OT: NY Times "Younger people...have never had a viewfinder experience."

[bmattock]

I misses those rotary phone, I used one in 1986, at our apartment building's security post. Can't recall any mental picture of having one at home, but I bet we had one before...

Still have one in my home. I can't use it to call any automated systems, however. Can't press 'one' on a rotary phone.

That Sony R-1 (so whatever it is called, that replace the F828) is as close as it gets, without the interchangeable lens.

I've been reading impressive things about the DSC-R1. Hope the price drops at some point.

Tried it once, the EVR still lag, and I don't like the manual foucs. Maybe a EVR with split-image or even forst ground glass effect in the future?
LOL...

Kodak is working on OLED technology for the EVF that looks much better than LCD. The Konica-Minolta A2 had a very high-rez EVF (900K+ pixels as I recall), but it was not repeated in subsequent models.

FWIW, OLED may well represent a major breakthrough when it is finally ready for prime time. Some MF digi backs use it - some digicams use it. Not too popular at the moment, life span issues.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oled

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

 

[John Camp]

>>In some ways, the suggestion is being made that people are changing in a rather fundamental way. For one thing, we are waaaaaay beyond what Edwin Land originated - instant prints. A minute? A minute? We haven't got a full minute, what are you, insane? We want it now! Now, now, now! And cheap! And now! Did I mention cheap?

In other ways, the changes may even be phyisical - I kid you not! I read a news item not long ago that suggested that kids today, due to the required use of the thumb in gaming as well as using the ubiquitous 'Blackberry' PDA was leading to a reprised functionality for the prehensile thumb. Not just 'opposable' but 'prehensile' like a monkey and his tail.<<


The psychological changes are even more striking. A few months ago, a friend sent me a night-sight video taken (apparently) from an army helicopter in Iraq. Two iraqis, apparently insurgents, were ditching an RPG or possibly an anti-aircraft missile in a field for later use. They apparently didn't know that they could be seen from the chopper, or even that the chopper was there. There is some chatter back and forth about the targets, and then the Iraqis are simply blown to pieces (with their truck) with, apparently, a 50-cal or an automatic cannon. The bizarre element was the remoteness with which the helicopter gunner acted: the whole thing looked anfd felt exactly like a video game, and nobody got more excited about killing two men that you would in a ***boring*** video game. I mean, I've seen people **way** more excited by a video game than these guys were actually killing a couple of people...It makes you wonder what the guys in the helicopters think. If one of these Iraqis had managed to aim the missile at the chopper and fire it, would somebody have simply and calmly said, "Game over?"

JC

 

[RML]

This latest generation is also growing up with a much better eye-hand coordination than mine, not to mention they are already being trained in very intricate problem-solving on the fly. This gaming generation is on its way to become the true bionic (without the bionics) man. Ever seen athletes train these days?

 

[kbg32]

When you are using an electronic viewfinder or LCD for a camera with a movie mode, is what you see on the camera's display a replay? In other words, is it a real time display?

For what it's worth, our local constabluary use Polaroid cameras at the crime scene.

It is real time.

 

[visiondr]

Hmmm, hold your digicam at arms length and you get camera shake. So, we invent a system to eliminate/reduce camera shake... what's next, someone blinks during a picture and we paste on open eyes later?... oh yeah, we already do that with P-shop.

Photography as a craft is dead... long live photography

Ron

 

[Fedzilla_Bob]

Hmmm, hold your digicam at arms length and you get camera shake. So, we invent a system to eliminate/reduce camera shake... what's next, someone blinks during a picture and we paste on open eyes later?... oh yeah, we already do that with P-shop.

Photography as a craft is dead... long live photography

Ron

Actually, the craft has been left to...

the crafty







ahem

 

[DougK]

I refuse to hold my camera at arm's length to take a picture, but because I can twist out the LCD panel, I can use the camera the same way I use my TLR. I still prefer a high-quality optical viewfinder, but there's no way to display a live histogram in one. You win some, you lose some.

EDIT: Interesting articles too, thanks Bill. Maybe camera manufacturers would find more people would use viewfinders if they didn't build viewfinders that suck into the camera, leaving you with no alternative but to use the LCD.

 

[Sparrow]

Seems to me that the technology available at our birth we believe to be “natural” from then until we have children of our own, or achieve that age, we judge developments to be “progress”. Thereafter development is unnecessary or unwelcome; genetic?

 

[RicardoD]

I just used a TLR for the first time this week (Yashica Mat 124G). I really enjoyed how the image in the ground glass really helped me compose the shot. Its a totally different experience than a viewfinder. It reminded me of using my Dads' Sony P&S digicam with its very large LCD screen. That's right, using a TLR reminded me of a Sony P&S which I was exposed to first!

 

[GeneW]

It's getting interesting out there on the street. If I take out my Canon A620, people sometimes notice it in passing but just assume I'm a tourist and don't pay much attention to me. With its swivel display, I can use the 620 Rollei style and just fade into the background and get some interesting shots. It seems nobody takes digicams very seriously. That's a neat cover!

Gene

 

[XAos]

Seems to me that the technology available at our birth we believe to be “natural” from then until we have children of our own, or achieve that age, we judge developments to be “progress”. Thereafter development is unnecessary or unwelcome; genetic?

Hogwash! Although my parents were right about the fact that they stopped making good music. They just got the dates wrong. ;-)

 

[PetarDima]

Hey Bill, how are you? Petar Dima is here.I have asked you abot rf camera with quiet shutter+speed lenses, remember? You said, Yashica Lynx 14 will be fine ... These days something wonderfull hapened to me.About two months ago, George S and the other people from RFF have sent me over 40 rolls of film ... big help for me! Few days ago wonder happened again -Fuji 5200 - my first digital camera in my hands! It's a present, too!( my pay is small...).
First - I was shocked, after looking at viewfinder! What is this?But, a friend who gave me a camera wrote in e-mail - read about Alex Majoli - he is photographer from your story. If somebody want to see something really strong, look hes photos. He is rangefinder photographer too... used to shoot with Leica M, he found himself in P&S cameras( Olympus C-5060) - compact, lightweight,with small lenses - perfect tool for street.I hope that some day cameras like that will give less high ISO noise and better photos, like every rf camera+good film. And of course, bright, optical viewfinder for old fashioned photographers, please!
And of course,

 

[remrf]

My digital has a mode that covers the lcd and flips the image to the viewfinder. After just a few days I found I rarely use the lcd on the back. Old school I guess. I'm just used to using the viewfinder....

And I can chimp in private. 😀

Sort of anyway. The "review" mode only works on the lcd but I have the camera set to give me a short preview of the last shot through the viewfinder. You can't shoot fast this way but if I think I'm going to need speed I would not use the digital anyway. My Minolta x-700's both have motor winders and the better of the two runs a couple of frames a second at its highest speed.

 

[Dfin]

Eyelevel viewfinders, film cameras, rotary dial phones! Ah nostalgia it an`t what it yous to be. Technology marches on ,rolling over everything in its path. I agree we want it cheap, we want it NOW, But Yesterday would have been better. Never mind the quality, look how fast and cheap it is!!!

 

[bmattock]

Hey Bill, how are you? Petar Dima is here.I have asked you abot rf camera with quiet shutter+speed lenses, remember? You said, Yashica Lynx 14 will be fine ... These days something wonderfull hapened to me.About two months ago, George S and the other people from RFF have sent me over 40 rolls of film ... big help for me! Few days ago wonder happened again -Fuji 5200 - my first digital camera in my hands! It's a present, too!( my pay is small...).
First - I was shocked, after looking at viewfinder! What is this?But, a friend who gave me a camera wrote in e-mail - read about Alex Majoli - he is photographer from your story. If somebody want to see something really strong, look hes photos. He is rangefinder photographer too... used to shoot with Leica M, he found himself in P&S cameras( Olympus C-5060) - compact, lightweight,with small lenses - perfect tool for street.I hope that some day cameras like that will give less high ISO noise and better photos, like every rf camera+good film. And of course, bright, optical viewfinder for old fashioned photographers, please!
And of course,

Ah, that's who it was, Alex Majoli! Thank you, I was wracking my brain trying to remember!

http://www.robgalbraith.com/bins/multi_page.asp?cid=7-6468-7844

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

 

[bmattock]

Eyelevel viewfinders, film cameras, rotary dial phones! Ah nostalgia it an`t what it yous to be. Technology marches on ,rolling over everything in its path. I agree we want it cheap, we want it NOW, But Yesterday would have been better. Never mind the quality, look how fast and cheap it is!!!

When I was in high school, my dad gave me a pawn-shop wonder, a Canon FX slr, circa 1964. This was in 1979, and I was embarrassed - it was OLD!

Now, it is one of my favorite and often-used cameras. And I'm glad - it's OLD!

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

 

[Ambiguity]

I'll speak up, being that i'm what I'm sure all of you consider a "kid". 🙂 I'm 21.

That being said, I prefer my Yashica or Argus over my Rebel or my EOS 3. Any day. Hands down. They both have their applications, but for the kind of art photography I love doing... Rangefinder all the way.

You guys are right about the younger generation developing the use of thumbs, etc beyond what you would normally see. Being a child of the Playstation (years ago), I find even myself being inclined to use a thumb for things that would be just as easy to do with a finger. *shrugs.

 

[bmattock]

It's not that we oldsters don't *want* to use our thumbs for more than just gripping as opposable digits are wont to do. It's actually that we *can't.* We didn't grow up doing it, and now we're not wired that way.

Best Regards,

Bill Mattocks

 

[DougK]

I never really thought about it before, but I do use my thumbs a lot. Too much Atari and Nintendo while growing up, I suppose. However, give a middle-aged manager a Blackberry and I'm willing to bet they'll rewire their neural pathways in a hurry. I've seen it happen, much to the detriment of my email box at work....

 

[richiedcruz]

This is such a coincidence. I was flipping through the latest issue of Pop photo while buying motorcycle magazines at Barnes and Nobles and saw a test for an add on viewfinder for film cameras.

Apparently it is a digital camera that hooks onto your viewfinder and allows old cameras to become chimp friendly 😛

Richie