Pre WWII Zeiss Contax Rangefinders vs Leica Barnack Screw Mounts

[Coldkennels]

I'll wait and see what happens when this roll is finished. If I've got uneven frame spacing and sprocket tearing - which seems like it may be the case based on some of the winding I experienced the other day - then something's definitely off. Problem is I don't even know who could look at it in the UK. We seem to be very short of technicians these days.

 

[Sarcophilus Harrisii]

Maybe. I literally spent a good fifteen minutes trying to load a roll of Fomapan into my Contax II the other day with it slipping and tearing the sprocket holes every time. I eventually gave up and put some bulk-loaded APX 100 into a proper Zeiss cassette and using that instead... and I'm still not sure it hasn't slipped off the sprockets at points during the roll.

I've never had this much trouble with a Barnack - even a lowly Zorki.

If it's that problematic for you (and I'm having trouble understanding how it could be) there is always the option of dispensing with a take up spool and feeding cassette to cassette. It sounds like you are putting too much tension on the film, though. Not necessary. Hold the body in left palm (if you're right handed) with its top canted slightly downwards, film gate facing you; with thumb on rewind knob, snug the film gently down over the sprockets and film rails, and slide the back on. Done.

 

[Sarcophilus Harrisii]

I'll wait and see what happens when this roll is finished. If I've got uneven frame spacing and sprocket tearing - which seems like it may be the case based on some of the winding I experienced the other day - then something's definitely off. Problem is I don't even know who could look at it in the UK. We seem to be very short of technicians these days.

Ed Troszka, perhaps? And if Newton Ellis can't sort it probably noone else can.

 

[Erik van Straten]

Maybe you can try a film spool from a Kiev. Most of them have the lower wheel from the spool partly filed off by one of the former users, so the camera can be closed more conveniently. The filed off part of the wheel must be in the direction of the pressure plate when the back of the camera is put back on. This helps closing the camera enormously.

Erik.

 

[Coldkennels]

If it's that problematic for you (and I'm having trouble understanding how it could be) there is always the option of dispensing with a take up spool and feeding cassette to cassette. It sounds like you are putting too much tension on the film, though. Not necessary. Hold the body in left palm (if you're right handed) with its top canted slightly downwards, film gate facing you; with thumb on rewind knob, snug the film gently down over the sprockets and film rails, and slide the back on. Done.

The problem with not having the film nice and taut before the back goes on is that the film slips off the sprockets too easily. I end up winding on and winding on without the film actually going anywhere. :bang:

I picked up a copy of the first edition of the Contax Way over the weekend. Sat down and read through it yesterday while my laptop and phone went through some security updates and that actually recommends keeping your thumb on the top of the film as you put the back on the camera to stop it lifting off the sprockets. I guess I'll have to try that next time.

 

[KoNickon]

"keeping your thumb on the top of the film as you put the back on the camera to stop it lifting off the sprockets."

I was going to suggest something a little different -- thread the film through the spool and hold a finger on the top of the spool as you wind the film on. This should take the slack out of the film and allow it to engage the sprockets. You may need to trip the shutter and wind on a second time. But then you should be able to slip the back on.

 

[Highway 61]

If I've got uneven frame spacing and sprocket tearing - which seems like it may be the case based on some of the winding I experienced the other day - then something's definitely off.

Uneven frame spacing and sprocket tearing at the same time are, most of the time, caused by a film rewind shaft which has become too stiff (old and sticky grease). With no film in the camera the rewind knob must rotate very, very easily, with no friction which your fingers could feel. It is a very easy DIY job on a Contax.

 

[Larry Cloetta]

I picked up a copy of the first edition of the Contax Way …………and that actually recommends keeping your thumb on the top of the film as you put the back on the camera to stop it lifting off the sprockets. I guess I'll have to try that next time.

I thought everybody did that. No? Anything in life that wants to move when we need it not to move, put your thumb on it. Or your foot if it’s, say, a cat. Until you get the door closed.

 

[micromontenegro]

I LOLed twice in this last page. Priceless!

Coldkennels, I think something is wrong with your Contax. It should be very easy to load.

 

[Highway 61]

Sat down and read through it yesterday while my laptop and phone went through some security updates and that actually recommends keeping your thumb on the top of the film as you put the back on the camera to stop it lifting off the sprockets.

Strangely enough, this is what I do with all my Nikons, not only with my Contaxes. Even with the Nikon F2 and its hinged camera back. I guess I do it with my Rollei 35 as well.

You haven't told us about the way you use a pair of scissors while walking, to load your Barnacks easily and PDQ.

 

[Coldkennels]

You haven't told us about the way you use a pair of scissors while walking, to load your Barnacks easily and PDQ.

As an ardent Barnack user, I've been pre-cutting every roll of film in the house to the longer leader for well over a decade at this point. I mean, I bulk load a good 95% of the film that I shoot, so it's not like it takes any extra time. And they load just fine in non-bottom loaders, too.

Unless they're Contaxes, apparently.

Uneven frame spacing and sprocket tearing at the same time are, most of the time, caused by a film rewind shaft which has become too stiff (old and sticky grease). With no film in the camera the rewind knob must rotate very, very easily, with no friction which your fingers could feel. It is a very easy DIY job on a Contax.

I'm pretty sure I had to do something similar on a Kiev many years ago. You're right, it's an easy job. I'll have a look when the roll's done.

 

[Pioneer]

I cut my film leaders for my Barnacks in the field. My multifunction knife has a pair of scissors and I just count 20 sprocket holes back from the beginning and start my trim cut between sprocket hole 20 and 21. Takes longer to count the holes than it does to trim the film. Certainly doesn't look like I used a straight edge to make the cut but I really don't think the camera cares. I know I don't.

The hardest part of the whole process is remembering which pocket I put the base plate in.

But it most certainly is not as quick as loading a roll in the Contax II. Actually, it is even quicker in a Kiev since the take up spool is captured by a small springy device in my Kiev. It can't fall out and roll around the floor. 😀

I have often wondered how hard it would be to do that in my Contax. A flat spring and a bit of epoxy would likely work well. Hmmm.

 

[Trask]

Maybe you can try a film spool from a Kiev. Most of them have the lower wheel from the spool partly filed off by one of the former users, so the camera can be closed more conveniently. The filed off part of the wheel must be in the direction of the pressure plate when the back of the camera is put back on. This helps closing the camera enormously.

Erik.

I can’t quite visualize what you’re suggesting — if the lower wheel of the take-up spool is filed to have a flat spot (yes?), how can it be “in the direction of the pressure plate?” I’m not getting it, and not understanding how the fact that the lower wheel is filed is beneficial. Thanks, Erik.

 

[Highway 61]

I can’t quite visualize what you’re suggesting — if the lower wheel of the take-up spool is filed to have a flat spot (yes?), how can it be “in the direction of the pressure plate?” I’m not getting it, and not understanding how the fact that the lower wheel is filed is beneficial.

The idea is to have the flattened edge sector of the lower wheel of the take-up spool set parallel to the film rails (and thus to the pressure plate surface) when putting the camera back on, so that the internal side of the camera back doesn't hit the take-up spool lower wheel edge and doesn't bump the whole spool away from where it ought to stay in place at that point of the film loading operation.

I'd say that the original prewar Contax metal take-up spools, as well as the early soviet metal spools marked Киев, of the equivalent excellent built quality as their German models, have narrow enough wheels so that filing them down to benefit from that trick isn't necessary. You can use those metal spools with no problem in a postwar Contax, too.

 

[Erik van Straten]

I can’t quite visualize what you’re suggesting — if the lower wheel of the take-up spool is filed to have a flat spot (yes?), how can it be “in the direction of the pressure plate?” I’m not getting it, and not understanding how the fact that the lower wheel is filed is beneficial. Thanks, Erik.

I'm sorry, I didn't see your post, appearently. Highway however explained it quite well.

The spool has two wheels, yes? The wheel at the side of the "grip" of the spool can be filed down until your file reaches the middle part of the spool with the slots in it. When you now close the camera - with or without a film loaded - you can turn the spool until the part that is filed off is upward (towards the pressure plate when the camera is closed). This helps closing the camera, because when sliding the back of the camera into the body it no longer hits the wheel of the spool, so the back of the camera goes in more easily.

Most of the Kievs used in Russia have this adaptation because the Russians themselves had also problems with loading the camera.

I hope this helps.

Erik.

 

[KoNickon]

I am chuckling at this discussion -- folks saying that they can load a Barnack while hiking (I understood that to mean, while moving), and then I find out "oh well, of course I've pre-trimmed the film leader." That's rather like saying you run the 100 meters faster than Usain Bolt, but fail to mention you have an 80 meter headstart. (Somewhere I have an ABLON clone, but the business card trick works really well for me.)

The loose takeup spool in the Contaxes and earlier Kievs is tricky to use, but having a back that comes off is I think easier to deal with "in the field" than loading a Barnack with no pre-trimming, even using a business card.

But definitely, whichever camera it may be, I'm going to stop and sit down first, and then load the film!

 

[helen.HH]

I really like this photo, Helen.

If you have a chance to try the post-WWII Zeiss Biogon 35/2.8, you should. It’s an amazing optic (assuming the lens is in good condition), with impressive resolving power and that Zeiss pop with color film (it’s great w/ bw too). Alas, there’s no adapter I’m aware of that will allow the Biogon to mount on a Leica camera. But the Biogon can be easily mounted on either a Contax IIa, IIIa, or Nikon rangefinder; I have used my sample of the Biogon on a Nikon S2 and it works fine.

Thank You Steve for the liking and the Biogon/ conrad info !!

 

[johank]

In 1935 Göring became Chief of rearmament in Germany and he issued an Order to Zeiss to make and distribute to all Lensmakers in Germany CZ Optic Benches ASP! So from 1936 quality rose on all optics produced there. Paper can make wounders!.

 

[jorgef2002]

Say fellows ,can I use a Contax lens in a Barnack camera ? Do they make an adapter ?

 

[jorgef2002]

I just got a call from a friend that is into photography, he says that there is a company call Fotodiox Inc over at Amazon that has such adapters,if any one checks it out please let us now I don't know what to look for, what is the name of the Contax mount, I know Leica is L39..