Photoshop

Bill Pierce said:
How do you feel about that? I think its a strong argument for Capture One.
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Absolutely. I'll be dusting my old CaptureOne license and see if I can upgrade to the latest. I'll keep Photoshop CS6 for those things I need it for, which is usually for advanced processing.

If there's a product out there that would allow me to catalog my photos like I do right now with Lightroom, and allow me to process them via CaptureOne (or other similar program), I'll ditch Adobe.

It is absurd I'd have to pay $49.99 a month for a product that is no longer a product, but a monthly privilege.

Even Android apps that are purchased are a one-time affair, easily archived and reinstalled if you (the owner) need it in a different device.

This "cloud" bidness is a bad bidness when applied to things it was not meant to be used for. For example, with Windoze 7 you cannot install gadgets anymore, because M@crohard decided to turn off "the cloud" for it, and instead says, giddily:

Because we want to focus on the exciting possibilities of the newest version of Windows, the Windows website no longer hosts the gadget gallery.
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This online "convenience" is now an inconvenience. And we're all to blame for not demanding tangible sources.

Cyber-based offerings without a hardcopy are a bad bad bad idea for the consumer. They're great (wonderful!) if you're profiting from it, though. The alchemists had the wrong idea about creating gold out of a turd: hard cash out of cybervapors is where it's at!
 
sevo said:
Why would I care? The speed of improvement has slowed - for the past four or five versions there haven't really been any compelling new features other than the forced obsoletion of not making new ACR versions available for old PS versions.

I've owned Photoshop 2, 3.5 (in the SGI version only), 4, 7 and CS3 - and PS is the piece of Adobe software I have upgraded the most (I have only upgraded Illustrator once in twenty years). That is, I have skipped more than two out of three updates. Even if the pricing keeps the same, a subscription model would triplicate my cost.
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Fair enough, the subscription model does not make much sense for you.

I never tried the SGI version unfortunately, I used to love my Indigo2 and also had regular use of an O2 a few years back.
 
Shoot film.

Print in the dark.

And remember that you don't own any Adobe software (or s/w from most other manufacturers), even if you bought a nice box in a shop. It was always just a users licence which can be revoked by the manufacturer.
 
I think it's actually fairly understandable from Adobe's perspective why they are taking this route. Having said that, it seems they have acknowledged the feedback on the potential of a photographers bundle with PS and LR and are exploring the possibility.

http://blogs.adobe.com/photoshopdot...t-photoshop-cc.html#JustPhotoshopAndLightroom

If this comes to fruition and is reasonably priced, it could make sense from our perspective too.
 
MartinP said:
And remember that you don't own any Adobe software (or s/w from most other manufacturers), even if you bought a nice box in a shop. It was always just a users licence which can be revoked by the manufacturer.
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Maybe in the US. But positively not in the EU - here, you have transferable, non-expiring ownership rights to any piece of boxed software you bought.
 
sevo said:
Maybe in the US. But positively not in the EU - here, you have transferable, non-expiring ownership rights to any piece of boxed software you bought.
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Same in the US except there may be limiitations on transferability in certain cases. For example student versions can't be sold or otherwise transferred.
 
Perhaps "revoke" was not the right word - screw-up might be more accurate.

See how long you can use the old software when the next version (or next-but-one) of the product (and camera support) is incompatible with the one you have so that no one can ever use the files together, or the new operating system will no longer install the libraries you need to open the software, or an 'upgrade' tests for an add-in which is now deemed to break the licence and shuts down your software, or a licencing dongle simply fails in some way such that your software believes it must not start, or the auto-check decides there is another copy somewhere using 'your' serialnumber and so blocks both programs' licence-validation routines, or the validation check goes to an ip-address which is no longer in use because your old software is no longer updated to check the new validation-site details, or the manufacturer goes broke. Etcetera, etcetera.

What one might hope is the case in ones use of the software really has historically frequently been 'disappointing', when seen over a long period, though I don't mean just for Adobe with these examples of course. I think Sevo mentioned that, in the EU, we "own" software that is purchased - one has a licence to use it but we do not own it, and the transferability is (frequently) restricted in the licence based on pricing deals, bundling, national standards for crypto etc.
 
I just spoke with our Adobe rep at an IT "open house" that we were holding on campus. They, of course, claimed a significant savings, until I pointed out the $200 price for CS6 vs. $20/month (for now, going up to $30/month) for the educational version. I also pointed out the enormous feature bloat of their products. They didn't see my point, and stuck to their guns that this was in every way better for the consumer, despite the obvious math problem for the educational buyer. Adobe clearly is completely out of touch with the hobbyist, student, educator and lower-budget professional market.

I pointed out the overwhelmingly negative response to this on the various fora that I read, and they didn't seem to care.

Arrogant and stupid and out of touch with their customers. This is Adobe's "New Coke" moment.
 
see also Thom Hogan's comments ('Don't Say I Didn't Warn You', May 06, 2013)

One example:
"Personally, I'm wondering what happens when Adobe gets hit with a denial of service hack on the server that checks to see if people are paid for the month. We've already had one instance of a photographer using Creative Cloud who didn't have Internet service (in Antartica) when the software went to check his status and shut him down."

So you're using CC to work on time-critical photos for a client and suddenly.. Whammo!
 
I use CS4 and it works just fine for the types and styles of photographs I make.

Like cameras & computers I find all of this, including software, has reached a point that the changes are small and incremental with each new version.

Perhaps that's why I still like film!
 
I have GIMP and Photoline - which does a better job on recent PSD files than GIMP, but both currently seem to be somewhere at CS2 level, so that all more modern fancy PSD properties (even adjustment layers) tend to get lost or rendered in a rather unexpected way...
 
Adobe makes products which earn the user so much money it is almost impossible for me to imagine them as too costly.
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How about those of us that don't make money with the product?
 
As I am sure you know there are many alternatives priced from free, to under $100, which are more than suitable even for professional use. Aperture for instance is still priced at only $79.
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Right, I do. After LR goes to subscription, which it seems it will, I can change to Aperture. Once Aperture changes to subscription, then what? I mean the reason I use lightroom is that it is familiar wording and ideas to a darkroom and its file system. I would hate to go to a program that isn't as intuitive simply because they want to squeeze every last dollar out of me on a monthly basis. My gripe is with subscriptions and not the cloud / price to be honest. I used to just have to buy a program and upgrade if I wanted to. Now, It'll be subscriptions that cost more over the same amount of time. I'd rather pay and be done...not rent.
 
A terrible thing for rural users. Connection speeds in much of Vermont make email a challenge for many, downloading any kind of software is literally impossible. I recall having to download simple OS updates overnight, and having to do the installation the next afternoon.
 
Just heard back from Adobe, the connection requirement is minimal for the check-in, and stalled or interrupted downloads do not require restarting the download. That's a plus.

We have a good connection now via cable, having moved into town two years ago. Our teenagers have little use for rural living, we had little patience for driving them 40 minutes each way to town.
 
lynnb said:
see also Thom Hogan's comments ('Don't Say I Didn't Warn You', May 06, 2013)

One example:
"Personally, I'm wondering what happens when Adobe gets hit with a denial of service hack on the server that checks to see if people are paid for the month. We've already had one instance of a photographer using Creative Cloud who didn't have Internet service (in Antartica) when the software went to check his status and shut him down."

So you're using CC to work on time-critical photos for a client and suddenly.. Whammo!
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Exactly. Put all your eggs in the Hindenburg Basket...I mean, the Cloud.

I don't like it when tech fads take over CEOs' fancies; they push for something they don't have the technological background to foresee a catastrophe in the making. Like with adjustable rate mortgages, just 'cause everybody's doing it and customers seem to go with it (mainly because there's hardly an option with most people's circumstances and/or they get carried away by the collective drumbeat), anybody pointing out the flaws is called a stick-in-the-mud.

Creative "Cloud" for critical business deadlines is a Very Bad Idea.

Try calling 911 when your VoIP provider gets a DoS attack at that moment. In many places, VoIP is the only option, and out of the consumer's hands.

I'm looking into GIMP and Corel...preparing my migration. Photoshop Elements won't be around for long, once Adobe realizes the money "they're losing" by not switching that client base over to the pure uncut stuff.
 
I don't get the creative cloud fear here. You guys are aware that the software only reports home every few weeks?
You are also aware that no one is forcing you to store your work in the cloud, or run the actual program online?

This deal is a PAYGO for your software plus 20gb online storage-that's it.
How will DoS affect people? I mean unless you choose to store critical work online that is a non issue, most sensible people will work with HD's just as they've always done.

I understand peoples reaction to lease rather than buy, but the angst about the optional use of cloud technology? that mystifies me how do you guys feel about e-mail? or file silo or any online based tech?
How often had DoS stopped you posting here or putting your images on Flickr in the last 5 years?

I just don't get the outrage.
 
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