Panasonic Lumix DC-S1/R

[Samouraï]

(What I believe are) the first fruits of the L-Mount alliance are borne: Panasonic's Lumix S1 L-mount cameras and S-series lenses are now available for pre-order (April 4).

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/promotion/14889/p-announcement-02012019.html

A number of lenses and accessories are available for pre-order as well.
What do you think about the prices? How do you think Sigma and Leica will slot into this?

DC-S1R (47.3mp)
$3,697.99

DC-S1 (24.2mp)
$2,497.99

50/1.4
$2,297.99

70-200/4
$1,697.99

 

[jsrockit]

I just can't get that excited about another me too mirrorless FF camera with one lens for $5000+...

though a 5.76M-dot EVF is pretty nice...

 

[Samouraï]

I find these prices a little exorbitant for a freshman entry into a crowded market. The Panny 50/1.4 is priced the same as the new Canon 50/1.2, which already seems a bit rich (but is exotic enough to be dismissed as an outlier).

The original Sony A7/R and 55/1.8FE pairing seemed to hint at a future with world class image-making in a sensible package at a reasonable price. I'm surprised by how the market looks right now. Sigma will have to save the L-mount with relatively affordable glass, but I doubt their Foveon camera will be any cheaper than Panasonic's.

 

[CMur12]

I'm still struggling to wrap my mind around digital photography, so I may have this all wrong, but my impression is that new high-resolution sensors require higher-resolution lenses than film did, resulting in more complex, more expensive lenses.

It appears that mirrorless cameras, with their superior auto-focus, are helping to make this practical. Hence, the new high-resolution, very expensive lenses from Nikon, Canon, and Panasonic with their new mirrorless cameras.

- Murray

 

[Samouraï]

Sigma's 50/1.4 is under $1000 and is as high resolution as any 50 on the market. The Sony 55/1.8FE is also under $1000 and is comparably sharp, flat-field, it's still a really special lens.

And when curved sensors are introduced, we'll see (fixed?) lenses that are simple and inexpensive to manufacture.

 

[michaelwj]

Thom Hogan had a bit to say on these cameras that I found interesting. His take was essentially that it is for their high end movie customers to move down into more than for their m43 customers to move up to.

I think once Sigma start to film in the lenses at more affordable prices (this is the cheapest L mount 50) a few DSLR folk *might* move that way rather to a smaller Nikon/Canon/Sony mirrorless camera, assuming the AF is up to snuff.

On the whole though, is it a sign of things to come? Manufacturers filling increasingly small niches to try to get a foothold?

 

[emraphoto]

I just can't get that excited about another me too mirrorless FF camera with one lens for $5000+...

Amen to that

 

[Ko.Fe.]

Odd prices for nothing special lenses.
Canon 50 1.4 and 70-200 f4 L are under 1K$ for two.
And Canon 6D is half price of S1.

 

[Archlich]

I find these prices a little exorbitant for a freshman entry into a crowded market. The Panny 50/1.4 is priced the same as the new Canon 50/1.2, which already seems a bit rich (but is exotic enough to be dismissed as an outlier).

The original Sony A7/R and 55/1.8FE pairing seemed to hint at a future with world class image-making in a sensible package at a reasonable price. I'm surprised by how the market looks right now. Sigma will have to save the L-mount with relatively affordable glass, but I doubt their Foveon camera will be any cheaper than Panasonic's.

Talking about the price being "reasonable"...I remember when the 55/1.8 first came out at $999 people thought it was crazy.

So perception do, and will always change over time.

 

[Archlich]

Odd prices for nothing special lenses.
Canon 50 1.4 and 70-200 f4 L are under 1K$ for two.
And Canon 6D is half price of S1.

Did the same argument apply to the SL...?

 

[CMur12]

Odd prices for nothing special lenses.
Canon 50 1.4 and 70-200 f4 L are under 1K$ for two.
And Canon 6D is half price of S1.

We won't know that they're "nothing special lenses" until they're tested.

The Canon 50mm 1.4 is a holdover from film days. It may well not be up to the task of a high-resolution sensor.

I have a Canon 5D Mk II, which is a nice camera, my first digital, and I'm still struggling to learn its ways. 😱 The finder is dim, however, and I'm thinking that a potential advantage of an EVF would be a brighter finder and easier manual focusing for aging eyes such as my own.

- Murray

 

[nickthetasmaniac]

The bodies look good. I’ve always liked how Panasonic does UIs and the EVFs look great.

But the lenses/prices... I don’t get it.

 

[michaelwj]

But the lenses/prices... I don’t get it.

Photographers: “we want edge to edge perfection without in camera corrections”

Lens manufacturers: “no problems, here is your 2kg, $2000 50/1.4”

Photographers: “can you make it smaller lighter and cheaper like the old 50’s”

Lens manufacturers: “sigh”

 

[leicapixie]

It seems to me another great camera..
But with dwindling sales (Phone cameras),
It's the Leica business concept.
"Less for more".
When SLR arrived it was said "More expensive because of mirror box".
Now removing that "mirror box" we have more expensive cameras and lenses..
The lenses prices going up like space rockets into a new dimension..

 

[Ko.Fe.]

We won't know that they're "nothing special lenses" until they're tested.

The Canon 50mm 1.4 is a holdover from film days. It may well not be up to the task of a high-resolution sensor.

I have a Canon 5D Mk II, which is a nice camera, my first digital, and I'm still struggling to learn its ways. 😱 The finder is dim, however, and I'm thinking that a potential advantage of an EVF would be a brighter finder and easier manual focusing for aging eyes such as my own.

- Murray

Sorry, 50 1.4 is ASPH. So, here is no limit on digital.

All I need to use is in my DSLR VF and all I need to change is in physical controls and in VF, not in the menus.
And personally, I'd rather take my 500D oVF over any eVF. Not to mention my 50D MKII which is perfectly fine.

But it looks like eVF is new optical aid... I know several photogs who were not able to use oVF anymore and only eVF was allowing them to see it again.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

Did the same argument apply to the SL...?

SL is overpriced, lame copy of A7 series. Where is no any other reason to buy any Leica made non-M camera, but status of the label. IMO.

 

[Lss]

Where is no any other reason to buy any Leica made non-M camera, but status of the label. IMO.

Well, performance with M lenses is one thing. What appears an excellent user interface is another. And for SL (definitely around its time of release), the quality of the EVF is yet one more.

There are reasons.

The prices of course are difficult to handle for regular folks. I don't know whether I would have liked the SL. But I sure would have loved to try it. I still hope to find the solution that ticks those three boxes. Will wait more information on Panasonic as well as next SL.

 

[nickthetasmaniac]

Photographers: “we want edge to edge perfection without in camera corrections”

Lens manufacturers: “no problems, here is your 2kg, $2000 50/1.4”

Photographers: “can you make it smaller lighter and cheaper like the old 50’s”

Lens manufacturers: “sigh”

Fair point. I guess as with most current releases, I’m just not the target market... Smaller, cheaper and less corrected would be fine with me. Likewise I’d be happy without the ultra-high res sensors that make such lenses necessary.

 

[michaelwj]

Fair point. I guess as with most current releases, I’m just not the target market... Smaller, cheaper and less corrected would be fine with me. Likewise I’d be happy without the ultra-high res sensors that make such lenses necessary.

To be honest, I don't think anyone here is their target market. We're special.

 

[bayernfan]

any speculation/information on how the S1 is going to handle wide-angle M-Mount lenses? In the same league as the Leica SL?