Nikon F3 Screen in F2

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Kumachrome

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Hi, I have a Nikon F2 with a DE-1 finder. The current A screen in it is quite dirty. I attempted to clean it, ended up making it somewhat worse. Oops. Anyway, I decided I'll just replace it. I read online that I can put the superior Nikon F3 focusing screens into the frame of the F2 screens. Anyone have experience with this? It's a simple job, right? Just unscrew the screen from the frame and replace them? This should also apply to the "red-dot" F3 screens, correct?

Also, being mainly a street photographer who uses a 50mm, should the F3 K screen be sufficient? Occasionally, I'll do portraits and landscapes.

Thanks
 
JMQ said:
Do a search here, there was a discussion just a couple of months ago.
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Jean-Marc,

I have done this mucho times. The best screens are the F3 "Red-Dot" screens that are brighter versions of the F3 screens.

Pretty much all you have to do is exchange the screen's frames. The screws are small, and someone with sausage fingers would experience difficulty, otherwise very simple.

Be aware the brighter Red-Dot screens can effect metering if using a metered prism.

Red-Dot Screens have red lettering and are easily identified.

Nikon F2's with DE-1 prisms are really great with a F3 Red-Dot screen. The brighter screen along with a non highpoint viewfinder means a relly contrasty focus snap.

Cal
 
Kumachrome said:
...I read online that I can put the superior Nikon F3 focusing screens into the frame of the F2 screens. Anyone have experience with this? ...
Click to expand...

You can do it, but the very often don't fit properly. The curve of the top condenser lens is not always a match to the curve in the metal frame that it seats against.

The best way to accomplish what you want is:
  1. VERY CAREFULLY remove the elements from the F3 screen's frame.
  2. File or mill off the lifting tab from the F3 screen's metal frame.
  3. Re-insert the elements into the F3 frame
This modified F3 screen can now be used in an F or F2. The later, brighter F3 screens, those with the red dot, will cause any TTL metering F or F2 to misread slightly. The easiest fix is to use one of the "screen correction" indexes when setting the ISO. Simply set up a blank white card and meter with both the old F2 screen and the new F3 screen to see what adjustment is necessary, likely 1/3-2/3 stops.
 
As an aside but related the progression of the F/F2 screens is noted by the colour code, noting that not all screens come in all colours, I think the first type on launch of the F was only in A,B and C types:

1. Engraved White Letter with small screws (8 per mm Fresnel lens pitch) (Quite rare)
2. Printed White Letter with small screws (8 per mm Fresnel lens pitch)
3. Printed White Letter (8 per mm Fresnel lens pitch)
4. Printed Yellow Letter (12 per mm Fresnel lens pitch)
5. Printed Red Letter (24 per mm Fresnel lens pitch)

The F3 screens in "plain" red are = F2 Red screens in technology they later gained the red dot as the next progression rather than a colour change, only Nikon knows why. They are referred to as Brite-View screens and that name is still given to current Nikon screens.
 
Dwig said:
You can do it, but the very often don't fit properly. The curve of the top condenser lens is not always a match to the curve in the metal frame that it seats against.

The best way to accomplish what you want is:
  1. VERY CAREFULLY remove the elements from the F3 screen's frame.
  2. File or mill off the lifting tab from the F3 screen's metal frame.
  3. Re-insert the elements into the F3 frame
This modified F3 screen can now be used in an F or F2. The later, brighter F3 screens, those with the red dot, will cause any TTL metering F or F2 to misread slightly. The easiest fix is to use one of the "screen correction" indexes when setting the ISO. Simply set up a blank white card and meter with both the old F2 screen and the new F3 screen to see what adjustment is necessary, likely 1/3-2/3 stops.
Click to expand...

With a F2 "A" and F2 "B" screen frames I did not experience any interference when upgrading either a F3 "K" or "E" into the above mentioned F2 frames. Pretty much a straight forward exchange.

The brightness of a Red-Dot screen to me is definitely an upgrade.

Cal
 
Calzone said:
With a F2 "A" and F2 "B" screen frames I did not experience any interference when upgrading either a F3 "K" or "E" into the above mentioned F2 frames. Pretty much a straight forward exchange.

The brightness of a Red-Dot screen to me is definitely an upgrade.

Cal
Click to expand...

Usually matching screens and very similar screens will interchange between F3 frames and F2 vintage F/F2 frames. Any screen where the focal length of the thick glass condenser lens differs will not interchange well. The G and H series are problems and the "antique" F screens, with their different Fresnel lens may or may not be.

Back in the day when I ran camera stores and did minor service repairs and modifications, I encountered a few situations where the screens wouldn't interchange well. It's something you need to keep an eye out for.
 
One thing to note about the Red Dot screens is that they are optimized for use with lenses of about f/2.2 and slower with regard to being able to view your depth of field. This is the same issue we have now with the screens on cameras like the D3 etc. The screen's scattering angle is such that when using a lens faster than what the screen is made for, your focus can be a crapshoot, if you're not using a split-prism. If you use the matte field Red Dot screen and a 50mm f/1.2, your zone of focus won't be apparent due to the scattering angle and you'll be focusing just a little bit longer. Worst case scenario, you'll find sharp focus wide open anywhere between the DOF range of the lens closer to f/2.8. I used to demonstrate this with my D3 which is why I got a coarse grit screen from a Canon. They still support ultra fast lenses in their digital line and the Ec-B screen is made to focus their 50s and the killer 85mm super speed lens.
This isn't saying that you'll ruin the focusing ability of your camera, you just won't be able to see your depth of field and could possibly miss focus at very fast apertures when retrofitting the screen.

Phil Forrest
 
Phil_F_NM said:
One thing to note about the Red Dot screens is that they are optimized for use with lenses of about f/2.2 and slower with regard to being able to view your depth of field. This is the same issue we have now with the screens on cameras like the D3 etc. The screen's scattering angle is such that when using a lens faster than what the screen is made for, your focus can be a crapshoot, if you're not using a split-prism. If you use the matte field Red Dot screen and a 50mm f/1.2, your zone of focus won't be apparent due to the scattering angle and you'll be focusing just a little bit longer. Worst case scenario, you'll find sharp focus wide open anywhere between the DOF range of the lens closer to f/2.8. I used to demonstrate this with my D3 which is why I got a coarse grit screen from a Canon. They still support ultra fast lenses in their digital line and the Ec-B screen is made to focus their 50s and the killer 85mm super speed lens.
This isn't saying that you'll ruin the focusing ability of your camera, you just won't be able to see your depth of field and could possibly miss focus at very fast apertures when retrofitting the screen.

Phil Forrest
Click to expand...

Phil,

Thanks for bringing this up.

As you know I own a Noct-Nikkor. I tried a Beattie Intenscreen, but while brighter there was also a loss of contrast to the focus snap. Counterintuitively this brighter screen offered no advantage and in fact was a disadvantage with the Noct-Nikkor.

Off topic: the Nikon 45/2.8P AIS is a really great lens to use on a F2 with DE-1 prism. What a compact rig and kinda elegant.

Cal
 
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