Nikon F2 or F3?

GarageBoy said:
I mean, I get it, it's fun for me to whip out the F2AS and play 1970s/1980s documentary photographerm, it's fun to bring out the F3P and MD4 combo and play 1980s press photographer

I can understand why someone wants to be "challenged" by using a meterless camera

I've tried it and occasionally, I look at my negatives and think "if I had the F100 and AF lens, I would not have missed the focus that badly"
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You're missing the point some of us are trying to make.

I have a fully mechanical film camera (at this time an F2 w/DE-1) that I carry with me at all times. The reason I carry this is because it is rather small (compared to my work cameras D4, D700 w/Grip), is virtually indestructible, needs no batteries or other disposables, and when I see something that catches my eye, it is always there, ready to shoot (and it makes much nicer pictures than my iPhone).

I use a different film camera system for photo documentary work, (at this time an F3HP, FM2n and a few primes, in the past, Leica M's and a few summicrons). The reason I use this is that the camera system is rather basic, pretty bullet-proof, I do my documentary work in B&W, the system is not nearly as intimidating to subjects as my work cameras with their zoom lenses, and the system is so simple to use that I can concentrate on really interacting with the subjects of the work, and almost forget the camera until it is time to make an image. Then I can quickly and gracefully bring the camera up, make an image, and go right back to the interaction with the subjects.

It's about finding a tool that works for you in doing what you are trying to do. At this time, these old film Nikons do the trick.

Best,
-Tim
 
photomoof said:
OK read the whole thread. Frankly assuming that I was going to seriously replace my Nikon S2 and Luna Pro, I would buy a Nikon factory refurbished F6.

At only $1300 for what is basically a new camera (sent back from places like B&H) it is a no-brainer IMO, if you want an SLR.
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Unless what you want is a mechanical SLR with traditional controls.
 
nobbylon said:
I know some rave about the F but having owned and used 3 I found them uncomfortable ( too many sharp edges) a pain to load and that wobbly film advance annoying. The meterless prism that's so coveted is very prone to denting and prism cracking. The F2 turned it into the camera it could have been.
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I feel the same way about the F. I have two, both with Tn prisms. I try to use them, but they're just heavy, big, and blocky. If I'm going to deal with removing a camera back or bottom, I might as well be shooting one of my RFs. An F3 is my go-to 35mm SLR...I can use both my AI and Pre-AI lenses, have a hinged film back, electronic shutter speeds, an a comfortable-to-use body.

I had never set hands on a Nikkormat until recently and was pleasantly surprised. Not really sure what all the rage over an F with plain prism is, when a Nikkormat FTn with working meter is about $30, looks extremely similar, has a hinged film door, and is pretty much functionally equivalent in my book.
 
photomoof said:
While I loved my Nikon FTn in 1965, they are just too long in the tooth for me at this point. That is why I said "I." Although I did recommend the F6, mostly because I wanted one recently, until I realized there is just no film left I really love for color.

Guess what I should have said is -- I am just too grumpy and impatient to use, or try to repair, 50 year old metered SLRs? Rangefinders yes.
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Fred,

Old and grumpy is a good thing. LOL.

It just is so alluring buying an old and grumpy Nikon Pro camera for no money. A lot of people here on this forum like old and grumpy cameras.

Cal
 
photomoof said:
OK read the whole thread. Frankly assuming that I was going to seriously replace my Nikon S2 and Luna Pro, I would buy a Nikon factory refurbished F6.

At only $1300 for what is basically a new camera (sent back from places like B&H) it is a no-brainer IMO, if you want an SLR.
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The F6 completely misses the point of this thread, which is about manual cameras.
Anyway off topic here.. are you sure refurbished cameras are such a deal? I ask because I have seen factory refurbished cameras which look really used, the refurbished process brought them back into line mechanically. They normally are warranty return items, i.e. they were used, something broke, they were sent back to the mfg. Maybe some of these return were treated with kid gloves by their previous owners, but there is no guarantee of that.
On the other hand, B&H sells opened box items in their used dept as like new/open box. There is a difference between that and refurbished.
 
Yeah, I agree about Nikon Refurbished products. I always thought they were "like new" stock that just had some minor issue so Nikon refurbished them and could no longer sell them as "new". Looking at some of their refurbished product this past summer, some of it is really heavily used. Not to mention it only has a 90 day warranty.

Best,
-Tim
 
A F6(or more realistically F100) wouldn't really offer much of a different shooting experience to my D800, if I deside to use film for subjects that need fast AF I might consider one in the future.

My reason for wanting to go with a manual SLR is partly simply a different shooting experience and partly to get the best out of the Zeiss 50mm Makro. A bought it for my D800 mainly as a macro/landscape lens and it works well for that purpose but I don't find manual focus that easy with electronic rangefinder so for things like street shooting the ability to use a traditional focusing screen seems like it would be helpful.
 
photomoof said:
One would have to be a rather meek buyer, to just take anything, seems very unlikely among RFF members, who are far from passive about equipment.
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Buying refurbished directly from the Nikon website you are not allowed to return an item unless the box is unopened/seals intact, or the item is broken.
Nothing about being meek.
Most people get great stuff from them, but there are a few clangers thrown in.

Personally I would not buy anything used/refurbished sight unseen if there is no return policy.
 
photomoof said:
Some of them are brand new, you have to buy a good one from a dealer, so that you can see what you are buying. Surely no one would actually take a beater home??? I have never see actual factory referbs which were not actually new. Most companies just dump new or demo equipment as referbs to avoid the long warranty. A lot of dealers try to pass off used as factory referbs, was what you saw in Nikon factory boxes?

One would have to be a rather meek buyer, to just take anything, seems very unlikely among RFF members, who are far from passive about equipment.
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The thing I noticed when I looked into this last summer was particular to digital camera bodies. Many, though looking newish, had thousands or tens of thousands of shutter actuations (sp). I use my DSLR's for work, so when buying "new to me" cameras, I would like them to start out with new shutters or as few shutter actuations as possible. A refurb D3S I looked at had over 35,000 shutter actuations, that really surprised me. I thought they were lightly used or demo cameras.

Best,
-Tim
 
Well the great deal I got on the black F2 w/DE-1 turned out to be not such a great deal. Had some serious issues. Authorized Photo Service just finished overhauling it to the tune of $200, had to replace a "governor", and some other mechanism that sits behind the front plate, the mech that makes the automatic diaphragm open and close on the lens. They said that some non-Nikon service person obviously worked on the camera at some point because there was some "Jerry-Rigging" inside the camera. But they said now it is as good as new and should give me years of good service.

Really nice having those folks in town.

Best,
-Tim

PS: Just got the camera back. They had to replace the mirror box side plate, replace the back door seals, rebuild the shutter mechanism and replace one part, adjust the shutter speeds, adjust-repair the FFD/lens mount alignment, repair the battery box and replace a corroded part (so a metered head could be used on the camera, as the camera was, no electricity was making it from the battery to the head), and adjust the ground glass position (to match the FFD). The service person again said someone had boogered up some of the internal mechanisms. He got it all apart, and was able to fix everything, so now it's like new. As an aside, Authorized Photo Service in Morton Grove Illinois, where I brought the camera, has the largest supply of NOS parts for these F and F2 cameras, as they were an Authorized Nikon Service Center back when these cameras were regularly used and they bought up the existing stock of the Nikon parts when Nikon cut back on servicing them.
 
Sitting on my desk is a 1971 Nikkor 2.0/28mm pre-Ai lens that looks like it's been to hell and back. It shows brass, nickel and black paint, has almost no lettering intact and focus is a bit loose. Glass is near perfect. I got it from the forum, it was said to have belonged to a Detroit Free Press photographer, who took it to Vietnam and the first Gulf War. Sure looks like it's been in action in situations like that.

Tomorrow I will take delivery of a 1973 black F2, with a silver plain prism on it. The camera is in perfect working condition but is shows about as much brass as black paint.

I'm planning to marry them, and have them live happily ever after. I'll post a picture once the ceremony has taken place ;)
 
Family Portrait.

Nice to have them all back under the same roof.

FamilyPortrait.jpg

Best,
-Tim
 
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