Not happy with my first rolls...

J

Jobin33

Established
Local time
4:07 AM
Joined
May 17, 2011
Messages
71
I recently made the switch to 100% film. I understand there is a huge learning curve to shooting/developing film but I would like some opinions on the quality of my images. I am only looking for quality of image suggestions, I am not posting any photos that I claim to be amazing composition/content wise. Many of my photos appear to be very high in contrast and have large grain. I am shooting with HP5 and developing myself with Ilfolsol. Because my account does not allow me to post photos, if anyone has time my flickr link will be below. Again, I am very unhappy with the quality of my photos and am looking for suggestions from the experienced. Thanks in advance!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/elliottckhull/page2/
 
A few initial questions:

Can you describe how you developed the film in detail (times, temperture, how you agitated the film, etc)?

Can you describe how you metered (if you did) these shots?

How did you scan?

Initial thoughts:

It looks like your darks are near black and your whites are blown out. The lack of detail and tones in the darker areas suggest underexposure. The blown out whites suggest over development. If you underexpose and try to get more detail back when you scan by lightening your darks, you get a bunch of grain. It looks like that may be part of what you're seeing.

Did you by any chance apply (or did your scanner automatically apply) sharpening? If so, start by turning it off as it will make it harder to see what your starting point is. Many of your photos look soft. Is it possible that your focus is off (or that you are shooting at low shutter speeds)? Sharpening a blurry image can cause a sort of plastic look.

At least in my experience, HP5 is a slightly more grainy film than most. What you are seeing looks far beyond regular grain though.
 
I see some water marks, scratches, and some dust. Is this your first time? If so, it is not too bad. How did you get it in the tank? Where and for how long did you dry it? Fixer? Use tap water to rinse? Anything else as part of rinse?
 
Thank you for the wonderful response. I am still learning to scan as well. I am using the Plustek 7600. I will try scanning again and making sure sharpening is off and go from there. I am processing using the Ilford recommendation of 9 minutes for Ilfolsol at 1:9 ratio http://www.ilfordphoto.com/Webfiles/200629163442455.pdf I agitate using standard procedure (5 seconds every 30 seconds.) Temps of liquid is approx. 68*.

I metered these shots using the internal meter on my M6. I am beginning to think that the problem with these images are within scanning presets I have yet to alter. Unless my viewfinder is off, all shots were taken in focus as seen by my eye.


Brian Legge said:
A few initial questions:

Can you describe how you developed the film in detail (times, temperture, how you agitated the film, etc)?

Can you describe how you metered (if you did) these shots?

How did you scan?

Initial thoughts:

It looks like your darks are near black and your whites are blown out. The lack of detail and tones in the darker areas suggest underexposure. The blown out whites suggest over development. If you underexpose and try to get more detail back when you scan by lightening your darks, you get a bunch of grain. It looks like that may be part of what you're seeing.

Did you by any chance apply (or did your scanner automatically apply) sharpening? If so, start by turning it off as it will make it harder to see what your starting point is. Many of your photos look soft. Is it possible that your focus is off (or that you are shooting at low shutter speeds)? Sharpening a blurry image can cause a sort of plastic look.

At least in my experience, HP5 is a slightly more grainy film than most. What you are seeing looks far beyond regular grain though.
Click to expand...
 
I agree with what Brian says above, but before starts blaming the scanner it's interesting to find out how you are developing your film. Don't worry, most people's first negatives are so so :D
HP5 is a film with big latitude so the high contrast might come from the scanner or from you tweaking too much in lightroom or whatsoever (if at all). How the negatives look to you - crystal clean or not so clean? What fixer you are using?
 
The water marks were some of my first rolls before I had any Photoflo. The scratches are probably from me attempting to load film on to the reel. I load the reel in complete darkness in a closet by the way. I use Kodak fixer I believe. The dust, scratches and other marks are probably a result of my clumsiness. My stop bath is running tap water at 68*. Again, I think scanning my be my problem...

I appreciate the responses!


carlcox said:
I see some water marks, scratches, and some dust. Is this your first time? If so, it is not too bad. How did you get it in the tank? Where and for how long did you dry it? Fixer? Use tap water to rinse? Anything else as part of rinse?
Click to expand...
 
If you are accustomed to digital, film grain may be an unpleasant surprise.
It's film grain. It's supposed to be there. It's not like digital which looks plasticaly smooth by comparison.
 
On top of the other factors mentioned, does the scanner think these are colour negs? I see colour shades in them. Just a thought.
 
Jobin33 said:
Thank you for the wonderful response. I am still learning to scan as well. I am using the Plustek 7600. I will try scanning again and making sure sharpening is off and go from there. I am processing using the Ilford recommendation of 9 minutes for Ilfolsol at 1:9 ratio http://www.ilfordphoto.com/Webfiles/200629163442455.pdf I agitate using standard procedure (5 seconds every 30 seconds.) Temps of liquid is approx. 68*.

I metered these shots using the internal meter on my M6. I am beginning to think that the problem with these images are within scanning presets I have yet to alter. Unless my viewfinder is off, all shots were taken in focus as seen by my eye.
Click to expand...

I would suggest you to try changing things one by one, so you can isolate the error in the process.
You can take it from:

Ok:
Developing 6:30 min @ 20C (for 400 ASA)
Stop bath (I use simple water) for 1 min.
Fixing - if Ilford Rapid Fixer - around 12min.
Rinsing - 15min.

If again the same try agitating 6-7 times per minute.

if again is the same try fixing for 15min.

But before that make REAL CONTACT SHEETS (the bigger the better ( 10x15 for example) and check how it looks. Than compare with the scanner.
 
I don't know anything about Ilfosol, but I have shot lots of HP5 and Tri-X, both of which I develop in D76. I think ID-11 is like D-76. When I see too much grain, I usually think exposure might be the culprit, usually over-exposure. Failing that, I would think reticulation, caused by one of your chemicals being too cold. They must all be close to the same temperature. I also notice lots of spots in the pictures. Maybe you need a drying closet of some kind to minimize dust.
This is laboratory work. You must be very precise in your work habits, never changing more than one variable at a time. I also agree that there are lots of exposure errors and softness in the images. Practice (without film) shooting while holding the camera utterly still. After 40 years of this stuff, I still work on my camera handling skills, and recently changed my grip altogether.
All of this takes time and practice. LOTS of time and practice. Keep at it!
 
Ilfosol is a bit grainy. I don't often use Ilford products as they are not so easily found here in Japan. For finer grain, you might try Microphen, or Fuji Microfine.

I simply use Tri-X and D76; both are commonly available, inexpensive, and D76 is easy to mix and use. When used at stock solution, the mixed developer can be kept for several days (I have tried it after three weeks and still got good results). 1 liter of stock solution is enough to develop 10 thirty-six exposure rolls of film.

Make sure that you developer is completely dissolved before you use it. I mix mine in a glass pitcher so I can verify there is no undissolved powder floating around. Also, make sure you use the proper amount of wetting agent (photo flow or drywell), and don't mix it or agitate it, you don't want it to get foamy or sudsy.
 
I will try all of the above. FIRST I will run some through the scanner again and be sure any presets are turned off. Also, I am usually only fixing for a minute, you mention 12 minutes which seems like a huge difference.

taskoni said:
I would suggest you to try changing things one by one, so you can isolate the error in the process.
You can take it from:

Ok:
Developing 6:30 min @ 20C (for 400 ASA)
Stop bath (I use simple water) for 1 min.
Fixing - if Ilford Rapid Fixer - around 12min.
Rinsing - 15min.

If again the same try agitating 6-7 times per minute.

if again is the same try fixing for 15min.

But before that make REAL CONTACT SHEETS (the bigger the better ( 10x15 for example) and check how it looks. Than compare with the scanner.
Click to expand...
 
In order to exclude the possibility something is wrong with this camera/lens combo (meter or focussing) it might be a good idea to shoot a roll of slide film and bring it to the lab. Slide film is often also more easy to scan. If you get good results it was definitely your dev process. If it's as bad as before, it's either your camera or your scanning (scanning could then be checked by ordering a decent lab scan of one of the photos).

That's how i'd proceed before i developed the next roll by myself. Just a thought, as I know how frustrating all this hassle is without the reward.
 
Fixing for only a minute is probably a problem. Your negatives may not be as clear as they should which would cause all sorts of difficulties scanning. Check the fixer you are using for recommendations but I'd expect 5-10 minutes.

I haven't used your developer but found HP5 to be fairly contrasty until I started shooting it at a lower iso (~250). I wouldn't make that adjustment yet but its worth doing a search on flicker for your film/developer pair to see if you can get a sense of the average tones and grain people are seeing with it. Throw the word 'minutes' in and you can see shots with some dev info (ie http://www.flickr.com/search/?ss=2&w=all&q=Ilfosol+hp5+minutes&m=text ) Be sure to note if you're looking at 35mm or 120 images. Gut feeling from skimming a few pages, this looks like a grainier, higher contrast pair than others developer/film pairs.
 
Didn't read that before: 1 min fixing is definitely not enough. I usually use 8-9 minutes. after 1 you most likely haven't reached the clearance point. Would explain the muddy scans imo. Don't you have any old negatives or slides you can scan for a comparison?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom