Overexposing Film

[RFOBD]

Hello all,

I have read several times on this forum that people suggest overexposing C-41 35mm film by a slight bit to get the best results from it. My question is, when I bring my film to the lab, do I tell them to develop it as if it was shot at whatever speed I shot it at or do I just have them develop it at the actual film speed?

Excuse my ignorance of how these labs actually develop film. I would much rather develop it myself but I don't have the space yet so I usually just shoot C-41 color or chromogenic black and white.

Thank you.

 

[tripod]

Don't tell them anything. They should process it as normal.

 

[rich815]

No just develop normally and tell them nothing. I regularly shoot NPZ with the camera set to 640, NPH at 250, and sometimes 100 or 200 speed color films at 50 or 160...

 

[RFOBD]

Thanks for the quick responses.

I was a little confused because I shot a roll of Fuji Reala 100 at 80 and had it developed as normal and most of the pictures are slightly overexposed. Maybe Reala doesn't overexpose well?

 

[Roger Hicks]

Thanks for the quick responses.

I was a little confused because I shot a roll of Fuji Reala 100 at 80 and had it developed as normal and most of the pictures are slightly overexposed. Maybe Reala doesn't overexpose well?

That's just bad (= lazy) printing. You should get excellent results even at a stop over.

Extra exposure on C41 normally gives better tonality and a bigger cushion against underexposure (= better tonality again), and finer 'grain' (dye clouds) at the price of reduced sharpness.

Extra exposure on conventional B+W generally gives better tonality but coarser grain and reduced sharpness.

Cheers,

R.

 

[RFOBD]

That's just bad (= lazy) printing. You should get excellent results even at a stop over.

Extra exposure on C41 normally gives better tonality and a bigger cushion against underexposure (= better tonality again), and finer 'grain' (dye clouds) at the price of reduced sharpness.

Extra exposure on conventional B+W generally gives better tonality but coarser grain and reduced sharpness.

Cheers,

R.

Thanks for the explanation.

I actually didn't get any prints, just had the negatives developed and a CD of the scans. Could it be the scanners fault?

I was just a bit surprised because the pictures were from a Yashica GSN and I've heard such praises for its meter. Maybe I just am not used to how it meters compared to my old film SLR and digital cameras. The slight overexposure was only really seen in bright, outdoor photos. The overexposure indicator did not go off either.

 

[Keith]

That's interesting what Roger says about overexposing C41 to reduce the risk of underexposure. When I used to use BW400CN exclusively for black and white underexposed shots were often throw aways. No amount of post processing could make them look half decent ... very little shadow detail and poor contrast!

I always assumed C41 was touted for it's forgiving properties regarding exposure latitude ... it would seem not!

 

[lZr]

My observation leads me to overexpose for color negative film and slightly underexpose for slides, or lower the ISO by 1/2 stop for negatives and raise the ISO by 1/2 stop for slides

 

[Roger Hicks]

Thanks for the explanation.

I actually didn't get any prints, just had the negatives developed and a CD of the scans. Could it be the scanners fault?

I was just a bit surprised because the pictures were from a Yashica GSN and I've heard such praises for its meter. Maybe I just am not used to how it meters compared to my old film SLR and digital cameras. The slight overexposure was only really seen in bright, outdoor photos. The overexposure indicator did not go off either.

Hmmm.... The fact that they're on a CD doesn't stop them being 'prints', in a sense. I'd be inclined to ask for a re-scan or a re-print of the CD.

Yes, a scanner can have trouble in seeing through excessive density but a commercial scanner should be able to see through even grossly overexposed negs: think of a single-use camera...

When I worked in advertising in the 70s we used to tell the account execs to set their meters at half the ASA (as I think it still was in those days). They really loved this 'professional' trick as there were almost no scrappers among their negs.

Neg films (colour or conventional) have enormous latitude for overexposure but almost none for under-exposure, for the simple reason that ISO speeds (and all others before them) are based on the minimum exposure required to give a decent exposure. You might find this interesting (ISO speeds):

http://www.rogerandfrances.com/photoschool/ps iso speeds.html

and possibly even this (density)

http://www.rogerandfrances.com/photoschool/ps neg density.html

Cheers,

R.

 

[btgc]

Electro is weird beast. It works if it works. You haven't said anything about if it's serviced and if used before. If it comes directly out of grandmas drawer, small part inside which is critical for correct exposure ("POD", every Electroshooter knows this term 🙂) may need be replaced . Your symptoms aren't very typical, though POD is No1 to check.

I normally expose Reala at ISO50 and it didn't burn out even in harsh midday light in India. If your GSN is supposed to be technically OK, try exposing at bright daylight at nominal ISO. I noticed that Superia200@125 on very sunny day sometimes balanced on "almost gone". Finally, that 40y.o. cameras ARE allowed to have some quirks, at least I wouldn't ask from them same precision as from current cameras. Btw my Electro's 35 meter (pre-GSN) isn't very sensitive in darkness, so I rely on it as on daylight shooter. So if anything fails, just learn your sample (huh, cameras wearing same badge don't work all exactly same way) and enjoy this nice camera.

And agree to previous posters: print or scan is sticky way to check exposure. Either negative (harder way) or slide have to be checked to be sure.

 

[RFOBD]

Electro is weird beast. It works if it works. You haven't said anything about if it's serviced and if used before. If it comes directly out of grandmas drawer, small part inside which is critical for correct exposure ("POD", every Electroshooter knows this term 🙂) may need be replaced . Your symptoms aren't very typical, though POD is No1 to check.

I normally expose Reala at ISO50 and it didn't burn out even in harsh midday light in India. If your GSN is supposed to be technically OK, try exposing at bright daylight at nominal ISO. I noticed that Superia200@125 on very sunny day sometimes balanced on "almost gone". Finally, that 40y.o. cameras ARE allowed to have some quirks, at least I wouldn't ask from them same precision as from current cameras. Btw my Electro's 35 meter (pre-GSN) isn't very sensitive in darkness, so I rely on it as on daylight shooter. So if anything fails, just learn your sample (huh, cameras wearing same badge don't work all exactly same way) and enjoy this nice camera.

And agree to previous posters: print or scan is sticky way to check exposure. Either negative (harder way) or slide have to be checked to be sure.

It was bought serviced and everything - POD replaced. I doubt it's the cameras fault because of this and the reputation of the person I bought it from.

I'll run a few more rolls through it and try my best to look at the negatives (I have no real means of doing this other than looking at it with a light source from behind) before I do anything else.

 

[infrequent]

thats my standard practice with c41 film...overexpose by a stop for the best results. if i need the speed, then its the box rating.

but finding a lab with a technician who knows his stuff is another story.

 

[RFOBD]

Sounds right...especially with the only reasonably priced ones being the 1-hour drug stores.

I'll come back here if I'm still having problems after a few more rolls have been run through it.

I plan on getting a film scanner (inexpensive one) to cut the cost of scanning at the lab and, hopefully, I'll get more consistent results.

Thanks for all your help...keep the suggestions flowing.

 

[btgc]

It was bought serviced and everything - POD replaced. I doubt it's the cameras fault because of this and the reputation of the person I bought it from.

Right, slight everexposure isn't typical symptom of rotten POD so I just asked to know for sure. I read my notes on first roll with Electro and seems that my sample on bright sun doesn't need going over box speed.

Interesting what your research will reveal.

 

[RFOBD]

Okay, here are some samples from the latest roll from the camera. For the most part everything looks a lot better. It could also be that I'm not used to the look of this Kodak film (usually I use some cheap Fuji Superia but I don't like it with skin tones).

Do these look normal considering the lighting conditions?

 

[Teus]

Extra exposure on C41 normally gives better tonality and a bigger cushion against underexposure (= better tonality again), and finer 'grain' (dye clouds) at the price of reduced sharpness.

Extra exposure on conventional B+W generally gives better tonality but coarser grain and reduced sharpness.

ahaa, very useful to know. I'll quote this in my "make me appreciate color film" thread. maybe my color negs looked so poor because they were exposed accurately

 

[RFOBD]

Giving a bump...hoping more people are on now.

 

[hans voralberg]

Well isnt what important is they look normal to you ? Certainly look good to me. What film did you use, Portra i guess.

 

[bigdog]

Reala 100 is my go to color film on sunny days when there is high contrast lighting and it is a wonderful film. Reala is a low contrast film and normally I shoot at 50 to bump up the contrast. I think it may be a workable choice for the shooting conditions you have above but you have many stops of light to cover from your shadows to highlights in your samples. I think you may be expecting too much for any film to properly handle not blowing out the high lights or losing shadow detail with such high contrast light.

 

[uhligfd]

The "prints" of your film look too thin, too light in color. But that is not your exposure fault. It is the lab scan!

Labs often - who knows why - do not like to print the full pallet from black to white, but only from middle brown to light yellow, so to speak.

It really is a shame.