Ok, would-be customs cheats...

Dante_Stella

Dante_Stella

Rex canum cattorumque
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So for the people who are perpetually asking to undervalue items or declare them as gifts (this seems to me almost every other thing I try to sell on RFF) -

- Does it occur to you that if you ask sellers of items to do dishonest things that those sellers are going to regard you as dishonest?

- Do you realize that there are civil and criminal penalties in the U.S. for falsifying export forms? Or that a lot of us work in regulated industries where we are not going to put licenses in jeopardy (to any degree) for the sake of saving you a buck?

- What's your basic problem with following the law in your country or paying your taxes?

I regard paying taxes and duties to be a "cost of doing business" wherever you live. Those taxes and fees pay for things like national health care, comprehensive social welfare systems, and/or really good educational systems.

Dante
 
I do not cheat or ask others to. The risk isn't worth the pennies it saves, and I just don't think it's right to do.

I'm not Simon Pure and don't pretend to be. I just try to abide by the law.
 
Dante_Stella said:
So for the people who are perpetually asking to undervalue items or declare them as gifts (this seems to be almost every other thing I try to sell on RFF) -

- Does it occur to you that if you ask sellers of items to do dishonest things that those sellers are going to regard you as dishonest?

- Do you realize that there are civil and criminal penalties in the U.S. for falsifying export forms? Or that a lot of us work in regulated industries where we are not going to put licenses in jeopardy (to any degree) for the sake of saving you a buck?

- What's your basic problem with following the law in your country or paying your taxes?

I regard paying taxes and duties to be a "cost of doing business" wherever you live. Those taxes and fees pay for things like national health care, comprehensive social welfare systems, and/or really good educational systems.

Dante
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I personally don't ask that. I understant the reason of paying taxes. But once I made a trade (lens for lens, no cash involved, thus - no value declared). I had the evidence it was a trade. Customs guys checked the average value of the item in question on ebay (whatever came on first page) and taxed me based on that. It did not feel right... (because the price I paid was zero - it's a trade). Although technically they were probably right, but there is always a common sense, even when we talk taxes. Just a rant...
 
Dante_Stella said:
...

I regard paying taxes and duties to be a "cost of doing business" wherever you live. Those taxes and fees pay for things like national health care, comprehensive social welfare systems, and/or really good educational systems.

Dante
Click to expand...

Keep your regards to wherever you live.
No import taxes on photography items where I'm. http://www.photoprice.ca/article/duty-on-camera-equipment.

BTW, where I'm taxes are heavily misspend in terms of healthcare and education system.

Cheers, Ko.
 
photomoof said:
It may not feel right, but taxes are based on value. When I inherited part of our family farm, the county still wanted real estate taxes based on the value, not what I paid for it, which was zero.:)
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I still think that a trade case is debatable - the item I received in trade has the value, yes, but so it has the value an item I have sent for repaid and got it back. However in this case (repair) I don't pay the tax.
 
I find it being an excellent way of curbing any GAS tendencies, knowing that I have to calculate 35% on top of what I pay on the item. :D

And yes, it is obvious that one should play by the rules, I think.
 
35% would be fine. I pay 60%, and that only if the item is below 200 USD. If not it goes to a professional Customs firm and I get soaked by at least 200 USD to start with. That's why, my dear.

That said I have never asked for non-honest qualiifications. Yet I do not like being stolen.
 
This is not a rant, but an observation. I had to sell a lot of cameras a few years back. I stopped listing for outside the USA because buyers routinely demanded that I mark the item as a gift. It felt weird that I had to explain in my listing that I would not lie on the forms. Additionally, my disclaimer was routinely ignored anyway. I had too many long discussions with buyers who were angry with me even after my notice in the listing. I was typically threatened with negative feedback - for obeying the law!

Added to the 1-in-3 chance that the buyer would find some imaginary fault and demand a partial refund, I was glad when I no longer had to sell anything. I'm a good ebay buyer -since 1996. I don't care to sell. So many dishonest cheats out there. Sad really.
 
julio1fer said:
35% would be fine. I pay 60%, and that only if the item is below 200 USD. If not it goes to a professional Customs firm and I get soaked by at least 200 USD to start with. That's why, my dear.

That said I have never asked for non-honest qualiifications. Yet I do not like being stolen.
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I'd be upset at those tax rates also. But not at the eBay seller. He or she is not the one cheating you.
 
Ko.Fe. said:
So what.
If you don't want these requests simply specify your views and believes on taxes in the listing.
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Why should I have to remind people to act ethically and legally? Why not head every ad with "don't steal, don't lie, don't kill, don't run red lights, don't abuse animals"?

It's not my tax protest.

Dante
 
photomoof said:
It may seem debatable to you, but the law is not the way you want it to be.

This is not about paying an income or even a VAT tax, this is a tax solely based on the value of the item being imported. What you paid has no bearing on the value of the item.

You can protest the value as being too high based on sales, of course.

In the US (and I imagine elsewhere) barter is still not completely settled, but that is about income tax, not about import tax.
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I know that's the law. But this law is debatable to me (not the fact that they should have taxed me). Every law has to make some sence. Sometimes it does not. Would I won the very same item in the auction at the low price (below market value - which happens from time to time), I would not have paid that import tax (or not that high) although the market value would be the same. Where do you see the logic?
 
FWIW, it is the BUYER who is putting himself at risk. There are no export taxes anywhere I am aware of, so the country from which the item is exported generally will not care whether the declarations are correct.

Nonetheless, even if I were a seller inclined to dishonesty as long as there is no personal risk involved, I still wouldn't under-declare any value, as the transport insurance will only refund the stated value if the parcel is lost...
 
sevo said:
FWIW, it is the BUYER who is putting himself at risk. There are no export taxes anywhere I am aware of, so the country from which the item is exported generally will not care whether the declarations are correct.
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The seller who falsifies a customs declaration runs several risks.

The item could be seized, they could be forced to pay a fine, in extreme cases they might even be charged with a crime (unlikely but possible).

By circumventing ebay rules, they also could lose ebay protection in case the sale goes bad.

The seller is being asked to take risks to be a nice guy for the buyer. Risk, but no reward.
 
I routinely mark items at low value as I prefer the buyers receive the gear instead of corrupt customs or postal workers.

A $100 item isn't tempting, an item in the $1000+ range is a different story.

Not every customs official or postal carrier is a thief but the buyer and seller don't get to choose.

All it takes is one bad experience...
 
maybe one more reason for this phenomenon is Internet. people see what others did pay for item x, and feel its their greedy politicians fault they don't get same price. so screw the laws :p

am not buying/selling outside my region anymore, just because the hassle with customs.
 
Ko.Fe. said:
Keep your regards to wherever you live. No import taxes on photography items where I'm. http://www.photoprice.ca/article/duty-on-camera-equipment. BTW, where I'm taxes are heavily misspend in terms of healthcare and education system. Cheers, Ko.
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<respectful rant>
Careful - my children received first class education (not totally funded by taxes!) and health care in Toronto. My daughter is now employed by TDSB, contributing to the social fabric and gladly paying her taxes.

ALL government funding systems are subject to misspending. But they are also capable of great good. "Heavily misspend" is a matter of opinion. </rant>
 
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