JonasYip
Well-known
Well, just wanted to follow up on my previous thread wherein I described the failure of my out-of-warranty R-D1 and whether Epson would/could fix it. That's this thread:
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32209
Since my failure seemed to be something mechanical, I decided to bypass Epson altogether and dropped by my local RF expert repair place (Steve's Camera in Culver City, http://www.stevecamera.com) and let him have a shot. He had never seen an R-D1, and I explained that he most likely would not be able to get any parts or info out of Epson, although possibly CV parts would work. Anyway, he took it, and one week later I have a working R-D1. More importantly, I have the *same* R-D1 back instead of some random new body from Epson. It took $350 worth of labor to do it, however.
Turns out that he didn't need any parts to repair it. So that was good. But he pretty much had to disassemble the entire camera to get to the area that needed repair. I didn't get the exact details, but mechanical piece related to the solenoid involved in shutter cocking was preventing the shutter from actually cocking.
He took pictures of the whole disassembly and reassembly process and gave me a CD of the images... I'll include some of the gory shots here. I'd say that he's probably pretty familiar with the inner-workings of the R-D1 now. He said that in general if anything goes bad mechanically there's a good chance he can fix it. Electronic problems are a different issue, ... but I would expect that anyway. So if, say, your LCD or sensor fails, you're probably better off sending it off to Epson and seeing what the Black Hole spits out
Anyway, so there is hope for keeping these things alive, even if Epson abandons us. Oh, Steve also adjusted the RF and cleaned the CCD while he was at it, so all in all my R-D1 is looking good.
j
http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32209
Since my failure seemed to be something mechanical, I decided to bypass Epson altogether and dropped by my local RF expert repair place (Steve's Camera in Culver City, http://www.stevecamera.com) and let him have a shot. He had never seen an R-D1, and I explained that he most likely would not be able to get any parts or info out of Epson, although possibly CV parts would work. Anyway, he took it, and one week later I have a working R-D1. More importantly, I have the *same* R-D1 back instead of some random new body from Epson. It took $350 worth of labor to do it, however.
Turns out that he didn't need any parts to repair it. So that was good. But he pretty much had to disassemble the entire camera to get to the area that needed repair. I didn't get the exact details, but mechanical piece related to the solenoid involved in shutter cocking was preventing the shutter from actually cocking.
He took pictures of the whole disassembly and reassembly process and gave me a CD of the images... I'll include some of the gory shots here. I'd say that he's probably pretty familiar with the inner-workings of the R-D1 now. He said that in general if anything goes bad mechanically there's a good chance he can fix it. Electronic problems are a different issue, ... but I would expect that anyway. So if, say, your LCD or sensor fails, you're probably better off sending it off to Epson and seeing what the Black Hole spits out
Anyway, so there is hope for keeping these things alive, even if Epson abandons us. Oh, Steve also adjusted the RF and cleaned the CCD while he was at it, so all in all my R-D1 is looking good.
j
Attachments
JonasYip
Well-known
Oh, wanted to add one thing. There has been speculation previously as to whether the R-D1 has the same shutter assembly as the Bessa R2, etc. Apparently it does not. He said that the Bessas seem to have a really bad shutter (decidedly not robust) but that the R-D1 shutter seemed much better.
j
j
IGMeanwell
Well-known
JonasYip said:
Well that's good news ... should mean the shutter life should be pretty decent
The amount of electronics that are packed into that thing is quite amusing; I could totally see how any repair person would get overwhelmed by such a site.
iml
Well-known
Great stuff.
Ian
Ian
Paul T.
Veteran
To me, this is good news. It demonstrates an independent repairer can handle more than mere RF adjustment. I am guessing an independent repairer might also be able to solve issues such as wonky framelines too (which afflict my camera). So far these issues seem to make up the bulk of R-D1 problems, which means there is at least some prospect of an afterlife for our cameras.
pfogle
Well-known
Does anyone here have the clout/contacts to find out what unit Epson are using for the shutter? It must be off the shelf from *somebody* and I'd dearly like to know that spares are available if required.
Terao
Kiloran
Are we sure its not an R3A shutter? The Bessa R2 was a mechanical shutter remember - only the A bodies went electronic (so that they could offer AE in the body...)
Terao
Kiloran
Scary pictures! Although I'm more scared by the intricate clockwork bits than the electronics, probably unlike most people here. I'd love to have the skill to do such fine assembly/disassembly work, camera repairers are true craftsmen...
saxshooter
Well-known
Jonas, thanks for posting this. It would be great if the next person on this forum who had a similar problem out of warranty can send it to the same place, perhaps the shop couuld gradually become the place to send troubled RD-1 cameras in the states!
Sparrow
Veteran
pfogle said:
I seem to recall reading when it first came out that Seiko made the shutter, but I’ve just looked it up and can’t find the reference now, so I could have dreamt it.
it would make sense as Epsom is a Seiko subsidiary.
jim_buchanan
Established
Just a little background on Steve's Camera. This is the long time Rudy Liggs Leica Repair that I first visited around 20 years ago. Rudy was a german craftsman that had a (US) states wide reputation. He got the fast shutter speeds accurate on my M3 ds when no one else could.
I believe the current owners were apprentices of Rudy.
They are definitely in my address book.
I believe the current owners were apprentices of Rudy.
They are definitely in my address book.
ampguy
Veteran
great stuff! thanks!
JonasYip
Well-known
I have a picture of the shutter assembly as well. It says "Copal" on it. I'll post that when I get to my computer... uh, the one that has the pictures on it, that is. Perhaps someone versed in camera anatomy can identify it.
j
j
Ben Z
Veteran
jim_buchanan said:
Is that Steve Choi? I've heard that name in conjunction with Leica repair with good testimonials. Yes it would be great if there was someone in the US who knew his way around these things. I'm sure DAG could also. I have heard almost no reports about electronic failures in the RD1, just mechanical, so that's maybe good news.
fgianni
Trainee Amateur
Considering the failure rate of the R-D1 shutter (also my first R-D1 suffered from shutter death) I find difficult to believe that there are worse shutters around. Still I really hope I'm wrong.JonasYip said:
The really good stuff is the fact that someone beside Epson managed to repair the damn thing, maybe my R-D1 has more life ahead than I thought.
JonasYip
Well-known
fgianni said:
I don't know if he was referring to the shutter itself (i.e. the blades, perhaps?), or the entire assembly. In my case the shutter itself did not fail, but rather some part of the winding/cocking mechanism.
But you're right, there have been a lot of R-D1 shutter related failures, some also around 3000-4000 frames like mine. So there's *something* decidedly not robust here. Anyway, I guess it doesn't really matter which part fails: any weak link that turns your camera into a paperweight is bad.
In that regard, I asked Steve whether I'd be coming back to him every 4000 frames or so with the same problem. He said most likely not, and if it did fail in the next 3000-5000 frames bring it back and he'd take care of it (i.e. under guarantee).
j
fgianni
Trainee Amateur
Now we only need someone our side of the pond that can do the same. Sending the R-D1 in the US for repair can be expensive if customs decide to tax the camera for its full value on its way back.JonasYip said:
JonasYip
Well-known
pfogle
Well-known
I don't know much about the mechanics of cameras, but Copal has been a solid name in shutters for more than 50 years, so I'm happy to have one in my camera!
tmessenger
Established
Thanks for the photos Jonas, these will help out if I ever have to get into the shutter.
Tim
Tim