Nikkor 85/1.8 AFS on B&W film ?

[mfogiel]

I want to go back to shoot more street portraiture, and am looking for a better alternative to my Nikkor 85/1.8D, which has no micro contrast and an ugly bokeh to boot. I want to use my F100 for this, as I want quick autofocus and will work between f 1.8 and f 4.0.
The obvious answer would be the 85/1.8 AF-S - but has anybody actually tried it with, say Tri X or HP5+ ?
I bought the 50/1.8 AF-S lately and its performance on film is very poor, average sharpness and no character whatsoever, so I hope someone could help me decide.
Thanks
Marek

 

[VTHokiEE]

I have used the 85 1.8 AF-S with a N90s, but I believe it was on Fuji Neopan 1600. The majority of the roll was indoors snaps of my kid though so I'm not certain how much you would gain about the performance. If you're interested I can PM you an example though.

 

[Highway 61]

I bought the 50/1.8 AF-S lately and its performance on film is very poor, average sharpness and no character whatsoever

I wonder how a lens which is a stellar performer in front of very demanding sensors can have poor performance on film as it would normally have performances tests bargraphs all over the top on any kind of film which, by definition, all demand way less resolution from the lens than any sensor !

Something's wrong somewhere (camera body AF out of specs ?).

 

[Mark C]

I want to go back to shoot more street portraiture, and am looking for a better alternative to my Nikkor 85/1.8D, which has no micro contrast and an ugly bokeh to boot. I want to use my F100 for this, as I want quick autofocus and will work between f 1.8 and f 4.0.
The obvious answer would be the 85/1.8 AF-S - but has anybody actually tried it with, say Tri X or HP5+ ?
I bought the 50/1.8 AF-S lately and its performance on film is very poor, average sharpness and no character whatsoever, so I hope someone could help me decide.
Thanks
Marek

I have no experience with the AF-S, but did a quick trial at the local store with the 85/1.8 AF not long after it came out. I believe the AF is the same lens as the D, just without the distance coding.

It sure seemed better (b&w film) than my 85/2 AI and a friend later (around '92) bought one based on that. I believe he has always been happy with it, starting with b&w and color film, then digital. I know that isn't much useful info, but posted because I was talking to my friend yesterday and he had bought another to replace his because the first has been filling with dust/fungus for quite a few years. I think this design has a lot of air transfer and is prone to that. If you haven't done it already, it might be worth a close inspection with a glaring light. I use a desk lamp, but a small flashlight is the classic. This has generally been considered a good lens, so just wondering why it didn't work well for you.

Oddly enough, I also just noticed yesterday that my 85/1.8 K (manual focus) didn't seem up to snuff. It looked very clean with a casual look toward the light, but close inspection showed a film of this dusty stuff that I suspect is actually a mold on some inner elements. I spent an hour taking it apart and cleaning it, and the difference was quite noticeable on film, more in microcontrast than sharpness.

What aperture do you generally use? All these 85's seem to have good bokeh at full aperture, and not bad a stop or two down, then getting much worse. The 105/2.5 is much better in that regard and in every other way, but I don't know if it was made in an AF version.

 

[mfogiel]

@Highway61
The reality of pictures seems to be different than the reality of these tests, at least on film. For example, Zeiss Makro Planars are often compared unfavourably to some Japanese lenses, but when you actually use them at wide apertures and at various distances, there is no contest, except perhaps shooting at f 8.0 at infinity, where most lenses will be a tie. I am looking for reasonable sharpness, high micro contrast, good spatial rendition (3d) and good bokeh. There are some Nikon lenses which are borderline acceptable, but they are usually the long ones like the 105 DC, if you stop it down to f 4.0. Digital seems to be equalizing lenses to some extent. the 50/1.8 afs on B&W film feels and looks like a plastic lens.
The 85/1.8 AFS is supposed to be super sharp wide open and have much better bokeh than AFD, I just wonder if it is not the usual bleak digi dud.

 

[kxl]

I will let you know after this weekend. I recently purchased an F100 to try the relatively new f1.8 AFS primes on film. I have the 28/1.8 and 85/1.8 AFS and have pre-ordered the 20/1.8 AFS. I did not get the 50/1.8 AFS since I already had a 50/1.4 AFS. TO date, I've only used them on a DSLR. I plan to use those lenses extensively this weekend, and hope to process the negatives next week. I'll post some pics.

Regarding comparisons with AFD lenses on a DSLR, in my experience, the 85/1.8 AFS is sharper (in the center) than either the 85/1.8 AFD or 85/1.4 AFD. To my eyes, the AFS has more pleasing bokeh the 1.8 AFD (which exhibits ugly blobs on backlit subjects) but not as pleasing the OLD king of bokeh, the 1.4 AFD. I have never shot the 85/1.4 AFS, but from what I have seen, this $1600 lens destroys all the others, and is the NEW king of bokeh.

 

[mfogiel]

Thanks Keith. I need to use it in the f 1.8-40 range, and I would be happy to get something better than the 85/1.8 AF-D. For the extreme bokeh department I have other stuff.

 

[grandallj]

I haven't used it, but there is the Sigma 85/1.4.

I'm still on manual focus with my Nikon 85/1.4 AI-S. I don't think I'll ever get rid of that lens.

 

[Highway 61]

@Highway61
I am looking for reasonable sharpness, high micro contrast, good spatial rendition (3d) and good bokeh. There are some Nikon lenses which are borderline acceptable, but they are usually the long ones like the 105 DC, if you stop it down to f 4.0. Digital seems to be equalizing lenses to some extent. the 50/1.8 afs on B&W film feels and looks like a plastic lens.
The 85/1.8 AFS is supposed to be super sharp wide open and have much better bokeh than AFD, I just wonder if it is not the usual bleak digi dud.

Don't know.

You're the first person I'm aware of saying that the 85/1.8 AF-D has no microcontrast and an ugly bokeh. I have used this lens extensively on film and never noticed one or the other of those defects. I have also used the recent AF-S models you mention and have nothing to complaint about. For me the 50/1.8 AF-S has nothing of a "plastic lens".

To each his own. Remember - I'm from the old school and started photography when what counted was the interest of the thing photographed and how the photographer was telling the story to the people looking at the photographs. Lens rendition, bokeh, microconstrast and 3D effect on a bidimensional image had not been invented yet.

 

[x-ray]

To each his own. Remember - I'm from the old school and started photography when what counted was the interest of the thing photographed and how the photographer was telling the story to the people looking at the photographs. Lens rendition, bokeh, microconstrast and 3D effect on a bidimensional image had not been invented yet.

I'm with you here. Content trumps bokeh, sharpness and about everything else. Forum chatter distracts from what's really important. No criticism if this is your thing.

As to these lenses, I have a F100 and have the new AFS that I carry with my D800 and a 1.4 D in my DF kit. In the 90's had the 1.8 D and before that the F2 AIS. I shoot commercially and never had a complaint regarding either of these lenses. The f2 gets a bad rap for some reason but I found it to be a very good lens. The 1.8D was very sharp even wide open. Focus was killer fast as well. No complaints with this lens.

I currently have the 1.4D and AFS 1.8. The 1.4 is without doubt my favorite of all the 85 Nikkors I've used. A little dreamy but sharp wide open but simply brilliant at. F2 and down. Wide open makes stunning portraits. Oof is gorgeous too. The 1.8 afs is tack sharp at every aperture. It's almost too sharp. I find it hard hooking IMO. I'm talking film and digital both.

My favorite by far is the AFD 1.4 but they're all good.