was in decent shape ( aside from the slow-speeds not working ).

Somewhere along the way, it sustained a tiny hole in the shutter curtain, along the edge of the mask, about half-way across the frame. I suspect this was from sunlight through a stopped-down lens ? (Dad never had a lens-cap). I daubed that hole closed with some black acrylic paint in the late 1970's, which resolved the light-leak.

The camera always lived on the shelf in the front hall closet (and inside the leather ERC), and our house did have central air for the summers.

When I pulled it out a few years ago, I found the curtains quite riddled with holes, and the body covering exhibiting a bad case of "Zeiss-bumps", and some green corrosion appearing around the margins of the chromed covers.

All my other vintage focal-plane cameras are e-bay or other I-net purchases which came w/o histories.

All of my pre-war Leicae seem to have intact original curtains. My 1952 III-f and my early '50's Nicca both have swiss-cheesey curtains, but otherwise-flawless cosmetics.

I also have a number Exaktas from the 1950's, probably four bodies, only one has decent curtains: a Varex with the PC flash connections.

My last curtain horror-story is with a beautiful Speed Graphic, circa 1929: I think this one lived in a hot attic: when I tried to wind the FP shutter, I got a little travel, then hard resistance... I removed the back-panel / viewing screen, which exposes the upper & lower blinds, and discovered that the tightly-rolled rubberized cloth had fused to itself. 🙁
 
My last curtain horror-story is with a beautiful Speed Graphic, circa 1929: I think this one lived in a hot attic: when I tried to wind the FP shutter, I got a little travel, then hard resistance... I removed the back-panel / viewing screen, which exposes the upper & lower blinds, and discovered that the tightly-rolled rubberized cloth had fused to itself. 🙁

Hey...I got one of these as well! It is a "mint" example. 😀
 
LOL, Dan... aside from the fused shutter curtain, mine could truly almost qualify as "mint"...

Maybe function doesn't count so much for Shelf-Queens... 😱


( I would like to return one to useable condition, some day.... )
 
I was able to buy a sheet of shutter material from japan in the past I dont know if you still can.
On a speed graphic the one I had (basement storage) you can remove the shutter from the back Its pieced together in a long row with slits at variable distances for the speed changes. The graflex uses heavy material and I was able to cut the mold rotted piece out replace and glue in with pliobond glue
 
Ronsonol lighter fluid will break apart fused rubberized cloth use a small amount BUT it will also desolve the glue holding the cloth to the roller
 
I ran across this thread while searching for more information on Nicca rangefinders. I have a little bit of experience dealing with 60 year old shutters, so I thought I'd pass it along.

I bought a Canon IIIa rangefinder a few years ago, and the first roll of film I ran through it revealed that the shutter had pinholes. Like about a dozen of them. I don't recall where I read this tip, but I tried it, and it works great. There's a product you can buy at the big box stores and elsewhere called Plastidip. Its a liquid polymer of some sort that was originally used for applying an insulation coating on tool handles. You dip, say, a pair of pliers' handles in a can of this stuff and it will leave behind a wet coating on the handles that will dry to a pliable surface, insulating the handles from accidental electrical shock. It comes in a variety of colors, including black. It's also available in spray cans.

So I bought a spray can of the black Plastidip to try on my IIIa's shutter. I sprayed a couple of second's bursts onto a paper plate, and then using a medium stiff artist's brush, I reached through the lens mount and carefully daubed the Plastidip onto the shutter curtains. I'd apply it to the first curtain, wait until it dried, then I'd trip the shutter and apply it to the second curtain, then let it dry again before I charged the shutter. The key was to apply the Plastidip in a thin, even coating. And to apply additional coats sparingly, as necessary. This last bit is important because the Plastidip has mass and adding too much mass can change the timing of the shutter. So, easy does it, and all that.

Anyway, after this first go-round with the Plastidip, I took the camera out and shot another roll with it. It still had pinholes, but they'd been reduced from about a dozen to a couple. So I gave the shutter another treatment, then ran another roll through the camera, and this time I was successful. No more pinholes.

Because of Plastidip's properties -- it stays flexible indefinitely and stays where you put it -- this is a permanent repair. And fortunately , it goes on thin enough such that its presence is almost invisible.

Since then, i've used it on a couple of other repairs and it's worked well for these. I don't know what it is about Metz's coiled flash cables, but they tend to rot after they get old, and the external insulation cracks and falls off. To repair this problem, I sprayed the cables with Plastidip, which did a good job of coating them. To all appearances, this was a permanent repair.

I haven't tried it for this yet, but I'm thinking that this repair should also work welll for pinhole repair on camera bellows. Hey, why not. It's flexible, and can be applied to build up to any thickness desired.
 
Does it dry non-tacky? That's the main concern, that it will stick things together when rolled up on the shutter reel. If not, and it stays pliable, it sounds like a good material.
 
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