dont45
Member
I just recieved the email from leica. Details will be on their web site shortly.
To be announced at PMA Las Vegas tomorrow and firmware upgrade 1.201 available Feb 1.
To be announced at PMA Las Vegas tomorrow and firmware upgrade 1.201 available Feb 1.
lemalk
Rebel Without Applause
Damned if you do
Damned if you do
So now if Leica DOESN'T offer an upgrade will we have a deluge of posts that start like this:
"I have to SPEND ANOTHER $6000 on a body when all Leica has to do is UPGRADE my existing M8! WHAT ARE THEY THINKING???!!??
Damned if you do
So now if Leica DOESN'T offer an upgrade will we have a deluge of posts that start like this:
"I have to SPEND ANOTHER $6000 on a body when all Leica has to do is UPGRADE my existing M8! WHAT ARE THEY THINKING???!!??
Photon42
burn the box
their email confirms the web rumor. Funny. I kinda like the concept, even though this upgrade does not really appeal to me.
Richard Marks
Rexel
Got the e-mail also and I have to say the inntial rumour was 100% on details.
I know the initial source of this took quite a bit of flack on this forum. I think a few people may have raised thier blood pressure unnecessarily with somewhat heated interchanges which had little to do with photography.
Personally the most interesting upgrade is the free software. I am not that bothered about the other things. I am quite used to the shutter. The real big question is will the sensor be upgradeable.
Lets all wait and see what happens and not speculate too wildly.
Best wishes
Richard
I know the initial source of this took quite a bit of flack on this forum. I think a few people may have raised thier blood pressure unnecessarily with somewhat heated interchanges which had little to do with photography.
Personally the most interesting upgrade is the free software. I am not that bothered about the other things. I am quite used to the shutter. The real big question is will the sensor be upgradeable.
Lets all wait and see what happens and not speculate too wildly.
Best wishes
Richard
Richard Marks
Rexel
So are you 'in' then?sitemistic said:
J J Kapsberger
Well-known
How often do you suppose will Leica offer these upgrades and how much will they cost? Because if they happen often and at hefty prices, the "Best before: infinity" M8 would be far costlier than skipping the upgrades and just buying a new body every 5 or 6 years, one which has all the upgrades.
Of course that would involve waiting, which sometimes isn't an option.
Of course that would involve waiting, which sometimes isn't an option.
Tuolumne
Veteran
sitemistic said:
SM,
As you have pointed out, Leica is forever stuck with its present M-heritage form factor. If so, then the case always has to look and feel the same, so the M8 case is as good as any new case. All Leica has to do is gut the old "innards" of the M8 and install completely new "innards" to upgrade the beast "forever", as they say. Has anyone looked inside an M8 to see if this degree of modularity is possible?
/T
nicoy3k
Member
I see no mention of a price in the "official statement".
Either way, this "upgrade" system will only work until there is a significant technological break through that will make the m8 obsolete. Which in todays world, is probably sooner than later.
I like the concept. I hate having to upgrade so often in the digital world, but technology moves so fast that its simply not possible to have this upgrade system and actually expect leica to make any money.
Unless, of course, Leica follows its film M tradition and waits 20 years to add "new" technologies like AE to their bodies.
Either way, this "upgrade" system will only work until there is a significant technological break through that will make the m8 obsolete. Which in todays world, is probably sooner than later.
I like the concept. I hate having to upgrade so often in the digital world, but technology moves so fast that its simply not possible to have this upgrade system and actually expect leica to make any money.
Unless, of course, Leica follows its film M tradition and waits 20 years to add "new" technologies like AE to their bodies.
BillP
Rangefinder General
Richard Marks said:
Hear hear.
<listens for the sound of naysayers eating their words>
This is a major departure from the existing digital business model. Leica are making a commitment to their customers unprecedented in recent years. There are so many positive angles to this from a marketing pov, and from a user (as opposed to fondler) pov.
Roll on more details. Exciting times.
Regards,
Bill
V
varjag
Guest
If you think about it, the only real difference between earliest DSLRs and its current crop is electronics. Mirror box, general shape, VF instrumentation, controls are very much the same as they were on film bodies in early 90s.nicoy3k said:
Leica M is not evolving concept, it is a digital RF camera with 1950s viewfinder and exterior. That's its main selling point, and as T says there's not much really aside from electronics to improve.
M. Valdemar
Well-known
There's a Scottish company that makes a turntable called the "Linn Sondek" that's perfected this type of deal to a fine art.
They made a good belt-drive turntable, like 25 years ago or more, then continually released "upgrades" for it at absurd prices, driving the "audiophiles" into a frenzy.
You'd buy the expensive Linn Sondek, then every six months you'd have to get the "dork-whimsy" power supply upgrade, the "valpak bozoid" spring enhancement, the "blather-goon" and "doofus-dittok" tonearm mounting plate, ad infinitum.
All for a hefty fee, and of course, once an "upgrade" came out, all the poor fools without the "upgrade" couldn't sleep nights.
They made a good belt-drive turntable, like 25 years ago or more, then continually released "upgrades" for it at absurd prices, driving the "audiophiles" into a frenzy.
You'd buy the expensive Linn Sondek, then every six months you'd have to get the "dork-whimsy" power supply upgrade, the "valpak bozoid" spring enhancement, the "blather-goon" and "doofus-dittok" tonearm mounting plate, ad infinitum.
All for a hefty fee, and of course, once an "upgrade" came out, all the poor fools without the "upgrade" couldn't sleep nights.
photogdave
Shops local
I've said it before but it seemed to go unnoticed. Maybe I'm on too many ignore lists?!
Anyway, is it too farfetched to think Leica may come out with a DIFFERENT M digital with different specs at a different price point.
Let's say they bring out a full frame M9 at around $9000. Those who need it and can afford it can buy it, while M8 owners who don't need it or can't afford can instead upgrade their M8 to keep up with current technology.
If Canon and Nikon etc. can have more than one high end digital body at different price points in their lineups, why can't Leica?
Anyway, is it too farfetched to think Leica may come out with a DIFFERENT M digital with different specs at a different price point.
Let's say they bring out a full frame M9 at around $9000. Those who need it and can afford it can buy it, while M8 owners who don't need it or can't afford can instead upgrade their M8 to keep up with current technology.
If Canon and Nikon etc. can have more than one high end digital body at different price points in their lineups, why can't Leica?
Gid
Well-known
The first upgrades won't happen until August 2008 at which point the camera will be about 21 months old which is about par for the course with digital (unless you are an Olympus E1 owner). If the suggested price of 1200 Euros is correct, then you get the camera upgraded for about 25% of the current suggested retail (in the UK). Is this worth it - quote from my email from Leica
Scratch-proof sapphire glass cover for the LCD monitor.
• Noise-optimized shutter with a fastest speed of 1/4000s.
• If so desired, the camera will be picked up at your home and sent directly back to you, without any intermediary stage in the process.
• Health-check and complete adjustment of the camera, testing all its functions.
• Installation of the newest relevant firmware.
• New factory warranty of two years covering the same conditions as for a new camera.
Basically a new camera with new warranty and a few upgrades for 25% of the original price - I think that is not a bad deal. Its enough for me to back off from selling it
Scratch-proof sapphire glass cover for the LCD monitor.
• Noise-optimized shutter with a fastest speed of 1/4000s.
• If so desired, the camera will be picked up at your home and sent directly back to you, without any intermediary stage in the process.
• Health-check and complete adjustment of the camera, testing all its functions.
• Installation of the newest relevant firmware.
• New factory warranty of two years covering the same conditions as for a new camera.
Basically a new camera with new warranty and a few upgrades for 25% of the original price - I think that is not a bad deal. Its enough for me to back off from selling it
etrigan63
Rangefinder Padawan
Ok, I had to blog about this. Read it here. The implications of this are staggering. Leica has just set the digital camera economic model on its ear. But then this follows the philosophy that one does not buy a Leica, one invests in Leica.
nicoy3k
Member
Might be a good idea for Leica to offer two m8s for non current owners.
A basic current M8 for a lower price, and a more expensive M8 that is introduced every time an upgrade occurs. When an upgrade happens, the current M8 is replaced by the last upgraded model.
A basic current M8 for a lower price, and a more expensive M8 that is introduced every time an upgrade occurs. When an upgrade happens, the current M8 is replaced by the last upgraded model.
Tom Diaz
Well-known
Gid said:...
Basically a new camera with new warranty and a few upgrades for 25% of the original price - I think that is not a bad deal. Its enough for me to back off from selling it
Basically I agree with you. I think I must have bought one of the first M8s in the Boston area, and I have been fairly happy with it despite the need for a factory upgrade and all the kludges with IR/UV filters and so on. It takes fabulous photographs with the Leica lenses.
I have felt since before I bought it that Leica should offer this kind of upgrade policy or guarantee, and I did not expect it to be free.
I'm not sure this particular set of features is worth the money to me but I will at least give it some thought. A quieter shutter would be nice. I might actually miss the 1/8000, though, because for some projects I like to shoot at very large apertures and not worry about overexposure.
I will watch to see what is the upgrade price and what are the real limits of this strategy. For instance, one fine day there will be an improved sensor, maybe even so improved you don't need all those freakin' filters. I am not sure that such a major upgrade as that would be 25% of the price of a new camera, but obviously I would be better off if there were any substantial discount. I really care about this, because I can foresee the day when I will stop using my film cameras and will then need two digital RFs to do what I do. If I can get a major discount bringing up the old M8 to something like current specs, that would be great. Leica should be thinking about how it is going to make me happy when that happens. If they are moving in that direction, good for them!
Uh... by the way, I acknowledge this may all be a hoax. So far, I have received an email that looks like it's from Leica support, but it could be a forgery. However, it still would be a good idea for Leica to consider!
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infrequent
Well-known
money
money
so i guess i was on the money ; )
http://rangefinderforum.com/forums/showpost.php?p=737657&postcount=124
also what is this "anger", "frustration" is everybody complaining about? last i checked rumours are still rumours until confirmed, and a **** website is a **** website regardless of the reputation of the dealer. can you please stop being so precious? and not get your panties in a twist when somebody actually raises valid points?
money
sitemistic said:
so i guess i was on the money ; )
http://rangefinderforum.com/forums/showpost.php?p=737657&postcount=124
also what is this "anger", "frustration" is everybody complaining about? last i checked rumours are still rumours until confirmed, and a **** website is a **** website regardless of the reputation of the dealer. can you please stop being so precious? and not get your panties in a twist when somebody actually raises valid points?
Kim Coxon
Moderator
Let's please try to keep this thread on the posibilities of an upgrade to the M8 and not about criticising each other.
Kim
Kim
veraikon
xpanner
Leica send a newsletter to their M8- customers in Germany (not to me I am not a M8-owner but it is available on a public place (Text + source below.)
As far as I can read from the letter it the upgrade is not a subsitiute for a MX (X = 9 or 8-2) but an independant customer service feature for those who like the features....
Viel Lärm um nichts
I am not a M8-owner but it is available on a public place (Text + source below.)As far as I can read from the letter it the upgrade is not a subsitiute for a MX (X = 9 or 8-2) but an independant customer service feature for those who like the features....
Viel Lärm um nichts
http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/forum-zur-leica-m8/44595-es-ist-so-weit.html
palker
Established
M. Valdemar said:
Bugger now I see the similarity .. I also had a Linn Sondek, together with a Naim 42/110 (upgraded to 42.5 ha ha) amp and or course a pair or Linn Kans .. ya ya ya .. it just goes to show once a sucker always a sucker.
But sad as it may be .. I saw the difference.
I also just got the e.mail with the Upgrade Offer .. well I'll take the firmware upgrade .. and decide later about being without my camera .. becuase all those Linn and Naim upgrade were dealer jobs and not sending it away.
Bon Chance.