'No Name' Kiev....

[Vince Lupo]

I don't venture into this part of the Forum very much (please don't hold it against me!), and haven't seen any threads on this particular subject. I just found a black Kiev 4a 'no name' body for sale, and was wondering if anyone had any info on 'no name' bodies, particularly black ones. I've been reading online that maybe (or maybe not) these bodies were made in Jena, and they are considered to be the 'jewels' of Kiev cameras, but you guys may know better.

Any kernels of wisdom would be greatly appreciated......

 

[newspaperguy]

FWIW - I've never heard of a black Kiev, but aside from that,
any 'real' no-name would have been from the early era of
production - like Kiev IIa . I think you've found some "creativity."

 

[wolves3012]

FWIW - I've never heard of a black Kiev, but aside from that,
any 'real' no-name would have been from the early era of
production - like Kiev IIa . I think you've found some "creativity."

I'll second that. I'm not a Kiev expert but I too thought the "no-name" ones were early. I don't think Kievs were ever black from the factory either. Creativity - yep, that's one way to put it!

 

[xayraa33]

don't waste money on this no name Kiev, a good 4a from 1963 to '64 will be cheaper.

http://www.sovietcams.com/index.php?942714747

 

[Vince Lupo]

I don't think they're early - I think they were made in the '60s.

Yes, I checked out that link, and it's concluding that potential manufacture in Jena is unlikely, though other websites have suggested otherwise. No mention of black ones, though it gives a production figure of 5,000 for 'no-names'.

So are you guys suggesting that they're not collectible 'jewels'?

 

[xayraa33]

I don't think they're early - I think they were made in the early '60s.

So are you guys suggesting that they're not collectible 'jewels'?

They were made in 1963/64, but as the article link in my previous post said, they are just ukrainian Arsenal made Kiev 4a(s)

get any 63/64 Kiev 4a, replace the face plate with a non engraved faceplate and engrave the bottom with USSR occupied Germany and you are in business.
you can put a CZJ Sonnar 5cm f2 to make it look like it came from the first batch.

 

[Vince Lupo]

Interesting -- I learn something new every day. I do appreciate all the input from everyone.

 

[xayraa33]

The first run could have been the brainchild of a western firm that had a load of CZJ Sonnar 5cm f2 lenses to unload and needed a current production body .

Since the real Zeiss Contax IIa and IIIa camera was out of production by 1961/62, Arsenal in Kiev was the supplier of the no name bodies with the misleading bottom engraving.

That is one theory on how these came to be .

 

[john341]

I believed that the no-name Kiev was made in 1963 and were marketed with Sonnar lenses, I believe, for export. Fewer than 6000 were built but black? no. Apart from an interesting commemorative Kiev 4AM Arsenal produced no coloured bodies..any colours you find will have been added later. I had a black Kiev years ago and I thought it looked great!